Writing Magneto (and Others) 20 Years From Now

[Stone Cold Eleanor Shellstrop]

One thing I've always wondered about comic books that specifically reference historical events as the basis of a character's identity (Magneto being a Holocaust survivor, Captain America fighting in World War II, Iron Man and the Cold War) is how writers go about trying to update the stories. Comic book stories are often read as being 'here and now' or 'in the not too distant future'. With Captain America, you just keep him frozen in ice for a longer period of time. With Iron Man, you just update the setting and the time period. But with Magneto, his identity is so very much tied to a historical event that a generation from now, he'll be an incredibly old character, over 100. Now, I get that writers could do something like Magneto drinks an anti-aging serum or Magneto gets turned into a baby or something like that. But it's still a creative challenge to stay true to the character's roots but keeping him both current/relevant and actually believable as a character in the present.

[daime]

Simple, they'll clone Magneto so that he's in a younger body but with the same memories and mindset.

[Spankymac is sick of the swiss]

Aug 18, 2012 4:20:35 GMT -5 @daime said:

Simple, they'll clone Magneto so that he's in a younger body but with the same memories and mindset.

Pretty elegant solution, honestly.

[G✇JI☈A]

Might be harder with Magneto.

But more recently that had a simple solution for 'Iron Man' with the Vietnam war. Just make it a more recent war.

I guess they could change Magneto's race to black living in South Africa during Apartheid. But that might be a too big of change for fans to take.

[Deleted]

They've handled Magneto through the whole turned into a baby then turned back to normal thing, since his age is now firmly in whatever the hell it needs to be territory. Maybe about time to bring that up again though.

[Spankymac is sick of the swiss]

Doctor Nemesis is with the X-Men right now, right? Just have him whip up some "de-aging" serum or something.

[Baldobomb-22-OH-MAN!!!]

with Magneto it's particularly problematic because of his friendship with Professor X. I mean if he survived the holocaust, how long after that did he meet Charles, and how much older than Charles was he? that gulf by necessity had to get longer and wider as time goes on. it's easy to move Professor X up the timeline because he isn't rooted in a specific moment in history like Magneto is. and at the same time Magneto's status as a holocaust survivor is so integral to his character that it can't be removed (John Byrne infamously suggested removing it for this very reason and he got in a LOT of shit from others for it). all they can really do at this point is come up with some patently absurd retcon to justify Magneto's vitality like some post-war de-aging process of maybe saying his powers slow his aging to a crawl ala Wolverine, either of which would probably piss a lot of people off. as for me I justify it with a sliding timescale. I ignore any explicit references to "what year it is" and assume that less time has passed in the Marvel universe than it has here. so it's still only the late 70s in the Marvel universe, which also explains why a universe like that doesn't have better technology than we do- they have AMAZING standards of technology compared to what we had in the 70s, and by the time it's the new tens in the Marvel universe they'll have a society that looks like Gene Roddenberry's Star Trek in comparison (assuming one of those bad futures never happens instead). after all, the presence of superpowered beings would lend itself to a very different world than one we have. mind, I also laugh whenever Marvel tries telling me Cyclops is only in his 20s (he's at least 35, and if you believed Emma when she said that one time she was only 27, I have a bridge I'd like to sell you so that's just me. I always figured most of the classic Avengers and X-men characters are in their mid 30s to early 40s, variable from character to character, I have no idea why Marvel insists they're younger than that. I'm 26 and Cyclops and Iron Man both feel way older than I am. Spider-man and Human Torch are probably still in their late 20s though.

[Goldenbane]

Aug 18, 2012 9:44:05 GMT -5 Baldobomb-22-OH-MAN!!! said:

with Magneto it's particularly problematic because of his friendship with Professor X. I mean if he survived the holocaust, how long after that did he meet Charles, and how much older than Charles was he? that gulf by necessity had to get longer and wider as time goes on. it's easy to move Professor X up the timeline because he isn't rooted in a specific moment in history like Magneto is. and at the same time Magneto's status as a holocaust survivor is so integral to his character that it can't be removed (John Byrne infamously suggested removing it for this very reason and he got in a LOT of s*** from others for it). all they can really do at this point is come up with some patently absurd retcon to justify Magneto's vitality like some post-war de-aging process of maybe saying his powers slow his aging to a crawl ala Wolverine, either of which would probably piss a lot of people off. as for me I justify it with a sliding timescale. I ignore any explicit references to "what year it is" and assume that less time has passed in the Marvel universe than it has here. so it's still only the late 70s in the Marvel universe, which also explains why a universe like that doesn't have better technology than we do- they have AMAZING standards of technology compared to what we had in the 70s, and by the time it's the new tens in the Marvel universe they'll have a society that looks like Gene Roddenberry's Star Trek in comparison (assuming one of those bad futures never happens instead). after all, the presence of superpowered beings would lend itself to a very different world than one we have. mind, I also laugh whenever Marvel tries telling me Cyclops is only in his 20s (he's at least 35, and if you believed Emma when she said that one time she was only 27, I have a bridge I'd like to sell you so that's just me. I always figured most of the classic Avengers and X-men characters are in their mid 30s to early 40s, variable from character to character, I have no idea why Marvel insists they're younger than that. I'm 26 and Cyclops and Iron Man both feel way older than I am. Spider-man and Human Torch are probably still in their late 20s though.

The only thing I can think of that might help Magneto most with his World War II origin is maybe saying the Nazis did to him what SHIELD did to Graviton in the cartoon: Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes. Say the Nazis took him, abused the hell out of him, and when they discovered his powers, put him on ice or something...figuring they'll use him later. When the war is over, his body is discovered years later and he's freed. He takes off, and the rest of his origin can be pretty much the same...he travels the world getting reacquainted with the times, meets Charles Xavier, sees the same cruelty done to mutants as what was done to him, ect. Don't know how the fans might react to something like this, though.

[Baldobomb-22-OH-MAN!!!]

it'd be better than other things they'd tried (they actually have done the "Magneto magically restores his youth" plot AND the "Magneto is reborn in a clone body" plot to explain it, and neither really worked). plus it'd be staying true to the character. sometimes I think, as much as people rag on DC for constantly re-setting and adjusting their continuity, in some ways it's good that they try to keep everything steamlined (even though they inevitably f*** it up and have to fix it again). not saying Marvel should Crisis on Infinite Earths themselves, but maybe a book that gives a timeline for all their major events would be a good idea (especially if it included an idea akin to yours to explain away Magneto's continued presence).

[Goldenbane]

Aug 18, 2012 10:01:15 GMT -5 Baldobomb-22-OH-MAN!!! said:

it'd be better than other things they'd tried (they actually have done the "Magneto magically restores his youth" plot AND the "Magneto is reborn in a clone body" plot to explain it, and neither really worked). plus it'd be staying true to the character. sometimes I think, as much as people rag on DC for constantly re-setting and adjusting their continuity, in some ways it's good that they try to keep everything steamlined (even though they inevitably f*** it up and have to fix it again). not saying Marvel should Crisis on Infinite Earths themselves, but maybe a book that gives a timeline for all their major events would be a good idea (especially if it included an idea akin to yours to explain away Magneto's continued presence).

At the end of the day, I do have to admit that Marvel is probably in need of some sort of Infinite Crisis type reboot, but when I look at the current talent running around the place, I just cringe. I don't think there's any strong team at Marvel that could pull off a reboot of their universe. I look at Marvel's own beloved Ultimate Universe, and what a piece of crap that's turned into...and my heart just races when I think of the normal/real/whatever Marvel Universe being forced to go through the same crap.

[Legion]

It doesnt matter.

Marvel time and real time isnt the same thing.

Marvel time is absolutely fine as it is, thanks to the Franklin Richards theory of time retardation.

Franklin Richards, for those who dont know, is the son of Mr Fantastic and the Invisible Woman. He is the most powerful mutant ever to be born and one of, if not the, most powerful figure in the Marvel universe outside of one of the conceptual abstracts.

His powers are that he is essentially god. He can create universes and fundamentally alter the very fabric of reality.

He also knows that when he grows up he has all sorts of problems to deal with as he has met his future self several times. In order to avoid this, he keeps time retarded, this also explains the ages of the people around him, and even goes as far as to explain why no one ever stays dead, as Franklin subconciously brings them back so as to make sure his parents or people he cares for stay alive, or come back if they do die.

All Marvel needs to do is a story confirming this, rather than leaving it as sensible fan theory and viola, everything solved.

If they ever, EVER rebooted or Crisis'ed or whatever, I'd drop everything they put out.

I did it for DC and I'd do it here as well.

[Baldobomb-22-OH-MAN!!!]

it's like I said, there's really no reason to reboot (there was no reason for DC to either, but well, here we are). what they should do, is maybe a handbook or a codex of some kind that irons out the timeline. it'd go a long way to explaining what war Tony Stark was kidnapped in, how old Magneto is and how a holocaust survivor can still be vital in 2012 (I really like that "put on ice by the nazis for a while" idea) and so forth. the other suggestion I'd make is that they explicitly never reference what year it is, as this tends to date things quite a bit. mind, Magneto aside it doesn't really matter. he's really the only one whose problematic (at least with Namor he has the "I'm not human" excuse).

['Foretold' Joker]

Eh just give him some of that Nick Fury anti-aging serum and he's fine for another few decades.

[Cela]

Doesn't matter. It's backstory, no one cares about how long it's been in reality.

[Citizen Snips]

Another solution: At some point, Apocalypse or Mr Sinister got their hands on him, did a little experimenting. Their genetic meddling caused him to have that wonderful "really slow aging/immortality" that they possess.

[Dr. T is an alien]

Sadly, there have been plenty of genocides historically that Magneto could have survived since the Holocaust (a few of which still targeted Jews), so you can just change his setting and it would work.

[BorneAgain]

Aug 18, 2012 16:39:45 GMT -5 Dr. T is an alien said:

Sadly, there have been plenty of genocides historically that Magneto could have survived since the Holocaust (a few of which still targeted Jews), so you can just change his setting and it would work.

My thoughts exactly. While the Holocaust packs a particuarly strong punch in Western media, there's plenty of atrocities in the past 50 years to serve the same purpose.

[Deleted]

This is why I think both Marvel and DC need to start fres every 20 years or so, so each generation can have it's own take on the characters without being bogged down by half a century of continuity.

And no, DC's half ass "some stuff happened, some stuff didn't" reboots they've been doing since 1985 don't count. All they've done is make things worse.

[Legion]

Aug 18, 2012 17:23:30 GMT -5 @therealoblivion said:

This is why I think both Marvel and DC need to start fres every 20 years or so, so each generation can have it's own take on the characters without being bogged down by half a century of continuity.

And no, DC's half ass "some stuff happened, some stuff didn't" reboots they've been doing since 1985 don't count. All they've done is make things worse.

So every 20 years I have to give up on all the characters and stories I care about as a fan because new fans cant be arsed to look on wiki or pick up a trade?

Screw that.

[Dr. T is an alien]

If you wanted to do a reboot series, perhaps it could be done slightly differently than the way the Ultimate Universe was established.

Instead of a separate set of overpriced comic books that fewer and fewer people will buy Marvel could keep the current series running while starting a limited series of monthly graphic novels. These graphic novels will be more attractive to the consumer as they will be the equivalent to 5 comics packaged together, which should improve the profitability of the series.

The monthly titles of this so-called "Marvel reborn" series can be Spiderman, Avengers, X-Men, and Marvel Reborn featuring _______.

The last one would be a series that could feature 5 shorts that are about the size of an average comic book that would feature characters that might not currently be able to sell a completely new line on their own but could contribute. Granted, in order to be sure that the Marvel Reborn featuring _____ line sells well there should be one or two shorts each monthly issue featuring solo adventures of characters from the other lines such as Wolverine, Iron Man, Venom (after he is reintroduced) or one of the more popular other lines such as Daredevil, Ghost Rider, Fantastic Four, or Deadpool. The other features can be projects involving less popular characters to see if they can capture an audience for the future. I would love a reboot of the Shogun Warriors if at all possible as well as a reintroduction of Ace.