Hawk Hart
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Sold his organs.
The Best There Is, the Best There Was, and the Best That There Ever Will Be
Posts: 15,296
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Post by Hawk Hart on Oct 21, 2014 17:17:22 GMT -5
Actually, it's a damn big difference. It's the entire point, where this is him going off and doing his job for the attention of this crowd. It is not the same as some jackass bum rushing him on the street when he's trying to drink. But that still doesn't give the audience a right to film his performance. If a human being (Chris Rock) asks another human being (the guy filming) to not film him and he continues doing it, why is there an obligation to keep performing if this was a surprise set? You can't receive something, take it for granted, and expect to continue receiving it. That's not how life works. Pretty much this. Then you look at it from the comedian point of view. My first gig was 10 minutes where I only got to do like 5 because two drunk girls in the audience wouldn't stop talking. That's pretty f***ing cutting.
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Mozenrath
FANatic
Foppery and Whim
Speedy Speed Boy
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Post by Mozenrath on Oct 21, 2014 17:17:51 GMT -5
Not getting into the human aspect, which I do agree with, the whole idea is that they are testing unfinished material, and beyond it offering an incomplete view of the performer and unfair one, it also assures his material will be stolen. It's Chris f***ing Rock, people WILL rip him off if he lets people tape him working out material.
Big comedians either perform on short notice or for cheap or small venues when they do stuff like this, and it lets them work out what works or doesn't, or change jokes to work better.
Let's put it this way. If you are a director, do you want your dailies leaked? Is that fair? What about as a writer, for people to put your rough drafts out without permission, just because you asked them to look at them and tell you what they thought? It is just shitty for people to do.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Oct 21, 2014 17:18:46 GMT -5
I don't think I have ever been to a comedy club or play where video recordings was allowed.
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Post by Michael Coello on Oct 21, 2014 17:21:34 GMT -5
Well, now I think I know the problem. No, Chris Rock is not the same as whatever other person, you me or whoever, getting filmed. Dude is a world famous comedian, actor, director, producer, etc. His appearance, like it or not, is seem as a BIG FREAKIN DEAL, for good reason. Also, If he was with his kids on a trip, yeah he has all rights to that privacy. If he was walking to the store, yeah, don't put a camera in his face. But he's on a stage, looking to perform. All bets are off there. People have ALL THE RIGHT to take a damn picture or clip of it, just as much as he has the right to walk out when they did that. Just as you all have the right to call those fans jackasses, I have to right to call HIM one. What does your moral compass say about piracy in general? Do you have any appreciation for the idea of supporting artists? Or are they just empty vessels that exist for our amusement no matter which way we can get it? It's no different than musicians wanting you to pay for music, Chris Rock's livelihood is on perfecting those jokes in clubs and putting it on TV so it affects his business for that stuff to leak. Yes, you CAN record it, but it's a dick move. If you wish to claim to have any respect for the artist it's especially a dick move. It doesn't matter how rich he is already, this is his trade and he's protecting his work. Really? Piracy? Again, I admit he had the right to walk away, but it still makes him look bad, especially for someone who is a big performer and can't handle a jackass in the crowd not doing what he wants. Jeez, if this was as bad as you all say it is, why wasn't he just simply kicked out so Rock could continue?
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chazraps
Wade Wilson
Better have my money when I come-a collect!
Posts: 27,846
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Post by chazraps on Oct 21, 2014 17:27:32 GMT -5
What does your moral compass say about piracy in general? Do you have any appreciation for the idea of supporting artists? Or are they just empty vessels that exist for our amusement no matter which way we can get it? It's no different than musicians wanting you to pay for music, Chris Rock's livelihood is on perfecting those jokes in clubs and putting it on TV so it affects his business for that stuff to leak. Yes, you CAN record it, but it's a dick move. If you wish to claim to have any respect for the artist it's especially a dick move. It doesn't matter how rich he is already, this is his trade and he's protecting his work. Really? Piracy? Again, I admit he had the right to walk away, but it still makes him look bad, especially for someone who is a big performer and can't handle a jackass in the crowd not doing what he wants. Jeez, if this was as bad as you all say it is, why wasn't he just simply kicked out so Rock could continue? How does it make him look bad? Have you read this thread?
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Oct 21, 2014 17:31:15 GMT -5
What does your moral compass say about piracy in general? Do you have any appreciation for the idea of supporting artists? Or are they just empty vessels that exist for our amusement no matter which way we can get it? It's no different than musicians wanting you to pay for music, Chris Rock's livelihood is on perfecting those jokes in clubs and putting it on TV so it affects his business for that stuff to leak. Yes, you CAN record it, but it's a dick move. If you wish to claim to have any respect for the artist it's especially a dick move. It doesn't matter how rich he is already, this is his trade and he's protecting his work. Really? Piracy? Again, I admit he had the right to walk away, but it still makes him look bad, especially for someone who is a big performer and can't handle a jackass in the crowd not doing what he wants. Jeez, if this was as bad as you all say it is, why wasn't he just simply kicked out so Rock could continue? So I guess your answer is you don't respect artists. I'm not saying it's a big deal, it's just a thing that happened that we're responding to, you're coming at this more emotionally than anyone else. Yes it's piracy, he has material that he wants to keep low key until he's ready to release it officially and make money off of it. You think you would feel better if he kicked the guy out or is it millionaire Chris Rock thinking he's the king of the world still? The definition of stand up comedy isn't "tell jokes and battle pricks." You talk about his obligation to joke his way out of it and make them feel shitty but that's not on him, or any comedian to do that, some of them have to, to make money, for sure. Chris Rock's situation was that it wasn't worth it, so he walked.
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Mozenrath
FANatic
Foppery and Whim
Speedy Speed Boy
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Post by Mozenrath on Oct 21, 2014 17:33:06 GMT -5
Really? Piracy? Again, I admit he had the right to walk away, but it still makes him look bad, especially for someone who is a big performer and can't handle a jackass in the crowd not doing what he wants. Jeez, if this was as bad as you all say it is, why wasn't he just simply kicked out so Rock could continue? How does it make him look bad? Have you read this thread? While it is something I do not agree with, I think the idea is that he thinks it makes Rock look like a prima donna, while I'd argue having people ejected would do the same for people who would take it that way. I'm sure Rock could find another club to perform in, and he likely did, so if I was in that crowd, I'd be mighty pissed at the morons with the phones.
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Post by Michael Coello on Oct 21, 2014 17:33:30 GMT -5
Really? Piracy? Again, I admit he had the right to walk away, but it still makes him look bad, especially for someone who is a big performer and can't handle a jackass in the crowd not doing what he wants. Jeez, if this was as bad as you all say it is, why wasn't he just simply kicked out so Rock could continue? How does it make him look bad? Have you read this thread? Yeah, and that's why I said I was surprised about the reaction. Pretty much anytime someone just leaves a performance they are in the middle of, free or not, they get CRUCIFIXED. The only exception is if there's a threat, like someone throwing bottles or excrement.
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chazraps
Wade Wilson
Better have my money when I come-a collect!
Posts: 27,846
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Post by chazraps on Oct 21, 2014 17:36:54 GMT -5
How does it make him look bad? Have you read this thread? Yeah, and that's why I said I was surprised about the reaction. Pretty much anytime someone just leaves a performance they are in the middle of, free or not, they get CRUCIFIXED. The only exception is if there's a threat, like someone throwing bottles or excrement. Filming it IS the threat of piracy. Making a duplicate of someone's work without their permission is the very definition of piracy. Should Rock have just stopped the show entirely at the detriment of the other comedians who were to go on stage after him or hold the audience hostage until the entitled prick in question decided to be a decent human being? Rock handled the situation the absolute best, and most unfortunate, way he possibly could.
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Post by Kevin Hamilton on Oct 21, 2014 17:37:34 GMT -5
The idea that filming someone who doesn't want to be filmed is totally cool is frankly more than a lil weird.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Oct 21, 2014 17:40:33 GMT -5
The idea that filming someone who doesn't want to be filmed is totally cool is frankly more than a lil weird. I'm saying, though! I thought we were past having to "discuss" this... Filming or taking photographs of a person who has said they didn't want to be filmed, regardless of who they are is creepyshot behavior at best.Doing it at a time and a place that flat-out says you can't film...? What do you expect to happen and how do you expect people to react when you film anyway?
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Oct 21, 2014 17:41:54 GMT -5
The idea that filming someone who doesn't want to be filmed is totally cool is frankly more than a lil weird. Pretty spooky to me the way that mindset seems to be becoming a taboo. How does it make him look bad? Have you read this thread? Yeah, and that's why I said I was surprised about the reaction. Pretty much anytime someone just leaves a performance they are in the middle of, free or not, they get CRUCIFIXED. The only exception is if there's a threat, like someone throwing bottles or excrement. Or: context makes every case different and Chris Rock walking out on a show because people are filming against his wishes is different than Jack White walking out on people who paid to see him because they aren't giving him enough "energy".
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Post by Michael Coello on Oct 21, 2014 17:45:08 GMT -5
Yeah, and that's why I said I was surprised about the reaction. Pretty much anytime someone just leaves a performance they are in the middle of, free or not, they get CRUCIFIXED. The only exception is if there's a threat, like someone throwing bottles or excrement. Filming it IS the threat of piracy. Making a duplicate of someone's work without their permission is the very definition of piracy. Should Rock have just stopped the show entirely at the detriment of the other comedians who were to go on stage after him or hold the audience hostage until the entitled prick in question decided to be a decent human being? Rock handled the situation the absolute best, and most unfortunate, way he possibly could. Again with the piracy. Maybe you guys can please stop dog-piling on me and explain how this can possibly constitute a piracy issue? For your own words, this is some free show, a gift for people, which is why Rock was right for leaving, supposedly. Meaning he's not making any money on this and is not devaluing either his stand up or the value of the club itself. Also, as stand up goes, it really has less to do with jokes with Rock, and more with the rhythm of the stand up and going from point to point to point. Okay, new material, but are you trying to tell me that, when it comes to a stand up routine, what Chris rock was going to do in that club would be, point for point, the same exact performance from an HBO special or a new CD? No, it wouldn't. I wouldn't even doubt half of the jokes would have been replaced with better material, or something more topical by then. Or pretty much all of them. If the entire premise of this was training/getting back in the grove for him, this should affect jack and shit on him and his brand/product/etc. And you wanna compare that to piracy? Please!
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mizerable
Fry's dog Seymour
You're the lowest on the totem pole here, Alva. The lowest.
Posts: 23,475
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Post by mizerable on Oct 21, 2014 17:46:33 GMT -5
^I think you need to take note from Chris Rock and just walk away...
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Post by Michael Coello on Oct 21, 2014 17:46:37 GMT -5
Doing it at a time and a place that flat-out says you can't film...? Again, does it, or does it not? If it is expressly forbidden, then again, why was he not kicked out or forced to drop the phone? you would think security would be on him, to break an expressly written rule.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Oct 21, 2014 17:48:35 GMT -5
Doing it at a time and a place that flat-out says you can't film...? Again, does it, or does it not? If it is expressly forbidden, then again, why was he not kicked out or forced to drop the phone? you would think security would be on him, to break an expressly written rule. Are you saying he had every right to film anyway just because The Shield didn't come out to drag him into the parking lot and powerbomb him into a dumpster...? I don't understand how that makes what he's doing acceptable.
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Push R Truth
Patti Mayonnaise
Unique and Special Snowflake, and a pants-less heathen.
Perpetually Constipated
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Post by Push R Truth on Oct 21, 2014 17:50:12 GMT -5
I'm just going to pretend it was Carlos Mencia trying to record the material so he can steal it.
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Post by Michael Coello on Oct 21, 2014 17:51:22 GMT -5
Again, does it, or does it not? If it is expressly forbidden, then again, why was he not kicked out or forced to drop the phone? you would think security would be on him, to break an expressly written rule. Are you saying he had every right to film anyway just because The Shield didn't come out to drag him into the parking lot and powerbomb him into a dumpster...? I don't understand how that makes what he's doing acceptable. Again, was what that person did against the rules of the club or not? Was he expressly forbidden to do that when he got his ticket, or when he got to the building, for that show? Not even just for Chris Rock, but for the entire segment, was it something the MC warned the crowd about before it started. To borrow from a previous post, context is important.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Oct 21, 2014 17:54:14 GMT -5
Doing it at a time and a place that flat-out says you can't film...? Again, does it, or does it not? If it is expressly forbidden, then again, why was he not kicked out or forced to drop the phone? you would think security would be on him, to break an expressly written rule. It does. And I also would like to know why security or the host didn't do something about it. From the host's description of the night. One person started filming. Rock told him stop. Another person started filming right after he told the first person not to and then Rock decided he'd rather not perform. If I was MCing that night I would have booted the guy right away. Also, the guy left, hanging his head in shame apparently after Rock walked off. The only thing I can imagine is that it was easier for Rock to see the camera recording him and the host didn't realize the second person was filming until it was too late. On top of that I'd imagine comics would be intimidated to interrupt Chris Rock's set unless it were absolutely necessary. Rock could have requested those two people be removed, but then people would accused him of being a "diva" or "egomaniac" as well for having people removed. But they paid to see the adverstised performers, not the surprise guest so he probably felt like, "Well, I'll just let them see the show they paid for and go do my set somewhere else."
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Post by xCompackx on Oct 21, 2014 17:56:08 GMT -5
Again, does it, or does it not? If it is expressly forbidden, then again, why was he not kicked out or forced to drop the phone? you would think security would be on him, to break an expressly written rule. Are you saying he had every right to film anyway just because The Shield didn't come out to drag him into the parking lot and powerbomb him into a dumpster...? I don't understand how that makes what he's doing acceptable. Speaking of wrestling, WWE does explicitly forbid video recording yet people still do it. You can't completely rely on the venue to enforce a rule and then blame the talent when they respond to someone breaking said rule.
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