BigWill
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Posts: 16,619
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Post by BigWill on Dec 25, 2012 11:28:40 GMT -5
The AJ fight has gotten really weird on here. Obviously you have her huge fans who think she can't do anything wrong despite being one of (in my opinion) the worst things on RAW at the minute.... I think you inadvertently got at the heart of why people fight. I am pretty neutral toward AJ myself (though I feel bad for the performer having to portray such a horrible character), but I seriously don't think blind slathering admiration that blinds people to reality is to credit for her defenders. I think some people just like her and others don't. Doesn't help to cast her fans as just ignoring that she can do wrong. There is no blinding from reality in pro wrestling. It's all fake, so no fans opinions are more right than the another. I don't understand why it's such a hard concept to grasp that people can have differing opinions, even extreme ones.
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Post by carp (SPC, Itoh Respect Army) on Dec 25, 2012 11:53:40 GMT -5
I think you inadvertently got at the heart of why people fight. I am pretty neutral toward AJ myself (though I feel bad for the performer having to portray such a horrible character), but I seriously don't think blind slathering admiration that blinds people to reality is to credit for her defenders. I think some people just like her and others don't. Doesn't help to cast her fans as just ignoring that she can do wrong. There is no blinding from reality in pro wrestling. It's all fake, so no fans opinions are more right than the another. I don't understand why it's such a hard concept to grasp that people can have differing opinions, even extreme ones. I'm not sure if you're disagreeing with me or not, but that was exactly what I'm saying. The problem is when you cast people who disagree with you as blinded or foolish in someway; then no one listens to anyone.
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BigWill
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Posts: 16,619
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Post by BigWill on Dec 25, 2012 11:56:16 GMT -5
There is no blinding from reality in pro wrestling. It's all fake, so no fans opinions are more right than the another. I don't understand why it's such a hard concept to grasp that people can have differing opinions, even extreme ones. I'm not sure if you're disagreeing with me or not, but that was exactly what I'm saying. The problem is when you cast people who disagree with you as blinded or foolish in someway; then no one listens to anyone. Ok then. I guess I misunderstood your post.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Dec 25, 2012 12:33:10 GMT -5
Yeah I'm in the same bewildered camp as select others on the AJ thing. She's neither the best of all time in the Divas division or the worst. I think she's been very compelling at times, but she's basically been given a character that I don't think any actress could work with.
I think people are missing the point in that it's about the worst ACTING, not the worst character, AJ's a blemish on Raw a lot of the times lately, Cena's character is often times hard to sympathize for, CM Punk goes for cheap heat. I don't know how that reflects on their acting, I'll just say anyone saying CM Punk or John Cena are the worst all time actors in the WWE are just wrong. Watch Cena's "retirement" promo during the Nexus angle, watch CM Punk's promos on Raven from ROH/Indies, or the original "pipe-bomb", or just any CM Punk promo, I don't even know how he's on the table right now. I'm not saying their Hollywood ready and have it down to a science. I'm saying in terms of professional wrestling acting(which isn't a high standard) there is no way we're putting CM Punk or John Cena at the bottom of the pile.
Zack Ryder, as much as I think it's an amazing thing how he built himself up, I always thought he was a cringeworthy guy to watch speak directly to a camera. I think he's a great wrestler and I really do root for him and think there's a way to make him work without exploiting his weaknesses so much. But there's a real lack of any conviction behind his promos and it doesn't seem to get better through all the experience he's given himself.
I don't know if he counts but I don't think I cringed harder watching any wrestler like I did Eli Cottonwood, he just looked so unsure of himself at all times.
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Allie Kitsune
Crow T. Robot
Always Feelin' Foxy.
Celestial Princess in Exile.
Posts: 46,055
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Post by Allie Kitsune on Dec 25, 2012 13:02:43 GMT -5
Yeah I'm in the same bewildered camp as select others on the AJ thing. She's neither the best of all time in the Divas division or the worst. I think she's been very compelling at times, but she's basically been given a character that I don't think any actress could work with. I think people are missing the point in that it's about the worst ACTING, not the worst character, AJ's a blemish on Raw a lot of the times lately, Cena's character is often times hard to sympathize for, CM Punk goes for cheap heat. I don't know how that reflects on their acting, I'll just say anyone saying CM Punk or John Cena are the worst all time actors in the WWE are just wrong. Watch Cena's "retirement" promo during the Nexus angle, watch CM Punk's promos on Raven from ROH/Indies, or the original "pipe-bomb", or just any CM Punk promo, I don't even know how he's on the table right now. I'm not saying their Hollywood ready and have it down to a science. I'm saying in terms of professional wrestling acting(which isn't a high standard) there is no way we're putting CM Punk or John Cena at the bottom of the pile. Zack Ryder, as much as I think it's an amazing thing how he built himself up, I always thought he was a cringeworthy guy to watch speak directly to a camera. I think he's a great wrestler and I really do root for him and think there's a way to make him work without exploiting his weaknesses so much. But there's a real lack of any conviction behind his promos and it doesn't seem to get better through all the experience he's given himself. I don't know if he counts but I don't think I cringed harder watching any wrestler like I did Eli Cottonwood, he just looked so unsure of himself at all times. Eli Cottonwood seemed like a character that was never supposed to speak in the first place. He looked like he was supposed to be some sort of not-too-bright back-woods crazy who didn't have to string complex sentences together, because he was too busy stringing your intestines through his teeth. Making him have to be a regular old guy on NXT kind of killed that.
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Post by carp (SPC, Itoh Respect Army) on Dec 25, 2012 13:49:43 GMT -5
Eli Cottonwood seemed like a character that was never supposed to speak in the first place. He looked like he was supposed to be some sort of not-too-bright back-woods crazy who didn't have to string complex sentences together, because he was too busy stringing your intestines through his teeth. Making him have to be a regular old guy on NXT kind of killed that. I'm pretty sure someone just thought it was hilarious to make him act like that on NXT, as part of the whole televised hazing thing that was apparently mostly a shoot on those old NXT seasons. "He's a big monster? Let's make him do a promo about mustaches!"
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Post by kingoftheindies on Dec 25, 2012 14:03:28 GMT -5
I dunno about who are the worst, but I think a lot of it comes from the situation.
Eve was always fairly likable as a face and her heel turn was weird; from that forced laugh when the Bellas called Ryder a nice guy, to breaking down in front of Cena in the ring, to her promo about how she can get guys to do whatever she wanted. It all came off so forced. I do like how in recent months, they have kind of made her character a parody of the forced acting by her just being cheesy over the top with her actions and mannerisms.
Same with AJ, I don't think her acting was bad when she was involved with Punk and Bryan, but everything with Vickie comes off painful.
Actually, worst actor may be Sim Snuka/Deuce. Domino/Cliff Compton and Cherry were over the top but they seemed to be having fun. Snuka seemed so uncomfortable in his role
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Post by Snaptastic on Dec 25, 2012 14:19:30 GMT -5
It's alright, AJ is the "in thing" to hate on right now for whatever reason. Happens to anyone who gets more than 30 seconds screen-time outside of the ring. Or, people just don't think she's as good as you do. Impossible
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Jonathan Michaels
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
The Archduke of Levity
Here since TNA was still kinda okay
Posts: 18,108
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Post by Jonathan Michaels on Dec 25, 2012 16:42:16 GMT -5
Cena is a better promo then Triple H Let's not go nuts. At one point, that may have been true, but that point was 2003. The Rock/Cena angle showed me that even if he turns heel, he can't go back to what he was, he just can't pull it off anymore. Not saying Hunter is the best stick man out there, but he's still above Cena. Morrison WAS stiff, but his improv training has likely helped him improve, hopefully he'll come back so we can find out. And Orton's highly entertaining on the extremely rare occasions when he unleashes his inner ham, see him and Edge impersonating DX and threatening to RKO his own grandma.
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