Will Cena be remembered as a draw?

[Jiren]

Maybe in the same vein as Bret/Shawn in the mid 90s, but that's about it

[.]

Honestly, No.

[Deleted]

For himself in terms of merch/constant on screen presence often at expense of others? Yes.

For the company in terms of business improving after stabilizing slightly? No. Absolute not.

There is a little bit of false logic about Cena's merchandise holding the WWE up over the last few years, when they're a highly profitable company without that (their sponsorship money matters more than any amount of Cena tees) but on the same hand the company fanbase has not grown. The fanbase is still slipping down numbers wise which is why so many of us so-called hardcore fans seemingly make up a larger contingent than you'd see 12 years ago, we're more vocal as many of us get terribly bored before we stop watching the shows full stop/stop investing in tickets, and there's not enough new fans being created to truly counteract the moodiness and less acceptance of terrible stories/filler in the product.

The only time of year where that gets forgotten is Wrestlemania season because both old and new fans -I'd argue against the idea non-wrestling fans paying the PPV cost to see it- watch it for the marquee value it has, for nostalgia, because you're guaranteed to see The Rock, or Hogan, or Stone Cold, or Brock Lesnar...people who've drawn prior. People who are pulled in to pick up buyrates.

In short, Cena will be the unfortunate victim of being the billboard/avatar of a decade of disappointment, wasted potential, and repetitive drivel. Is that on him? Most probably not, but it doesn't matter, he's the face of the company whose own fans turn against in favour of The Rock, Brock Lesnar, CM Punk, Daniel Bryan, or whoever he faces. That is NEVER a good thing.

He'll be seen as a legend, but he'll be a Bret Hart/Shawn Michaels legend, known as someone who gave a lot to wrestling but were the faces of a downtime creatively where fans got tired of the product and left for greener pastures.

[________ has left the building]

Yes, he will. Granted not on the level of Hogan, Rock, and Austin but much higher than the New Generation brood. Like it or not, Cena been propping up WWE for almost a decade.

[Viking Hall]

The thing is hardcore wrestling fans that post on message boards, look up news and discuss the wrestling world outside of kayfabe don't tend to be the ones that dictate who and what becomes huge. If they did ECW would be around today as the #1 promotion in the world, WCW's 'worked shoot' style would have seemed relevant and the wrestlers that monopolise the main event scene would all be technical wizards. The people who do dictate are the kids and the casual fans that will just tune out if the programming gets boring. What do the kids and the casual fans want? A larger than life superstar who they can rally behind. There's a reason why the Hulk Hogan's, the Ultimate Warrior's and the Rock's of this world got to the places they did and it wasn't by catering to the hardcore fan, it was by being in your face and by essentially being a brand that anyone could recognise. Cena is the same.

You put John Cena's face onto something, it will sell. Put, say, Tyson Kidd's face on something and it won't. What's the difference? On paper Tyson Kidd has it all, he's the better wrestler, he's younger and he's got a good look but he hasn't got that larger than life, superhuman attraction that appeals to kids and old Johnny Channel-Flicker who's sat at home. So, without a doubt Cena is a draw. You can call it manufactured, but then you can say the same about all the others too. Would Hulk Hogan be where he is today if he'd remained as Terry Boulder? Would The Rock be hobnobbing in Hollywood if he'd carried on as Rocky Maivia, tassels and all? And was anyone really taking notice of Steve Austin when he was Stunning Steve with the robes and the long blonde hair? Not really no.

The fact is that Cena is where he is today by being the complete package. He looks a million dollars, he has a moves that everyone knows and he has the kind of magnetism that's usually reserved for rockstars and Hollywood actors. Is he becoming stale? Well, yeah. But then he's also been around for over a decade at the very top of his profession and with no end in sight. The Rock had five or six years after being repackaged as The Rock with some of that interrupted by stints in Hollywood. Steve Austin, again five or six years at the top, with breaks for surgeries and with possibly the greatest supporting cast ever assembled around him. Hogan's run in the WWF may have spanned a decade, but came at a time when he was nowhere near as exposed and also came in the most revolutionary era in Professional Wrestling and arguably the biggest boom period ever. By the time the industry had changed with live weekly shows and he was expected to do what he does on a weekly basis he became stale almost overnight and it took the biggest storyline in history to change that.

With those factors in mind, it's absolutely astonishing that Cena is as popular as he is. He doesn't have the calibre of talent that those that came before him had supporting him, he's wrestled in an era where the industry as a whole is in a slump and he's done it for a really long time too. Yet he's still a bona fide superstar and someone that's well known in the entertainment industry and by 'outsiders' too. That's not something just anyone can achieve. And the thing is, is there anyone that can actually take his place? Not really no. You had CM Punk and you've got Daniel Bryan, but would either of those actually be able to transcend just being a wrestler like Cena, Hogan, The Rock etc or would they have just been the best alternatives like Shawn Michaels or Bret Hart? I personally think the latter.

So, is he a draw? Undeniably and possibly the only true draw WWE has had since the Attitude era. Am I a fan? No, but as I stated before, I don't have to be.

[Mid-Carder]

I think for a long time WWE itself has been the draw so it's not entirely down to Cena. But considering they've had to offer refunds for live tours when he's been out injured, he's certainly a draw. I've been to enough live shows to know plenty of people buy tickets to see him

[The Ichi]

If you think about it, a big reason why crowds seem so dead these days is that a lot of the crowd probably consists of bored parents that caved after their kids nagged them to buy tickets.

There's a reason Cena is their panic button. He brings in the crowd that they're aiming for. You can't compare him to Hogan, Austin and The Rock since the only people that measure up to Hogan, Austin and The Rock are...Hogan, Austin and The Rock.

[Bear Skin Rug]

He's absolutely a Top 5 WWF/E draw, but also someone who had the biggest hand in alienating the product from the loyal audience of the 90s and prevented any meaningful mainstream crossover that would create new fans. His drawing power is just so insular. He's been the face of wrestling for almost a decade and yet his pop-culture relevance is non-existent.

[angryfan]

Here's the problem, he draws "his fans". That's the whole point of his character that isn't a character. It's great, as long as you have something to draw other people in. They don't have that, nor do they see a need for that, which is why the "shows that matter" like Mania do not, and never will, rely on Cena' drawing power, they rely on names from the past.

Here's my point. If Cena, and the audience he brings, is the overall goal, then there should be no need to bring in Lesnar, or The Rock, or Hogan, or anyone else for WrestleMania. Either the event sells itself, or "the guy" sells it. It can't be anything else, since no one else on the card is worth a damn in terms of drawing power.

They've just booked themselves into a corner with the last ten years. All the eggs in one basket, and Mania now has no draw that is a regular. Taker's streak is dead, Cena vs. whatever monster du jour will bring some people, but it won't sell out a stadium. So...what do they do? Bring in the same three or four guys for a Mania payday since those guys appealed toa wider audience, and then hope the combined audiences are enough to sell out the place.

[Bub (BLM)]

Oct 22, 2014 15:41:43 GMT -5 angryfan said:

Here's the problem, he draws "his fans". That's the whole point of his character that isn't a character. It's great, as long as you have something to draw other people in. They don't have that, nor do they see a need for that, which is why the "shows that matter" like Mania do not, and never will, rely on Cena' drawing power, they rely on names from the past.

Here's my point. If Cena, and the audience he brings, is the overall goal, then there should be no need to bring in Lesnar, or The Rock, or Hogan, or anyone else for WrestleMania. Either the event sells itself, or "the guy" sells it. It can't be anything else, since no one else on the card is worth a damn in terms of drawing power.

They've just booked themselves into a corner with the last ten years. All the eggs in one basket, and Mania now has no draw that is a regular. Taker's streak is dead, Cena vs. whatever monster du jour will bring some people, but it won't sell out a stadium. So...what do they do? Bring in the same three or four guys for a Mania payday since those guys appealed toa wider audience, and then hope the combined audiences are enough to sell out the place.

All of that falls on the fact that they won't build any other Superstar up to Cena's level. Instead of aiming to have a company full of mega-star babyfaces, they cut all the other guys off at the knees and feed their heat to Cena. It's wholly frustrating. The problem isn't pushing John Cena, it's the glass ceiling they instal over anyone who isn't him. Ryback is the biggest example of their complete idiocy when it comes to this very topic.

[MichaelMartini]

Oct 22, 2014 15:26:43 GMT -5 Bear Skin Rug said:

He's absolutely a Top 5 WWF/E draw, but also someone who had the biggest hand in alienating the product from the loyal audience of the 90s and prevented any meaningful mainstream crossover that would create new fans. His drawing power is just so insular. He's been the face of wrestling for almost a decade and yet his pop-culture relevance is non-existent.

That's a good point. For as many people as he's drawn to the product, he's probably turned away roughly the same number. In that sense, he's a worse draw than Bret because I doubt anyone turned away from the product because he was getting pushed.

[abjordans]

I honestly don't see how you could go to even 1 WWE show and not see that Cena is a draw. It is not an exaggeration to say that most of the crowd is there to cheer or boo Cena. That is not something the WWE just made up. Also, I feel he is much more well known to the general public.that is being let on here. Definitely much more known than Bret or HBK were when on top.

Why wouldn't WWE continue to ride the Cebna train until it comes off the tracks? Anytime a guy gets in striking distance they prove them right. CM Punk was too much of a selfish asshole. You can't be the face of a public company when it is a well known fact that you will be a dick to someone just for speaking to you. CM Punk gets mad that people want to be nice to him. Think about that. Also, despite this weird notion that Daniel Bryan had the ball taken from him that as taken over, that is not that happened. His body literally broke down on him as soon as he got to the top.

Lastly, WWE is nowhere near the shape they were in in 1995. Not even in the ballpark. 1995 WWE couldn't draw 80,000 people to a WM no matter what they did. Things are different now. WWE is a publicly traded corporation. They don't have a draw anymore. They have a face and someone who makes them the most money. That is John Cena. No other way to spin it.

[blackmegaman]

You could easily make the argument that the WWE name/brand itself is the main "draw" , but he is a LARGE reason why a lot of people go to those shows so yes he's a draw. Plus , no one argues the drawing power/legacy of guys like Luger/Sting/Von Erichs/DDP/etc... and Cena I would think is just as important to bringing people in to watch the shows as any of those guys were . And heck lets bring it to today's American wrestling landscape....if he isn't considered a draw in the last 10 years who is ?....AJ , Joe , Lashley , Daniels , Sabin , Aries ?

[Deleted]

He’s probably made more money for the company than anyone else in its history. Yes, inflation and length of run on top play a part in that too but the fact that this question is even being asked is a little ridiculous.

[Deleted]

One thing some people seem to be ignoring is that the question is, "Will he be remembered as a draw?" not, "Is he a draw?" And in that respect, I'm inclined to say no.

[The Trashman]

No. All he does is sell merch to kids. He is a better Rey Mysterio in that regard and no one thinks of him as a draw anywhere but Mexico.

[Viking Hall]

Oct 22, 2014 18:16:45 GMT -5 Lizuka #BLM said:

One thing some people seem to be ignoring is that the question is, "Will he be remembered as a draw?" not, "Is he a draw?" And in that respect, I'm inclined to say no.

I don't see how he can't be remembered. He has been the main focus for the best part of a decade, is a multiple-time World Champion, has made more money than just about anyone in wrestling and looks set to continue to carry on doing all of those things well into his forties. It's impossible for him not to be remembered in history as a draw since on paper he pretty much stands alone.

[Deleted]

Oct 22, 2014 18:29:15 GMT -5 Viking Hall said:

Oct 22, 2014 18:16:45 GMT -5 Lizuka #BLM said:

One thing some people seem to be ignoring is that the question is, "Will he be remembered as a draw?" not, "Is he a draw?" And in that respect, I'm inclined to say no.

I don't see how he can't be remembered. He has been the main focus for the best part of a decade, is a multiple-time World Champion, has made more money than just about anyone in wrestling and looks set to continue to carry on doing all of those things well into his forties. It's impossible for him not to be remembered in history as a draw since on paper he pretty much stands alone.

I just don't think that's how people will look at him. He's not going to be seen as a face of the business during a hot period like a Rock, Austin, or Hogan or an all-time great icon, he's going to be seen as the face of the company for a lengthy period of time where the company stagnated for a far longer period of time than it ever had prior, and despite being the face of the company for at least ten years if not longer he's never at all managed to make much of an impact on the popular consciousness or cause the industry to expand.

[ededdneddy]

Oct 22, 2014 16:54:44 GMT -5 abjordans said:

Why wouldn't WWE continue to ride the Cena train until it comes off the tracks? Anytime a guy gets in striking distance they prove them right. CM Punk was too much of a selfish asshole. You can't be the face of a public company when it is a well known fact that you will be a dick to someone just for speaking to you. CM Punk gets mad that people want to be nice to him. Think about that. Also, despite this weird notion that Daniel Bryan had the ball taken from him that as taken over, that is not that happened. His body literally broke down on him as soon as he got to the top.

I always felt that Punk has been a bitter person way before he aired his grievances during the Pipebomb. So many times they make things happen for him but they would quickly pull the rug from under his feet and let him fall. So much build up made him a bitter person and his WWE Title run was pretty much the final good thing that happened for him but once again the higher ups stick to what they know and throw everything else out the window just for their own benefits.

[xCompackx]

I don't see history being kind to John Cena. I have a feeling people are going to think of him as having an artificial legacy and a forced HOF spot.