Dave at the Movies
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
VINTAGE D-DAY DAVE! Always cranking dat thing.
Posts: 18,224
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Post by Dave at the Movies on Dec 22, 2011 14:58:52 GMT -5
From his Twitter
Maffewgregg MaffewofBotchamania Hah, Blip removed my account and my videos! They claimed copyright issues, which is hilarious considering other people's videos. Oh well!
Blip.TV makes no sense. How in the hell do they remove his account but not Nostalgia Critic's? Because Nostalgia Critic makes them a lot of money?
Maybe Maffew should try and do them Nostalgia Critic style and see what happens.
These ridiculous copyright rules are getting too out of control.
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Krimzon
Crow T. Robot
This guy is the man!
R.I.P. Deadpool
Posts: 43,870
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Post by Krimzon on Dec 22, 2011 15:08:55 GMT -5
If Maffew did his videos NC style, he could be protected under the Fair Use doctrine. That way, both WWE & TNA could go screw. We could then hopefully post the Botchamania videos here, as the video itself wouldn't be breaking any copyright laws.
However, that would be extremely tough for Maffew to do. Tough to do "commentary" or stuff like that with botches.
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Dave at the Movies
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
VINTAGE D-DAY DAVE! Always cranking dat thing.
Posts: 18,224
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Post by Dave at the Movies on Dec 22, 2011 15:10:53 GMT -5
If Maffew did his videos NC style, he could be protected under the Fair Use doctrine. That way, both WWE & TNA could go screw. We could then hopefully post the Botchamania videos here, as the video itself wouldn't be breaking any copyright laws. However, that would be extremely tough for Maffew to do. Tough to do "commentary" or stuff like that with botches. Not really. The whole fair use thing is completely arbitrary as well as anything else that has to do with copyright law. Nostalgia Critic can't even be on youtube even though his videos should be able to fall under fair use.
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Post by Andrew is Good on Dec 22, 2011 15:57:43 GMT -5
If Maffew did his videos NC style, he could be protected under the Fair Use doctrine. That way, both WWE & TNA could go screw. We could then hopefully post the Botchamania videos here, as the video itself wouldn't be breaking any copyright laws. However, that would be extremely tough for Maffew to do. Tough to do "commentary" or stuff like that with botches. It is rough. There are different people on Youtube who use Fair Use and bring this up a lot, and you can certainly fight. Even this message board here doesn't care about Fair Use, if there's WWE footage, no matter what, it has to be banned, which really isn't right. But a lot of that has to do with fear of reprisal. I even messaged RD and Blade about having some of their commentary videos on the Diva Search/ECW, etc put up on my youtube account, and I'll handle the potential wrath of WWE, but I'll win because it is Fair Use, and seeing stuff go on on different youtube accounts, if you file a counter notice and say you'll see because your free speech was violated, youtube will put the video back online. With Botchamania, I'm wondering if many of the comments he puts in the videos can be thought of as commentary. Not only that, but this is something Maffew created and put effort towards. He's not saying, he owns the WWE, TNA, ROH or whatever footage, he's using it, and creating something completely different. Anyway, Fair Use really is important and shouldn't be sneezed at. I wish people wouldn't crumble at bullies like WWE when it comes to Fair Use and stuff like that.
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Post by Red Impact on Dec 22, 2011 17:00:57 GMT -5
Botchamania and the Nostalgia Critic are different shows entirely. The only comparison is that they use copyrighted material, but how they use it is different. Whether you think what Botchamania does should be considered Fair Use or not, they really aren't comparable in what they do with it.
As for what Youtube does, Youtube is spineless. They will always err on the side that will get them into as little trouble as possible, and you have to fight if it's wrong. But Youtube isnt' a court of law, they don't represent a change in law in any way, shape, or form.
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Dave at the Movies
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
VINTAGE D-DAY DAVE! Always cranking dat thing.
Posts: 18,224
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Post by Dave at the Movies on Dec 22, 2011 17:08:43 GMT -5
If Maffew did his videos NC style, he could be protected under the Fair Use doctrine. That way, both WWE & TNA could go screw. We could then hopefully post the Botchamania videos here, as the video itself wouldn't be breaking any copyright laws. However, that would be extremely tough for Maffew to do. Tough to do "commentary" or stuff like that with botches. It is rough. There are different people on Youtube who use Fair Use and bring this up a lot, and you can certainly fight. Even this message board here doesn't care about Fair Use, if there's WWE footage, no matter what, it has to be banned, which really isn't right. But a lot of that has to do with fear of reprisal. I even messaged RD and Blade about having some of their commentary videos on the Diva Search/ECW, etc put up on my youtube account, and I'll handle the potential wrath of WWE, but I'll win because it is Fair Use, and seeing stuff go on on different youtube accounts, if you file a counter notice and say you'll see because your free speech was violated, youtube will put the video back online. With Botchamania, I'm wondering if many of the comments he puts in the videos can be thought of as commentary. Not only that, but this is something Maffew created and put effort towards. He's not saying, he owns the WWE, TNA, ROH or whatever footage, he's using it, and creating something completely different. Anyway, Fair Use really is important and shouldn't be sneezed at. I wish people wouldn't crumble at bullies like WWE when it comes to Fair Use and stuff like that. Yeah!! Be A STAR WWE. You hypocrites. ;D lol
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Post by rapidfire187 on Dec 22, 2011 17:20:00 GMT -5
You know, you can't blame WWE for this sort of thing. If there's a popular video series on the internet that not only uses their copyrighted footage, but uses it in a way that makes them look stupid, why would they just roll over and let it happen?
And that's coming from a huge Botchamania fan.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Dec 22, 2011 17:30:39 GMT -5
I'm with rapidfire. Botchamania is entertaining to watch, but it's not like he has the right to use footage produced and owned by other companies.
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Dave at the Movies
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
VINTAGE D-DAY DAVE! Always cranking dat thing.
Posts: 18,224
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Post by Dave at the Movies on Dec 23, 2011 1:49:12 GMT -5
It depends on whether you think its parody or follows under fair use. I think it pretty clearly falls under fair use but that doesn't matter because the courts are stupidly arbitrary in the worst ways.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 23, 2011 2:15:10 GMT -5
You know, you can't blame WWE for this sort of thing. If there's a popular video series on the internet that not only uses their copyrighted footage, but uses it in a way that makes them look stupid, why would they just roll over and let it happen? And that's coming from a huge Botchamania fan. Agree 100%. If it's the WWE's footage, they have a right to it that nobody else does. They own it, therefore they should get to choose who else uses it.
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The Legend of Groose
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Voted for Mason Ryan
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Post by The Legend of Groose on Dec 23, 2011 2:44:10 GMT -5
I think the Nostalgia Critic is fine because he's doing "Reviews" as a critic and stating his own opinion. With Maffew's videos, that's not really the case.
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CaptainFall
Samurai Cop
'Fascinating is the word of the day'
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Post by CaptainFall on Dec 23, 2011 3:06:06 GMT -5
You know, you can't blame WWE for this sort of thing. If there's a popular video series on the internet that not only uses their copyrighted footage, but uses it in a way that makes them look stupid, why would they just roll over and let it happen? And that's coming from a huge Botchamania fan. Agree 100%. If it's the WWE's footage, they have a right to it that nobody else does. They own it, therefore they should get to choose who else uses it. The WWE are a massive company who makes gajillions of dollars every year, is it really damaging them that their videos are being used in Botchamania? If anything Botchamania is promoting WWE and if the company could laugh at itself and not be so mean spirited about it then Maffew wouldn't be caught in an endless loop of setting up new accounts at different video sites.
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Post by mysterydriver on Dec 23, 2011 12:02:13 GMT -5
The way the law is now, it's very easy for them to turn on the video, see the clips, hear the music, and go "Well, that's nothing but copyrighted material being used to show more copyrighted material...but now with profit thanks to that lucrative blip money. Ha, Iron Sheik."
And yes, lucrative blip money is a joke.
WWE may be a big company that makes big money, but these are the same people who fired loyal referee Earl Hebner after decades with the company because he was selling bootleg t-shirts. They want everything they can get for that bottom dollar.
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Post by EvenBaldobombHasAJob on Dec 23, 2011 12:22:33 GMT -5
this sucks. WWE and TNA ARE totally in their rights to protect their intellectual property, but I still can't help but think of this as being a "stop having fun guys" moment.
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Post by Red Impact on Dec 23, 2011 12:45:28 GMT -5
It depends on whether you think its parody or follows under fair use. I think it pretty clearly falls under fair use but that doesn't matter because the courts are stupidly arbitrary in the worst ways. I like Botchamania, but I think it'd be a hard argument to classify it as fair use. It's not parody to just show clips of screw ups or audience reactions with some captions. And the majority of the videos are copyrighted material. He doesnt' really do much with it other than put captions and edit it together most of the time, at least from what I've seen, I haven't watched them all, so I think fair use is a hard argument to make. Showing a bunch of clips of mistakes isn't parody, and I don't know if the commentary is really substantial enough to fall under Fair Use. Maybe I'm wrong and the videos I haven't seen feature a lot more comedy, but the ones I've seen don't make me think that. The only defense is that it's not really costing the WWE any money, but even if there is arbitrariness to it, it has to be more than that. Agree 100%. If it's the WWE's footage, they have a right to it that nobody else does. They own it, therefore they should get to choose who else uses it. The WWE are a massive company who makes gajillions of dollars every year, is it really damaging them that their videos are being used in Botchamania? If anything Botchamania is promoting WWE and if the company could laugh at itself and not be so mean spirited about it then Maffew wouldn't be caught in an endless loop of setting up new accounts at different video sites. It's not that simple. You have to protect your copyright, or you risk losing it. While there are rights if you do something with it, if WWE chooses not to enforce people putting matches or clips on Youtube, then it might hurt them when trying to stop other copyright violations. And I don't really see how it's promoting WWE. Anyone who is interested in Botchamania already knows about WWE, and showing clips where the guys screw up isn't going to benefit them anymore than, say, PETA showing pictures of chickens being slaughtered is going to promote KFC.
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Post by Andrew is Good on Dec 23, 2011 12:45:37 GMT -5
To be fair to TNA, like, that company gets bashed by Maffew, and even I stopped watching it. But it seems TNA doesn't have a problem with Maffew, and it's just WWE. The thing is with WWE though, is anytime something of WWE's is uploaded (I tried it with a brief clip), it usually gets immediately taken down.
In regards to the use of their footage, there are cases with their footage, and any footage can be used with Fair Use, and it's important to bring that up. On youtube, if someone uses footage of someone else for comment/parody/whatever, they are allowed to do it. If the person tries to take it down citing copyright infringement, then they could be liable for stifling the free speech of the person who used that footage.
I'm not a lawyer, but Botchamania is a lot of commentary and parody, and a lot of it is taking others work and creating something completely different. It's art. It's comedy. It needs to be stood up for.
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Post by Apricots And A Pear Tree on Dec 23, 2011 12:49:57 GMT -5
I think the Nostalgia Critic is fine because he's doing "Reviews" as a critic and stating his own opinion. With Maffew's videos, that's not really the case. Well it's his opinion those are botches.The wrestlers could be doing them on purpose to add a sense of realism.
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The QC Loser
Hank Scorpio
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Post by The QC Loser on Dec 23, 2011 13:00:24 GMT -5
While I doubt it would do any good but has Maffew ever tried contacting the WWE and getting written permission to use the videos? Like I said I doubt it would do any good and they would probably shoot him down but you never know.
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Post by Red Impact on Dec 23, 2011 13:03:10 GMT -5
To be fair to TNA, like, that company gets bashed by Maffew, and even I stopped watching it. But it seems TNA doesn't have a problem with Maffew, and it's just WWE. The thing is with WWE though, is anytime something of WWE's is uploaded (I tried it with a brief clip), it usually gets immediately taken down. In regards to the use of their footage, there are cases with their footage, and any footage can be used with Fair Use, and it's important to bring that up. On youtube, if someone uses footage of someone else for comment/parody/whatever, they are allowed to do it. If the person tries to take it down citing copyright infringement, then they could be liable for stifling the free speech of the person who used that footage. I'm not a lawyer, but Botchamania is a lot of commentary and parody, and a lot of it is taking others work and creating something completely different. It's art. It's comedy. It needs to be stood up for. I'm sorry, I just don't see parody. Parody requires imitation, and he's not actually hiring wrestlers to make fun of the moments, he's putting clips together. Just because it's supposed to be funny doesn't make it parody. So the argument for being fair use would hinge on other factors, including how much copyright material relative to the entire piece that he uses, and whether or not it's a transformative work. Most of Botchamania is copyrighted material, although there is some commentary, so it's whether you believe editing a bunch of clips together qualifies as being transformative or not. I'd lean towards the not, but that's all matter of opinion, pretty much. I like Botchamania, but I don't think I could say it's fair use, nor would I say it's equivalent to what NC does. I think the Nostalgia Critic is fine because he's doing "Reviews" as a critic and stating his own opinion. With Maffew's videos, that's not really the case. Well it's his opinion those are botches.The wrestlers could be doing them on purpose to add a sense of realism. What he's saying is that much of a NC video is his own footage, filming himself and his opinion. You can't put up a movie on Youtube, put a caption on the bottom that says "bad movie" and say it's opinion and thus is fair use. One of the standards used to determine fair use is how much of your work consists of copyrighted material, and the two differ greatly in that regard. What you do with the copyrighted material is important, and NC uses it in a different way for the most part than Maffew.
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The Punisher
Unicron
"They don't fear the law. They fear me..."
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Post by The Punisher on Dec 23, 2011 16:03:53 GMT -5
Speaking on a very simplistic level, I think its a shame that something that is both funny and entertaining is being removed from every outlet it can be aired by a corporate machine that is petrified of losing the odd buck here and there and perhaps cracking the veneer of their image by showing how things actually happened rather than how people want them to be portrayed.
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