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Post by RatedRKoffee on Apr 14, 2011 1:41:33 GMT -5
I hate this show, both because of the entrapment and because I just find using pedophiles as entertainment to be disgusting and disturbing. Of course what I hate the most about this show is how people are all like "so you support molesting children?" when I talk about hating this show. That said if it saves one child from being abused it has done a good thing.
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Post by alabastergrim on Apr 14, 2011 2:37:10 GMT -5
It's cool if you Don't like the show but it's not entrapment.
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thegigolo
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Post by thegigolo on Apr 14, 2011 2:46:22 GMT -5
We don't know hiis true intentions? Bulls***, I don't care if he shows up or not, you never for any reason talk like that to a child. I don't care if it's through the keyboard, people need to be held responsible for their actions. No, you don't know his true intentions, or if it was even him. Anyone can sit at a keyboard and type garbage they neither mean nor believe. If they had no intentions of anything sexual they wouldn't show up.
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thegigolo
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Leaving the women of the world satisfied one night at a time.
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Post by thegigolo on Apr 14, 2011 2:49:37 GMT -5
If they had no intentions of anything sexual they wouldn't show up. And the guy I was referring to didn't show up. So, the cops went to his house instead and now he's dead Oops, sorry. Misread that, half-asleep. lol
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Post by Slingshot Suplay on Apr 14, 2011 3:03:51 GMT -5
We don't know hiis true intentions? Bulls***, I don't care if he shows up or not, you never for any reason talk like that to a child. I don't care if it's through the keyboard, people need to be held responsible for their actions. No, you don't know his true intentions, or if it was even him. Anyone can sit at a keyboard and type garbage they neither mean nor believe. But with that guy and like most of these guys, it's not like they just had one chat and that was it. Alot of these guys spend alot of time, perhaps over a month chatting with the decoy before they make the decision to go meet. Their intentions are very clear at that point, and the Perverted Justice people build their case on the chat logs that are being recorded. Also, alot of them send pornographic pics of themselves, and it's not like it's just 1 pic and that's it. If that was the case, I could see the argument that it could possibly be someone else screwing around with their computer, but the fact that most of these guys show up negates that argument.
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Post by woodface on Apr 14, 2011 3:52:11 GMT -5
Hold on.............there are people who complain that what this show does is unfair to THE PERVS? ? That's f***ing pitiful.
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Post by willywonka666 on Apr 14, 2011 6:57:14 GMT -5
I don't watch trainwrecks because everyone else does it first of all. I've seen clips of this show, and to me, well the people on it haven't done the actual deed and there is a chance they would back out still. Did they talk to someone they thought was a kid? Yes, but while I'm no expert, I think some of that might be a mental thing. It has to factor in, just like a fetish, it's something psychological as to why grown men are attracted to children. On that side, it could be they need help as much as anything, so if they caught him about ready to do the deed, they should maybe take him to a treatment facility and examine him as opposed to throwing him in the clink with a bank robber. Otherwise it seems like entrapment to me.
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Post by Slingshot Suplay on Apr 14, 2011 7:35:57 GMT -5
I don't watch trainwrecks because everyone else does it first of all. I've seen clips of this show, and to me, well the people on it haven't done the actual deed and there is a chance they would back out still. Did they talk to someone they thought was a kid? Yes, but while I'm no expert, I think some of that might be a mental thing. It has to factor in, just like a fetish, it's something psychological as to why grown men are attracted to children. On that side, it could be they need help as much as anything, so if they caught him about ready to do the deed, they should maybe take him to a treatment facility and examine him as opposed to throwing him in the clink with a bank robber. Otherwise it seems like entrapment to me. Mental thing or not, it's still against the law to do what they're doing. Knowingly talking to a minor in the sexual manner that they do and sending improper photos is where they've already broken the law. Entrapment is constituted by a law enforcement agent inducing a person to commit an offense that the person would otherwise have been unlikely to commit. And the person would not be a victim of entrapment if the person was ready, willing and able to commit the crime charged in the indictment whenever opportunity was afforded, and that government officers or their agents did no more than offer an opportunity. These people have already showed they were willing to commit the crime by their chat logs alone.
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Post by SickFlipPiledriver on Apr 14, 2011 7:36:32 GMT -5
I don't understand why pedophiles are subject to so much more vitriol than say, murderers and serial killers, especially if the rape in question is statutory in nature. I don't mean to say that punishment should be lenient either. You just don't get the same GETTHESONOFABITCH reaction with some objectively worse crimes. Or drug dealers especially, who ruin more lives than just about anyone around - you can say people are choosing to ruin their own lives with drugs but what about their children, their parents, their neighbors? Yet we don't get this attitude of "life is too good for them, I hope someone kills them in prison" like we get with crimes of this nature.
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Post by Red Impact on Apr 14, 2011 8:17:00 GMT -5
I don't watch trainwrecks because everyone else does it first of all. I've seen clips of this show, and to me, well the people on it haven't done the actual deed and there is a chance they would back out still. Did they talk to someone they thought was a kid? Yes, but while I'm no expert, I think some of that might be a mental thing. It has to factor in, just like a fetish, it's something psychological as to why grown men are attracted to children. On that side, it could be they need help as much as anything, so if they caught him about ready to do the deed, they should maybe take him to a treatment facility and examine him as opposed to throwing him in the clink with a bank robber. Otherwise it seems like entrapment to me. It's not entrapment. Just because the thing is a sting doesn't make it so.
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thegigolo
ALF
Leaving the women of the world satisfied one night at a time.
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Post by thegigolo on Apr 14, 2011 9:25:38 GMT -5
Yeah, definately not entrapment if they're the ones engaging in sexual talk.
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Post by YAKMAN is ICHIBAN on Apr 14, 2011 9:28:32 GMT -5
Here's a good example of the related hysteria
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thegigolo
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Post by thegigolo on Apr 14, 2011 9:53:33 GMT -5
Here's a good example of the related hysteria I would say there's a difference from making a video, and talking sexual to a kid AND showing up at the house.
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Post by Mr. Socko's Brother on Apr 14, 2011 11:33:57 GMT -5
So, nobody's answered the question yet of whether the person posing as a kid actually tells the guy that they want to hook up with him and invites him to come over, or whether it's usually the guy who suggests it first.
If it's the guy who suggests it first, then that's one thing. If it's the "kid" who suggests it, that's trying to tempt the guy. And if that's totally legal, it shouldn't be.
I remember seeing an episode of "Law & Order: SVU", which is a show I don't think is sympathetic to child molesters at all, in which a guy who was caught broke down and talked about how he struggled every day, how he tried not to look at little girls, etc. Obviously the guy was dangerous (he'd raped kids) and needed to be kept away from people he'd victimize, but if you have this compulsion that it's damn near impossible to resist even though you know it's wrong (which is how he made it sound), then that says to me that it's more a sickness than it is a conscious choice.
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thegigolo
ALF
Leaving the women of the world satisfied one night at a time.
Posts: 1,043
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Post by thegigolo on Apr 14, 2011 11:34:56 GMT -5
So, nobody's answered the question yet of whether the person posing as a kid actually tells the guy that they want to hook up with him and invites him to come over, or whether it's usually the guy who suggests it first. If it's the guy who suggests it first, then that's one thing. If it's the "kid" who suggests it, that's trying to tempt the guy. And if that's totally legal, it shouldn't be. I remember seeing an episode of "Law & Order: SVU", which I don't think is sympathetic to child molesters at all, in which a guy who was caught broke down and talked about how he struggled every day, how he tried not to look at little girls, etc. Obviously the guy was dangerous (he'd raped kids) and needed to be kept away from people he'd victimize, but if you have this compulsion that it's damn near impossible to resist even though you know it's wrong (which is how he made it sound), then that says to me that it's more a sickness than it is a conscious choice. They state that it's the "kid" approached first. Mostly the accused excuses is "it's an adult chatroom".
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Post by Mr. Socko's Brother on Apr 14, 2011 11:36:57 GMT -5
So, nobody's answered the question yet of whether the person posing as a kid actually tells the guy that they want to hook up with him and invites him to come over, or whether it's usually the guy who suggests it first. If it's the guy who suggests it first, then that's one thing. If it's the "kid" who suggests it, that's trying to tempt the guy. And if that's totally legal, it shouldn't be. I remember seeing an episode of "Law & Order: SVU", which I don't think is sympathetic to child molesters at all, in which a guy who was caught broke down and talked about how he struggled every day, how he tried not to look at little girls, etc. Obviously the guy was dangerous (he'd raped kids) and needed to be kept away from people he'd victimize, but if you have this compulsion that it's damn near impossible to resist even though you know it's wrong (which is how he made it sound), then that says to me that it's more a sickness than it is a conscious choice. They state that it's the "kid" approached first. Mostly the accused excuses is "it's an adult chatroom". Hmm, okay. Sounds like, at the very least, sexual harassment, even if you don't factor in the apparent age of the person approached.
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thegigolo
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Leaving the women of the world satisfied one night at a time.
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Post by thegigolo on Apr 14, 2011 11:38:43 GMT -5
And I beleive it's also illegal to try to seduce a kid online, and send them any kind of porn pictures (To which a lot of them send nude pics of theirselves to the "kid") one guy freaking sent 12 to one he thought was a kid.
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Post by Red Impact on Apr 14, 2011 12:03:37 GMT -5
So, nobody's answered the question yet of whether the person posing as a kid actually tells the guy that they want to hook up with him and invites him to come over, or whether it's usually the guy who suggests it first. If it's the guy who suggests it first, then that's one thing. If it's the "kid" who suggests it, that's trying to tempt the guy. And if that's totally legal, it shouldn't be. I remember seeing an episode of "Law & Order: SVU", which is a show I don't think is sympathetic to child molesters at all, in which a guy who was caught broke down and talked about how he struggled every day, how he tried not to look at little girls, etc. Obviously the guy was dangerous (he'd raped kids) and needed to be kept away from people he'd victimize, but if you have this compulsion that it's damn near impossible to resist even though you know it's wrong (which is how he made it sound), then that says to me that it's more a sickness than it is a conscious choice. As far as entrapment goes, I believe it really doesn't matter if the person posing as the kid says "SO you wanna come over?" It's entrapment if someone is persuaded to commit a crime, not just given the opportunity to. A person who claims entrapment has to be unwilling or unready to do it when the offer is presented. So if an undercover officer is dressed as a prostitute and offers her services to a guy, it's not entrapment if he agrees. It is if he refuses and she keeps insisting. There's a big difference between being unwilling and accepting when someone offers. That's what separates entrapment from not. Just because someone gave them the means doesn't mean they weren't looking to commit a crime.
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thegigolo
ALF
Leaving the women of the world satisfied one night at a time.
Posts: 1,043
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Post by thegigolo on Apr 14, 2011 12:09:38 GMT -5
So, nobody's answered the question yet of whether the person posing as a kid actually tells the guy that they want to hook up with him and invites him to come over, or whether it's usually the guy who suggests it first. If it's the guy who suggests it first, then that's one thing. If it's the "kid" who suggests it, that's trying to tempt the guy. And if that's totally legal, it shouldn't be. I remember seeing an episode of "Law & Order: SVU", which is a show I don't think is sympathetic to child molesters at all, in which a guy who was caught broke down and talked about how he struggled every day, how he tried not to look at little girls, etc. Obviously the guy was dangerous (he'd raped kids) and needed to be kept away from people he'd victimize, but if you have this compulsion that it's damn near impossible to resist even though you know it's wrong (which is how he made it sound), then that says to me that it's more a sickness than it is a conscious choice. As far as entrapment goes, I believe it really doesn't matter if the person posing as the kid says "SO you wanna come over?" It's entrapment if someone is persuaded to commit a crime, not just given the opportunity to. A person who claims entrapment has to be unwilling or unready to do it when the offer is presented. So if an undercover officer is dressed as a prostitute and offers her services to a guy, it's not entrapment if he agrees. It is if he refuses and she keeps insisting. There's a big difference between being unwilling and accepting when someone offers. That's what separates entrapment from not. Just because someone gave them the means doesn't mean they weren't looking to commit a crime. Agreed, after they continue chatting after finding out the age, they're definately willing, and especially after they show up at the house.
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Post by Red Impact on Apr 14, 2011 15:39:16 GMT -5
Not to mention that, yeah, they are tempting them. But "tempting" is an extremely nebulous and vague term. You could argue that they were being tempted even if the "kid" didn't make the first move, just by having someone there posing as a kid.
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