SOR
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Post by SOR on Jun 24, 2013 0:48:45 GMT -5
Okay so we all know this was the day Hulk Hogan, Ric Flair, Jeff Hardy and a handful of others either returned to TNA or debuted in TNA in a massive 3 hour special.
My question, how come TNA couldn't capitalize on this and move the ratings really high on this night? I mean Jeff Hardy returning to TNA would be the equivalent of Rey Mysterio or Randy Orton turning up in TNA this week. It was Ric Flair's first major North American appearance since his WWE run so it'd be the equivalent of HBK joining TNA tomorrow and of course with Hulk it'd be like Austin or someone walking into TNA tomorrow.
Now TNA obviously did try, I remember tuning in that day just for Hulk and marking out huge for Flair, Hall, Hardy, X-Pac but TNA couldn't turn this into dollars or ratings. What happened? Why couldn't they really boost their ratings with 3 or 4 million dollar wrestlers coming in on the same night? The show was of quality they highlighted Kurt Angle, Bobby Lashley and a number of other guys mixed in with the big signings/debutants and the matches were really big. It was probably the biggest show TNA ever put on in terms of hype.
I'm interested in legitimate opinions not answers like "because lol tna" this seems like the biggest flop in wrestling history and it's kind of depressing to think about if you honestly think about what all that did for them short term (Not that much at the time)
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Sajoa Moe
Patti Mayonnaise
Did you get that thing I sent ya?
A man without gimmick.
Posts: 39,683
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Post by Sajoa Moe on Jun 24, 2013 0:51:48 GMT -5
Because they built the worst show imaginable around it. It was basically "Hulk Hogan and a bunch of other old f***s are coming, and oh yeah, here's some people you don't know, but who cares about them".
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2013 1:05:24 GMT -5
One change could've salvaged the whole show.
Instead of having Hardy return during the "Homicide can't escape the cage" fiasco. Have him take Flair's spot that night. Jeff Hardy was just the WWE Champion when we last saw him. At the end of the night, AJ wins his match and suddenly Hardy walks down the ramp and goes face to face with AJ and says "I want your title."
There. Now the main feud is Hardy vs. AJ and the show ends on a high note. Flair can debut later on. Now, whether they'd booked this feud as compelling, I don't know but it would've been an improvement.
Another thing I'd change is the decreased focus of the X Division and Knockouts. At the time, those two elements were what made TNA stand apart from WWE. They needed to truly be an alternative to the WWE and instead they focused almost all their efforts on spotlighting Hogan & Co. to the point where it hurt their ability to grow.
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Post by slappy on Jun 24, 2013 1:38:34 GMT -5
The funniest thing was them waiting for Hogan to arrive to the arena and then in his promo he says he was there all day.
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Post by jrev1313 on Jun 24, 2013 1:45:14 GMT -5
Easy, marketing and branding. What good is a show with all of those names if no one knows about it? Yeah, there was a lot of buzz online that night and excitement because of the Monday Night Wars being renewed but how much of the general public knew about this? That's been TNA's problem period. Good booking helps but TNA have never had enough of a marketing presence to be able to make their company known worldwide. Why do you think there are people who look at guys like Angle and Hardy and ask them why they aren't wrestling anymore?
The company just come off so second rate and rinky dinky too at times that it's hard to ever buy them as big time. Remember, this was still the Impact Zone days. If they had the right marketing, used the talents they had the right way to be effective and had the atmosphere they do now with live shows then we might have had a different story. Instead we do have a flop and what if, which is a lot of what comprises TNA's history.
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Shark
Hank Scorpio
The world's only Samurai Ninja Pirate
Posts: 7,045
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Post by Shark on Jun 24, 2013 2:04:21 GMT -5
TNA did really piss that down their legs, but they actually performed well in the ratings that night. I believe overall they did a 1.5 and a 1.3 for the 3 hours against Raw, which of course had Bret Hart on WWE TV for the first time since Montreal so the 1.3 they got was impressive. The problem as mentioned was the booking, while Flair and Hardy showed up, they did nothing and it wasn't advertised ahead of time. They also had a 20 minute segment where Hogan, Hall, Nash, Waltman, and Bischoff talked, almost literally, about nothing. Matches just happened with no real significance. A bunch of old names showed up to take the spotlight from people it should have shown on, Orlando Jordan and the Nasty Boys specifically. Lashley came out, buried the company and left and Bischoff was shown not caring at all. The show could've ended with a great positive of Hogan putting over the great Styles-Angle match, but instead we had to cut to the back and see the NWO attacking Foley with Hogan looking on, so all the attention at the end of the show was all on, you guessed it, Hulk Hogan.
Also the fans chanting BULLSHIT loudly after the very first match was a bad sign of things to come.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2013 2:13:14 GMT -5
Because you can't build a sustainable audience on nostalgia. Never mind growing one. As many predicted, any bump from Hogan wouldn't last because he didn't bring anything new to the table. Same gimmick that people can YouTube from his prime years. TNA misfired when they didn't have the rights to WCW from 96-98 to play on a loop for the Hogan fans tuning in.
Hogan got that one time bump (followed by 3 years of 1.1s or lower) because of older fans wanting some fuzzy memories, not actively looking to get back into wrestling.
IF growth can be made for TNA its in a new audience, not trying to recapture the old one.
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Post by Gerard Gerard on Jun 24, 2013 2:13:58 GMT -5
Whatever buzz was created from Hardy's flimsy redebut was also somewhat dead immediately; he didn't appear on Impact! again 'til March 8th.
I do agree with RocketPunch!'s point, it would've been a very cool, buzzworthy moment, and also could've harkened back nicely to Hardy's original TNA debut in 2004 with him challenging AJ for the X title out of the gate.
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Post by Package Piledriver on Jun 24, 2013 2:14:00 GMT -5
TNA did really piss that down their legs, but they actually performed well in the ratings that night. I believe overall they did a 1.5 and a 1.3 for the 3 hours against Raw, which of course had Bret Hart on WWE TV for the first time since Montreal so the 1.3 they got was impressive. The problem as mentioned was the booking, while Flair and Hardy showed up, they did nothing and it wasn't advertised ahead of time. They also had a 20 minute segment where Hogan, Hall, Nash, Waltman, and Bischoff talked, almost literally, about nothing. Matches just happened with no real significance. A bunch of old names showed up to take the spotlight from people it should have shown on, Orlando Jordan and the Nasty Boys specifically. Lashley came out, buried the company and left and Bischoff was shown not caring at all. The show could've ended with a great positive of Hogan putting over the great Styles-Angle match, but instead we had to cut to the back and see the NWO attacking Foley with Hogan looking on, so all the attention at the end of the show was all on, you guessed it, Hulk Hogan. Also the fans chanting BULLSHIT loudly after the very first match was a bad sign of things to come. Wasn't there also 5 minutes devoted to jeff hardy signing autographs to.
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Post by Chuckie Finster on Jun 24, 2013 2:39:39 GMT -5
They had Hogan, Bischoff, Nall, Waltman, Jeff Hardy, Val Venis, the Nasty Boys and Orlando Jordan debut on the show and didn't have jack for the following week. That was TNA in a nutshell. Blowing their wad all at once with no vision for the future.
You had the following segments on that show.
-Lashley and Krystal burying the company before quitting. -A DQ in a cage match. -Advertising Full Metal Mayhem and Barb Wire Massacre matches that didn't happen. -Jeff Hardy humming his own theme music sitting on top of a cage. -An interview with an inebriated Kevin Nash. -An nWo reunion as the 9 pm segment/aka "holy shit, I'm watching Nitro". -Tearing up a legit format sheet. -Strip poker with Val Venis. -Ric Flair just randomely coming up the ramp and then leaving. -The nWo beats up Mick Foley. -Jeff Hardy giving a painting to a fan. -Bischoff getting out of one limo to get in another. -Bubba the Love Sponge interviewing fans who want unprotected chair shots to the head. -The Nasty Boys sneaking past security to destory Team 3D's (who were in Japan) locker room.
That was as TNA of a show as you'll ever get.
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Glitch
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Post by Glitch on Jun 24, 2013 2:48:22 GMT -5
Because name recognition only lasts five seconds. You can't build an entire show or promotion on it. It's one thing to put eyes on your show and butts in seats, but it's entirely another to able to keep them there(this is why Hogan and most ex-wwe guys are a colossal waste of money). Fame is fleeting because as the old saying goes "what have you done for me lately?"
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Post by Jedi-El of Tomorrow on Jun 24, 2013 3:04:07 GMT -5
Like has been said they built the worst show they could have. Having big names is nice, but you need something to go with those names. People watched Hogan, Bischoff, Nash, and Hall as top guys in a company they stopped watching 10 years ago, those guys are older, and it's not going to cause people to stick around. You had Hogan as the big time face completely bury everything that Jeff Jarrett did for the company to the point where the crowd turned on Hogan. They also had the great decision to have Tara vs ODB be unopposed from Raw, while putting the awesome Taylor and Sarita vs Kong and Hamada match against Raw. Throw that match in the first hour, and maybe more people would have stuck around for the entire episode. And you had the ending of the show.
TNA put on a show that had 2 excellent matches (Kong and Hamada vs Taylor and Sarita, and AJ vs Angle), but the rest was crap. And it wasn't new crap, it was crap fans had seen 10 years ago and stopped watching. The focus of the show was a possible nWo reunion, 2 excellent matches aren't going to make people stick with the company after a disastrous show like that.
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Post by ritt works hard fo da chickens on Jun 24, 2013 3:24:12 GMT -5
Easy, marketing and branding. What good is a show with all of those names if no one knows about it? Yeah, there was a lot of buzz online that night and excitement because of the Monday Night Wars being renewed but how much of the general public knew about this? That's been TNA's problem period. Good booking helps but TNA have never had enough of a marketing presence to be able to make their company known worldwide. Why do you think there are people who look at guys like Angle and Hardy and ask them why they aren't wrestling anymore? The company just come off so second rate and rinky dinky too at times that it's hard to ever buy them as big time. Remember, this was still the Impact Zone days. If they had the right marketing, used the talents they had the right way to be effective and had the atmosphere they do now with live shows then we might have had a different story. Instead we do have a flop and what if, which is a lot of what comprises TNA's history. To further elaborate on this. The only people who really were hyped to this were the more insider fans. Fans who sarcastically predicted it would just be Hogan pushing his friends and the people who were from his Australia tour. Which with the exception of Brother Bruti were pretty much spot on. When the exagerated joke is true it becomes less funny and more sad. Plus the main "LoL TNA" sentiment seemed to come from the new crowd. From Hogan and Bischoff burying TNAs past to all the "new" old faces showing up all the originals it left quite a sour taste in the mouths of long time TNA fans. I mean why care about a company that says everything we've done previously was crap but we're not crap anymore. Seriously, we promise this time for real.
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Post by AnActualBear on Jun 24, 2013 3:43:57 GMT -5
Simple really, it's still TNA. You can try and put ribbons and bows on the turd, but it's still a turd. I've said it before, but they need to change that stupid name and have a consistent period of good programming, preferably at least 3 years. People associate TNA with "old guys who can't wrestle anymore, young guys who don't get to show what they can do, and horrible booking". This was their one chance to get some new fans by slowly introducing big stars like Hardy, RVD etc in addition to the guys like AJ, Daniels etc. Instead they did the most Russorific show possible and within 2 months they were doing a 0.5.
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Post by ZombieElvis on Jun 24, 2013 4:29:15 GMT -5
TNA should have built the show on big names to draw new fans and homegrown TNA stars to show them something different. If you got Hogan, Nash, Hall and Hardy, you don't really need all of the other old star.
Get rid of: Nasty Boyz Val Venis X Pac (People remember him more for DX than nWo and wasn't needed) Orlando Jordan Bubba the love sponge
Do something different with Lashley and don't let him bring his wife to work.
Change the steel cage match to Homicide, Lethal, Sabin and Shelley in an Ultimate X match with the winner getting a X division title shot later in the night. Have the winner become the new champion to give new fans a moment to remember and really show off the X division.
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Post by cabbageboy on Jun 24, 2013 9:33:05 GMT -5
TNA is sometimes good at hyping up a show incessantly and drawing a 1 week rating, but they seem to never be able to build anything consistent. The Jan. 4 show was quite frankly terrible, debuting a bunch of old guys and putting on a 3 hour train wreck of Russo proportions. What hurt TNA after that show was that almost immediately they wanted to go to Monday nights, so the rest of the Thursday shows were sorta lame duck. Make no mistake, the whole Jan/Feb. 2010 period was horrific quality wise. Things got a bit better when they went to Mondays, but the ratings were so awful that they quickly went scurrying back to Thursday.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2013 9:49:54 GMT -5
Because all of those guys are huge stars in the WWE but for whatever reason they don't bring the same viewers over to TNA. I'm sure that a lot of fans that even casually look around the internet know that Hogan, Jeff, Flair, Angle or whoever else is/was in TNA, they just don't seem to care.
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Post by "American Cream" Dusty Loads on Jun 24, 2013 9:50:50 GMT -5
It was definitely in my top 5 worst episodes of a wrestling show ever.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2013 9:57:51 GMT -5
It wasn't as bad as 10/14/10, but it was still pretty bad. I get having Hulk Hogan for appearances, sponsorship deals, and name recognition, but to build an entire show around him in 2010 is stupid.
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Post by A Platypus Rave on Jun 24, 2013 10:18:09 GMT -5
For one The show started off on a bad foot with a bright orange cage that was difficult to see through which ended because homicide couldn't actually climb out of... Then Jeff Hardy came out and sat on top of it for seemingly no reason.
Terrible skits peppered through out the show of TBP playing strip poker which only seemed to introduce Val Venis a mid carder from like 15 years ago doing pretty much the same schtick people got tired of 10.
The nasty boys being employed in 2010
Hogan burying the company (and a minor note byt at the same time destroying the story they were building.... "I've been in the ack all day!" After they spent the first hour hyping his arrival really made it seem kinda low rate)
NWO rehash number 9888683...now with drunk Nash horribly out of shape Scott Hall xpac who I'm pretty sure more people would recognize as part of dx over the NWO.... Also we can't use the new world order name... So well use the ultra generic name of The Band.
So basically it came down to TNA running a bad show on one of the most important nights they've had.
And both my brother and father who never watched TNA had the same reaction.
They did however enjoy the house show we went to that week which featured exactly none of the people who debuted that Monday... And Mick Foley who sounded almost apologetic when he mentioned the Monday show.
Also that house show was mostly full... Cut to a year later and we had tickets for the same place, time, and day of the week... And it was only half full...
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