Cranjis McBasketball
Crow T. Robot
Knew what the hell that thing was supposed to be
Peace Love and Nothing But
Posts: 41,969
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Post by Cranjis McBasketball on Dec 8, 2010 18:31:09 GMT -5
I actually read through all 11 pages of this and by the end, here's what I feel.
Who gives a shit?
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Post by Shaun2k5 on Dec 9, 2010 1:09:29 GMT -5
The fact that he has time to shoot off about HBK but can continently ignore Matt/Jeff Hardys obvious problems says more about him than I think he'd like it too.
I'd probably go with Helms if I knew he wasn't an enabling douche.
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Post by ThereIsNoAbsurdistOnlyZuul on Dec 9, 2010 2:21:11 GMT -5
Why does Helms have to be crazy here? Could it be that saint HBK hadn't actually changed all that much? The dude was notorious for being a jackass until he left. Because every indication points that he *has* changed. Helms appears to be reading from the disgruntled ex-WWE employee handbook. 1) Pick a big name (HHH/HBK/Orton for example) 2) Tear them apart via stories that nobody can prove/disprove 3) Call them druggies/accuse them of holding everyone back I am of the camp that people don't change, their circumstances do. So it is possible that Shawn Micheals is still really a jerk. Just learned to hide it better. Or... Shane is friggin' bitter? I dunno. Next time I hang out with them, separately, of course, I will see what really happened.
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"Hollywood" Cactus Matt
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
You couldn't ask for a better custom title!
How do you spell "Goddess"? C-H-R-I-S-T-Y!
Posts: 15,300
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Post by "Hollywood" Cactus Matt on Dec 9, 2010 3:08:11 GMT -5
i loved both hbk's and helms' work in the ring. however i never met either, so i can't judge them as people. so i could care less about this shoot...hbk does seem like an asshole though. apparently a fan asked shawn on his twitter why he wasn't defending himself and hbk said "why should i do anything if ur the ones who are mad?"...seemed like a douchebag thing to say, then again helms called hbk's fans 'retards'.....so in the end they're both assholes. I don't think it's a douchebag thing to say. If someone is calling me names, and I don't really care about their opinion but you do, you can defend me if you want. I really don't care. Make sense?
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Post by Society of the Spectacle on Dec 9, 2010 3:42:35 GMT -5
I've read through a number of these pages and it really seems that each side is using the weakest arguments in the other side to build their case. I'm an HBK guy myself, but I sure as heck am not going to use "well he's more famous a better worker, so it doesn't matter what he does" line of reasoning. However, I think an important point that a poster brought up is being lost in all the mud-slinging. Has Jericho said anything?
We all know that BOTH Jericho and Michaels have some tempers on them. Most people do, and we all let it get the best of us sometimes. Yes Michaels did drugs and let himself BATHE in unprofessionalism back in the day, but there has been very little evidence (note: evidence) to say that he is that same guy now. Who's to say that Jericho was just as much of the argument as HBK was. Why were they arguing? Was it two well seasoned veterans having a disagreement over how things should go, or was it the return of infant terrible Michaels? The fact that Jericho and Michaels worked together again and again, and that both praise each other's work would seem to indicate it was the former.
As for Helms, I think he's just being very "outrageous" for the publicity. So he goes and points out that HBK looked like a prick in an argument. How does it go from that to "oh yeah, he's a hypocrite too! He kills animals." Mind you, I hate hunting, but what Michaels chooses to do in his spare time. If Helms has thoughts about animal cruelty and hypocrisy in religion, there are far and away more prevalent situations to pick apart than Michaels, and even so, his opinion seems slathered in negativity. This isn't just a Helms problem either.
Take Paul London for example. I absolutely love Paul London, his work, and when he isn't high out of his mind, his personality. However, every time he has a camera on him, he ALWAYS mentions Triple H, and he always mentions Matt Hardy, and not in passing, he goes on and on, often resulting in pure pettiness. Now, I'll give him the benefit of the doubt when he talks about an incident like the "creative" decision (according to Hunter) of having Kendrick and him pedrigreed after they ran in to help Hunter, which to this day makes no sense, but even so, it's ancient history now, it's time to move onto bigger and better things. Point being, London who has tons of creative energy and talent should be putting it into more fruitful things than merely bashing people from his past. Same goes for Helms, or any other internet "shooters."
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Post by Brian Suntan on Dec 9, 2010 6:11:50 GMT -5
FWIW, Jericho was talking on twitter about how great it would be to get the greatest that has ever lived in each profession (sport, music, whatever) in the same room. He chose HBK as the greatest ever wrestler..... so they can't hate each other that much.
I've seen nothing yet that suggests Shane just doesn't want some attention.
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randomranter
Dennis Stamp
When you grow up....... YOU'RE GONNA BE WROOOOOONG!!!!
Posts: 4,804
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Post by randomranter on Dec 9, 2010 6:37:13 GMT -5
Here's a question that still remains unanswered.
Some people always claim that "We never hear any backstage stories about XYZ, so they've gotta be a decent person". But whenever someone comes out and has the courage to go on camera and give stories about XYZ, they're written off as bitter, jealous, axe-to-grind, whatever.
Yet wrestlenewzzzzzzzz.com comes out with some anonymous, unprovable story about XYZ that could have just been completely made up, and everybody instantly takes their word for it. Why?
HHH is a prime example. We hear constant newz stories about his backstage politics and everybody writes him off as being the antichrist. A few ex-WWE employees come out and say the exact same thing, and they're bitter never-weres with axes to grind. :confused:
I'm not saying Helms is right or wrong -- I don't know either one of them personally, and as I've said, Helms does have ulterior motives. But if I'm going to believe any stories about a wrestler, I'm going to be more inclined to believe an ex-wrestler with ulterior motives who's at least willing to go on record and give his stories than I am a dirtsheet writer with the exact same ulterior motives who's giving third-hand-stories from "anonymous" sources that may or may not even exist.
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Post by The Dark Order Inferno on Dec 9, 2010 10:53:00 GMT -5
Helms is better placed than anyone on these boards to say how Shawn is backstage, having been in the WWE for many years and, lets face it, Shawn was notorious for his backstage behaviour... However, with that said, Helms has a DVD to sell so the truth undoubtedly lies somewhere in the middle. No person ever changes completely, but no-one can deny Shawn has tried to become a better person, it's just in a competitive environment like wrestling, someone's always going to have one or two bad stories to tell about you.
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Post by Piccolo on Dec 9, 2010 18:59:08 GMT -5
Yet wrestlenewzzzzzzzz.com comes out with some anonymous, unprovable story about XYZ that could have just been completely made up, and everybody instantly takes their word for it. Why? I think it's possible that people aren't addressing this because, like me, they don't buy the initial premise. I see all kinds of dirtsheet stories being greeted skeptically on here. I mean, 90% of every dirtsheet story thread I've ever read has consisted of people finding different ways to say "newz."
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Post by joeskvorecky on Dec 10, 2010 1:38:33 GMT -5
It's interesting: he says great things about Triple H in the shoot.
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Post by spartan on Dec 10, 2010 2:06:51 GMT -5
Ok I have not read all 11 pages of material so if this already addressed I am sorry....but...
he said this HBK/y2j incident happened during the "bigeest push of his career" which is the only reason he stopped himself from hitting Shawn.
His biggest push is without a doubt the Gregory Helms cruiserweight champ. He was on raw briefly before being traded which would put him at the same catering table as HBK but was jericho not our of the company at this point?
could he just be a liar?
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Post by Dr. Bunsen Honeydew on Dec 10, 2010 2:18:51 GMT -5
What could Michaels have said to Chris Jericho that was so disrespectful that Helms wanted to punch him? GO BACK TO TORONTO! I'M FROM WINNIPEG, YOU IDIOT! I am stunned that 6 pages have gone boy and NOBODY took advantage of the easy setup. You crappers are getting lazy ;D
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Paco
Hank Scorpio
Posts: 7,145
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Post by Paco on Dec 10, 2010 6:54:06 GMT -5
he said this HBK/y2j incident happened during the "bigeest push of his career" which is the only reason he stopped himself from hitting Shawn. His biggest push is without a doubt the Gregory Helms cruiserweight champ. He was on raw briefly before being traded which would put him at the same catering table as HBK but was jericho not our of the company at this point? could he just be a liar? To me the biggest push of his career was early 2003. Mini-feud with The Rock. Teaming with Nash & HBK. Facing all members of Evolution. It'd make sense timeline-wise. I mean, being Cruiser Champ in WWE means jack squat push-wise.
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Post by rapidfire187 on Dec 10, 2010 8:43:46 GMT -5
Take Paul London for example. I absolutely love Paul London, his work, and when he isn't high out of his mind, his personality. However, every time he has a camera on him, he ALWAYS mentions Triple H, and he always mentions Matt Hardy, and not in passing, he goes on and on, often resulting in pure pettiness. Now, I'll give him the benefit of the doubt when he talks about an incident like the "creative" decision (according to Hunter) of having Kendrick and him pedrigreed after they ran in to help Hunter, which to this day makes no sense, but even so, it's ancient history now, it's time to move onto bigger and better things. Point being, London who has tons of creative energy and talent should be putting it into more fruitful things than merely bashing people from his past. Same goes for Helms, or any other internet "shooters." Yea but man, London is a bit different here. For one, he has some legitimate gripes about these people and they really do sound like complete assholes when he tells his stories. For two, he's doing this stuff during shoot interviews. If there are people he doesn't like, he's kind of getting paid to talk about them on camera. From watching his shoot with Kendrick I didn't sense that they were bitter at all, but I did sense that they were very frustrated while they were with the company and I probably would have been too in that situation. Anyway back to Helms. Considering the fact that (to my knowledge) he's never badmouthed people before and always seems to be a man of good humor and whatnot, I'm thinking he's earned a little credibility. I'd really like to see what Jericho would say about the situation if he was being completely honest.
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randomranter
Dennis Stamp
When you grow up....... YOU'RE GONNA BE WROOOOOONG!!!!
Posts: 4,804
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Post by randomranter on Dec 10, 2010 9:07:04 GMT -5
I cannot honestly think of a time that I heard the "horror stories" about Trips from reputable news sites. Yeah I seen the stories on the Ryan Clark sights (like today's "Trips badmouths Goldberg, Goldberg sues for millions" from one of Ryan Clark sights) but, nothing from a source I trust. Some individual people on here aren't as bad as others, but as a general rule, people seem to be generally willing to believe stories from dirtsheet writers citing "anonymous sources" that cannot be verified. These people have ulterior motives, everything to gain, and nothing to lose. There is absolutely no way to tell if they're telling the truth, sensationalizing what's being told to them, or just making it all up for web hits. Yet some people have no problem taking their word as gospel. Then you get people like Helms. Yes, they've got their own motives so you've gotta look at what they say with at least some level of skepticism. But #1, they actually worked with and interacted with the people they're shooting on on a daily basis, #2 they're willing to go on camera/tape and speak their minds instead of hiding behind a veil of anonymity, and #3, they're putting any chances of working with WWE again in jeopardy. Yet people are willing to write them off as bitter or whatever, when they're the ones who are taking the risk. Like I said before, if I'm going to believe anybody, it's going to be the latter of the two unless the story is so ridiculous that you know they're BSing. And a story about HBK still being a jerk isn't that difficult to believe. I'm not saying it's true, but really....look at the infamous Summer Slam match to see evidence that some of the old HBK still stirs around in there. And like I said, none of us knows either Helms or HBK, so there's no way for us to know who is and isn't right. Maybe cause they're the only ones willing to talk? We have no idea how many others (if any) are out there who have similar stories to share, but believe that there's a chance of being hired or re-hired by the WWE and don't want to put that at risk.
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Post by itssoeasy23 on Dec 10, 2010 13:51:21 GMT -5
This is seemingly becoming a trend for some reason.
Pick a top superstar. Bash the shit out of him.
Some of these guys, like Helms, Nash and the Hardy's have to be removed from the internet permanitly. They're just making themselves look like asses. It's sad really, becuase their only trying to stay relevant.
Everybody and their grandmother knows that Shawn was a ungreatful, selfish prick in the 90's. Didn't want to job, did'nt wanna lose, did whatever he wanted to do, was a complete asshole and couldn't care less.
BUT
He's changed. That's the point. He got the injury, found God, had a family, and is now retired. He only had the belt once, for a month, since his return, had patched things up with Bret Hart, Vince, and countless other people. He's a changed man. Who cares how he acted in 1996, it's 2010! He's now at home with his family happily retired.
I don't know what he's on about "Shawn shouldn't hunt animals," why, becuase he s a Christian. So, if he was jewish it would'nt matter matter, or Buddist, no, it would not. Look at Stone Cold, he hunts, gonna bash him too Shane?
The whole clan on overgrown babies is getting me sick and tired. It's just sad to see what has amount to guys like the Hardys, and Kevin Nash and Shane Helms.
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