|
Post by YiHammer on Dec 30, 2012 18:27:04 GMT -5
McCool said her and Melina got in trouble with agents for having too good of a match
|
|
PKO
King Koopa
Posts: 12,564
|
Post by PKO on Dec 30, 2012 18:33:08 GMT -5
Nice stories are nice to hear.
|
|
|
Post by norsisclouds on Dec 30, 2012 18:34:34 GMT -5
I think it is just a great example of how we as fans tend to take the most salacious, sensational stories and run with them instead of acknowledging the more tame and pleasant stories about the wrestlers. They are useful for that reason. Personally, I tend to take someone's word a lot more seriously if they say kind and professional things about 8 of the 10 people that they worked with, and only bad things about 2 of the people they worked with...that means that either they had a personal grudge against those individuals, or maybe that person, taken together with others is just rotten. Melina in particular has a bad reputation among fans because of ONE interview, and ONE incident that involved her boyfriend, and not HER and then other interviews where people sung her praises repeatedly. It's kind of telling which reputation has stuck over the years, the one that's more fun to tell jokes about. For a lot of wrestlers, you can get polar opposite answers depending on you ask and their personal experience with the wrestler in question. Bobby Heenan on Hulk Hogan: liked him; didn't mind letting the boys use his big, private dressing room Raven on Hogan: a "piece of s***" ; would go into WCW booking meetings and trash the midcarders. Ask McCool and Miss Tessmacher about Melina, and you'll get two very different responses. Well, of course but my main point is this: we tend to remember the horrible things about people, and never the nice stories.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 30, 2012 18:37:59 GMT -5
McCool said her and Melina got in trouble with agents for having too good of a match That's what she claimed was the reason, but that match was a prime example of one of those "big spot, no-sell, repeat" matches that WWE hates because they, kayfabe-wise, make devestating moves look really ineffective, and, reality-wise, why do a big spot if you're going you're just going to up 20 seconds later and act like it didn't happen. You always hear guys in WWE saying how important it was/is to "make every move matter".
|
|
|
Post by HR on Dec 30, 2012 18:40:25 GMT -5
McCool said her and Melina got in trouble with agents for having too good of a match That's what she claimed was the reason, but that match was a prime example of one of those "big spot, no-sell, repeat" matches that WWE hates because they make devestating moves look really ineffective. Please. It was solely because WWE doesn't want women doing big/dangerous/great spots or anything that remotely looks like it could hurt. Nothing to do with no-selling at all.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 30, 2012 18:43:04 GMT -5
That's what she claimed was the reason, but that match was a prime example of one of those "big spot, no-sell, repeat" matches that WWE hates because they make devestating moves look really ineffective. Please. It was solely because WWE doesn't want women doing big/dangerous/great spots or anything that remotely looks like it could hurt. Nothing to do with no-selling at all. It had nothing do with it when it was everything WWE discourages in terms of ring psychology?
|
|
|
Post by HR on Dec 30, 2012 18:51:13 GMT -5
Please. It was solely because WWE doesn't want women doing big/dangerous/great spots or anything that remotely looks like it could hurt. Nothing to do with no-selling at all. It had nothing do with it when it was everything WWE doesn't want any of their wrestlers, female or male, doing? You're missing the point all together. No one would have said a thing if Michelle and Melina were two guys. The girls aren't even allowed to hit each other for goodness sake.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 30, 2012 19:06:00 GMT -5
It had nothing do with it when it was everything WWE doesn't want any of their wrestlers, female or male, doing? You're missing the point all together. No one would have said a thing if Michelle and Melina were two guys. The girls aren't even allowed to hit each other for goodness sake. Yes, they would. Scotty 2 Hotty and Dean Malenko finished their match at Backlash 2000 with Malenko DDT'ing Scotty off the ropes. When they got to the back, they were told to never do it again. A very similar spot was done in the Michelle/Melina match. WWE also restricts guys from doing certain moves when they think he shouldn't be doing them because of his size or his gimmick.
|
|
|
Post by norsisclouds on Dec 30, 2012 19:32:06 GMT -5
McCool said her and Melina got in trouble with agents for having too good of a match That's what she claimed was the reason, but that match was a prime example of one of those "big spot, no-sell, repeat" matches that WWE hates because they, kayfabe-wise, make devestating moves look really ineffective, and, reality-wise, why do a big spot if you're going you're just going to up 20 seconds later and act like it didn't happen. You always hear guys in WWE saying how important it was/is to "make every move matter". Gail Kim said the same thing also happened to her.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 30, 2012 19:43:37 GMT -5
That's what she claimed was the reason, but that match was a prime example of one of those "big spot, no-sell, repeat" matches that WWE hates because they, kayfabe-wise, make devestating moves look really ineffective, and, reality-wise, why do a big spot if you're going you're just going to up 20 seconds later and act like it didn't happen. You always hear guys in WWE saying how important it was/is to "make every move matter". Gail Kim said the same thing also happened to her. And I'm saying the guys also have restrictions put on them, WWE wants certain people doing certain things, and WWE's reasons for it aren't automatically an effort to make the wrestler in question less entertaining. Sometimes, it's because of danger, and sometimes it's because of match psychology. For example, if you take multiple punches and don't put up your hands for protection like a boxer would, you'll probably hear about it afterwards as Vince mentioned publicly a few years ago that was something that he didn't like.
|
|
Cronant
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Posts: 17,556
|
Post by Cronant on Dec 30, 2012 19:48:49 GMT -5
Eh, I just went and watched a little bit of that match.
In fairness, a DDT on the Barricade is probably something WWE would tell any low/midcard/diva match not to do, as thats probably a main event thing. If you believe Reks story about Cena and his move.
Although I do think McCool and Layla did something similar in their match. But that was her last match and it was Extreme Rules so maybe it was allowed?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 30, 2012 19:51:47 GMT -5
Eh, I just went and watched a little bit of that match. In fairness, a DDT on the Barricade is probably something WWE would tell any low/midcard/diva match not to do, as thats probably a main event thing. If you believe Reks story about Cena and his move. WWE didn't tell them to do it. Michelle confirmed that it was her and Melina's idea, not an idea given to them.
|
|
Dat Dude
Dennis Stamp
Wait, what?
Posts: 4,785
|
Post by Dat Dude on Dec 30, 2012 19:52:09 GMT -5
Pretty dick move if Beth did that on purpose. I remember around that time there was a rumor that Michelle was lecturing Natalya on how to wrestle properly in the WWE that rub some folks the wrong way (considering the respective parties experience level). Perhaps Beth did it (that's if she did it on purpose) as a way to get back at the slight of her friend. And if that's the case that would be a even worse.
Or it could've been a mistake that Beth later took credit for just to put herself over in an interview.
|
|
Cronant
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Posts: 17,556
|
Post by Cronant on Dec 30, 2012 19:55:02 GMT -5
Eh, I just went and watched a little bit of that match. In fairness, a DDT on the Barricade is probably something WWE would tell any low/midcard/diva match not to do, as thats probably a main event thing. If you believe Reks story about Cena and his move. WWE didn't tell them to do it. Michelle confirmed that it was her and Melina's idea, not an idea given to them. Thats what I said. I can see that being something WWE isn't cool with. I remember that Superstars tag match where Baretta and Kidd (I think) did that crazy superplex to the outside spot. I wonder how that went over.
|
|
|
Post by norsisclouds on Dec 30, 2012 19:58:22 GMT -5
Pretty dick move if Beth did that on purpose. I remember around that time there was a rumor that Michelle was lecturing Natalya on how to wrestle properly in the WWE that rub some folks the wrong way (considering the respective parties experience level). Perhaps Beth did it (that's if she did it on purpose) as a way to get back at the slight of her friend. And if that's the case that would be a even worse. Or it could've been a mistake that Beth later took credit for just to put herself over in an interview. Michelle said that this rumor wasn't true and she and Natalya actually talked about it. So who knows. I stand by the ladies in what they said about Creative. It would be one thing if just one person says it, but when 3 people go on record and said it happened well that's that. If they'd been told by the bookers not to do it because it was dangerous/looked stupid, you'd have a point, but they were all given the impression/flat out told (not sure which) that they had to dumb it down on the ring, and Gail said this happened on separate occasions where they were told to "girly it up". I remember when Gail gave that interview and people called her a liar. Let's wait for the 4th, 5th and 6th person to come out and say that the specific criticism was that they were not fighting "girly". Then we can believe them. enough.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 30, 2012 20:00:01 GMT -5
WWE didn't tell them to do it. Michelle confirmed that it was her and Melina's idea, not an idea given to them. Thats what I said. I can see that being something WWE isn't cool with. I remember that Superstars tag match where Baretta and Kidd (I think) did that crazy superplex to the outside spot. I wonder how that went over. Sorry, wasn't trying say you were wrong. I was just pointing that you were right, and Michelle herself confirmed it wasn't WWE idea.
|
|
kidglov3s
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Wants her Shot
Who is Tiger Maskooo?
Posts: 15,870
|
Post by kidglov3s on Dec 30, 2012 20:00:58 GMT -5
Pretty dick move if Beth did that on purpose. I remember around that time there was a rumor that Michelle was lecturing Natalya on how to wrestle properly in the WWE that rub some folks the wrong way (considering the respective parties experience level). Perhaps Beth did it (that's if she did it on purpose) as a way to get back at the slight of her friend. And if that's the case that would be a even worse. Or it could've been a mistake that Beth later took credit for just to put herself over in an interview. Michelle said that this rumor wasn't true and she and Natalya actually talked about it. So who knows. I stand by the ladies in what they said about Creative. It would be one thing if just one person says it, but when 3 people go on record and said it happened well that's that. If they'd been told by the bookers not to do it because it was dangerous/looked stupid, you'd have a point, but they were all given the impression/flat out told (not sure which) that they had to dumb it down on the ring, and Gail said this happened on separate occasions where they were told to "girly it up". I remember when Gail gave that interview and people called her a liar. Let's wait for the 4th, 5th and 6th person to come out and say that the specific criticism was that they were not fighting "girly". Then we can believe them. enough. To girly must be among the best verbs ever.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 30, 2012 20:08:29 GMT -5
Pretty dick move if Beth did that on purpose. I remember around that time there was a rumor that Michelle was lecturing Natalya on how to wrestle properly in the WWE that rub some folks the wrong way (considering the respective parties experience level). Perhaps Beth did it (that's if she did it on purpose) as a way to get back at the slight of her friend. And if that's the case that would be a even worse. Or it could've been a mistake that Beth later took credit for just to put herself over in an interview. Michelle said that this rumor wasn't true and she and Natalya actually talked about it. So who knows. I stand by the ladies in what they said about Creative. It would be one thing if just one person says it, but when 3 people go on record and said it happened well that's that. If they'd been told by the bookers not to do it because it was dangerous/looked stupid, you'd have a point, but they were all given the impression/flat out told (not sure which) that they had to dumb it down on the ring, and Gail said this happened on separate occasions where they were told to "girly it up". I remember when Gail gave that interview and people called her a liar. Let's wait for the 4th, 5th and 6th person to come out and say that the specific criticism was that they were not fighting "girly". Then we can believe them. enough. I can see Divas and midcarders taking move restrictions badly if they feel they were/are under used. On a related subject, I recall Dave Meltzer saying the main difference between WWE and TNA's women's matches was that the Knockouts matches were put together beforehand almost move-for-move by TNA agents while WWE's women's matches were mostly put together by the women involved.
|
|
trollrogue
Hank Scorpio
Nashville City of Music!!
Posts: 5,595
|
Post by trollrogue on Dec 31, 2012 6:07:14 GMT -5
I never heard these rumors from other divas, it was always random fans who assumed that Michelle got pushed because of her association with The Undertaker. I remember Maria in her YouShoot saying how Michelle was the hardest working diva in the WWE and was constantly trying to get better before and after the shows.
|
|