Dreamer/Bram Hardcore Match Depreciation thread

[benstudd]

I was sleeping through Impact Wrestling and this match actually woke me up. I was like this show is so boring but these guys are giving their all. I especially like the finisher Bram used at the end, the elevated DDT? Gangrel used to do that and i always thought this was an underrated finisher.

I wish Bram would do something else at this point, though. All he does is garbage matches.

[OVO 40 hunched over like he 80]

Nov 20, 2014 15:34:45 GMT -5 benstudd said:

I was sleeping through Impact Wrestling and this match actually woke me up. I was like this show is so boring but these guys are giving their all. I especially like the finisher Bram used at the end, the elevated DDT? Gangrel used to do that and i always thought this was an underrated finisher.

I wish Bram would do something else at this point, though. All he does is garbage matches.

Shit you're right all he does is hardcore wrestling, damn it, they gave that spot to Nigel at the end, hope that he doesn't get hep b also

[Magic knows Black Lives Matter]

Nov 20, 2014 14:40:03 GMT -5 SCCB Was Told To Do Steroids said:

All in all, a sad match. I just remember thinking of Paul Heyman's justification for the overnight success of ECW not simply being chairshots. ECW had legit stories. They had heart. They had ring psychology. They had Terry Funk giving younger guys a deeply discerned motivation for wielding a hot branding iron on another human being. They had Benoit, Eddie, Malenko, and Rey as well as Taz and Sandman.

What last night was a fifty-year-old schlub nut-shotting a gullible kid who thinks this is the best its going to get for the foreseeable future, seeing as though Florida has way better weather than London.

That's the main reason why I'm going in on Dreamer. Obviously, it takes two to tango but you can chalk it up to Bram simply not knowing any better because he's fairly young (which isn't really a good excuse considering how much information there is about this kind of stuff but hey). Dreamer, on the other hand, has been wrestling for over 20 years. He, of all people, should know better than to do shit like this. Talk about not learning a thing from the past.

[BlackoutCreature]

What happened to Dreamer anyways? Physically I mean? Between like House of Hardcore 3 (November 2013) and TNA's NYC tapings over the summer he looked like he aged ten years. Is he injured?

[Mayonnaise]

Nov 20, 2014 18:34:59 GMT -5 BlackoutCreature said:

What happened to Dreamer anyways? Physically I mean? Between like House of Hardcore 3 (November 2013) and TNA's NYC tapings over the summer he looked like he aged ten years. Is he injured?

I believe he's mentioned back issues in the past but not sure really.

[chrom]

Dreamer's probably one of the biggest hypocrites in wrestling. Talks about how guys need to forge their own legacy aside from doing what ECW did and then goes out and talks and sobs about it and how he wishes to bring the spirit of it back and blames WWE and calls them a little PG product, while gladly taking royalties from them.

I wonder if he realizes that WWE kept him revelant long after his expiration date expired.

[Emmet Russell]

Dreamer claims he's never doing anymore ECW stuff after Hardcore Justice 2010, yet here he is in 2014 still doing the same old ECW style match and owning a promotion called House of Hardcore with people like Danny Doring and Steven Richards and Sandman and Spike Dudley and himself -- who's he fooling?

I wish people actually knew what ECW and their legacy was: it was a place for young, under-utilised talent to get a chance to perform and make names for themselves. Not a place for has-beens to keep doing the same old tired act to the point that it's nauseating. Dreamer holding onto it and TNA exploiting it hurts the companies image no end.

ECW has been dead for 13 years. Almost as long as TNA has been around.

[CATCH_US IS the Conversation]

Nov 20, 2014 20:57:08 GMT -5 Emmet Russell said:

Dreamer claims he's never doing anymore ECW stuff after Hardcore Justice 2010, yet here he is in 2014 still doing the same old ECW style match and owning a promotion called House of Hardcore with people like Danny Doring and Steven Richards and Sandman and Spike Dudley and himself -- who's he fooling?

I wish people actually knew what ECW and their legacy was: it was a place for young, under-utilised talent to get a chance to perform and make names for themselves. Not a place for has-beens to keep doing the same old tired act to the point that it's nauseating. Dreamer holding onto it and TNA exploiting it hurts the companies image no end.

ECW has been dead for 13 years. Almost as long as TNA has been around.

ECW is how Dreamer made a name for himself. But he created House of Hardcore to give others the same chance that ECW gave him. Yeah you got the ECW dinosaurs running around, but those guys are going to work as long as they can physically go if only bring eyes to the younger generation.

The ECW guys are old timers done right. They're big enough to draw interest in a show, but they're not too big that they'll cast a shadow over everything, be presented as demigods above everyone else, or hit Dixie up for enough money to feed a small country for a year.

[Emmet Russell]

Nov 20, 2014 21:16:29 GMT -5 CATCH_US IS the Conversation said:

Nov 20, 2014 20:57:08 GMT -5 Emmet Russell said:

Dreamer claims he's never doing anymore ECW stuff after Hardcore Justice 2010, yet here he is in 2014 still doing the same old ECW style match and owning a promotion called House of Hardcore with people like Danny Doring and Steven Richards and Sandman and Spike Dudley and himself -- who's he fooling?

I wish people actually knew what ECW and their legacy was: it was a place for young, under-utilised talent to get a chance to perform and make names for themselves. Not a place for has-beens to keep doing the same old tired act to the point that it's nauseating. Dreamer holding onto it and TNA exploiting it hurts the companies image no end.

ECW has been dead for 13 years. Almost as long as TNA has been around.

ECW is how Dreamer made a name for himself. But he created House of Hardcore to give others the same chance that ECW gave him. Yeah you got the ECW dinosaurs running around, but those guys are going to work as long as they can physically go if only bring eyes to the younger generation.

The ECW guys are old timers done right. They're big enough to draw interest in a show, but they're not too big that they'll cast a shadow over everything, be presented as demigods above everyone else, or hit Dixie up for enough money to feed a small country for a year.

I've enjoyed most of the HOH shows and that's not because of the old ECW talent. I'd love to agree with you about Dreamer creating HOH to give others the same chance as him, but I seriously doubt that at this point. He was front and centre of the latest poster and that included talent like The Hardys and The Young Bucks -- there's no reason he should be promoted above those guys. He did it just to keep ECW alive in a way that's not going to get himself sued by the WWE.

[Hurbster]

Welp, Foley was right all those years ago about Tommy.

[benstudd]

Nov 20, 2014 17:50:32 GMT -5 OVO 40 hunched over like he 80 said:

Nov 20, 2014 15:34:45 GMT -5 benstudd said:

I was sleeping through Impact Wrestling and this match actually woke me up. I was like this show is so boring but these guys are giving their all. I especially like the finisher Bram used at the end, the elevated DDT? Gangrel used to do that and i always thought this was an underrated finisher.

I wish Bram would do something else at this point, though. All he does is garbage matches.

Shit you're right all he does is hardcore wrestling, damn it, they gave that spot to Nigel at the end, hope that he doesn't get hep b also

They should use the opportunity to turn Bram into a vampire. He even has the name for it.

[OVO 40 hunched over like he 80]

I just remember Dreamer's episode on Austin's podcast, Steve was grilling him about continuing to do the ECW style and not caring about brain damage and fn Dreamer saying that he wasn't going to change his style despite the fact that he was developing memory loss.

[chrom]

What an idiot

[67 more]

Not only was there a hardcore match where Dreamer wasn't atomic dropped onto something, he himself atomic dropped Bram onto a chair. I consider that progress for Dreamer.

[________ has left the building]

Nov 21, 2014 11:02:39 GMT -5 67 more said:

Not only was there a hardcore match where Dreamer wasn't atomic dropped onto something, he himself atomic dropped Bram onto a chair. I consider that progress for Dreamer.

They are saving him get hit in the balls by a concrete block for the first Impact on Destination America. 

[Deleted]

Nov 20, 2014 18:06:53 GMT -5 Magic knows Black Lives Matter said:

Nov 20, 2014 14:40:03 GMT -5 SCCB Was Told To Do Steroids said:

All in all, a sad match. I just remember thinking of Paul Heyman's justification for the overnight success of ECW not simply being chairshots. ECW had legit stories. They had heart. They had ring psychology. They had Terry Funk giving younger guys a deeply discerned motivation for wielding a hot branding iron on another human being. They had Benoit, Eddie, Malenko, and Rey as well as Taz and Sandman.

What last night was a fifty-year-old schlub nut-shotting a gullible kid who thinks this is the best its going to get for the foreseeable future, seeing as though Florida has way better weather than London.

That's the main reason why I'm going in on Dreamer. Obviously, it takes two to tango but you can chalk it up to Bram simply not knowing any better because he's fairly young (which isn't really a good excuse considering how much information there is about this kind of stuff but hey). Dreamer, on the other hand, has been wrestling for over 20 years. He, of all people, should know better than to do shit like this. Talk about not learning a thing from the past.

What would Dreamer learn from the past though? If anything, he'd learn that "hardcore = good" because that style of wrestling is responsible for him having success in the wrestling business. For him, hitting people with shit and getting hit with shit and bleeding all over the place has been positively reinforced since the mid 90s. And that's still happening, because there's still a market for it. There's still fans who think wrestling peaked with ECW and everything after blows, and those are the people that continue to line his pockets.

I don't really blame Dreamer, he's just doing what he's always done, TNA knows exactly what they're going to get.

[Magic knows Black Lives Matter]

Nov 20, 2014 23:04:46 GMT -5 OVO 40 hunched over like he 80 said:

I just remember Dreamer's episode on Austin's podcast, Steve was grilling him about continuing to do the ECW style and not caring about brain damage and fn Dreamer saying that he wasn't going to change his style despite the fact that he was developing memory loss.

Jesus Christ.

[Deleted]

Nov 20, 2014 23:04:46 GMT -5 OVO 40 hunched over like he 80 said:

I just remember Dreamer's episode on Austin's podcast, Steve was grilling him about continuing to do the ECW style and not caring about brain damage and fn Dreamer saying that he wasn't going to change his style despite the fact that he was developing memory loss.

Damn, dude. That's awful. What a warped thought-process.

I think he just doesn't know what else he would do if he wasn't in the wrestling business, and that style is the only thing keeping him in because that's the only reason people want to see Tommy Dreamer.

[Hypnosis]

Nov 21, 2014 11:46:17 GMT -5 Magic knows Black Lives Matter said:

"F*** you, Jesus Christ!"

[Magic knows Black Lives Matter]

Nov 21, 2014 11:46:12 GMT -5 @lovehater said:

Nov 20, 2014 18:06:53 GMT -5 Magic knows Black Lives Matter said:

That's the main reason why I'm going in on Dreamer. Obviously, it takes two to tango but you can chalk it up to Bram simply not knowing any better because he's fairly young (which isn't really a good excuse considering how much information there is about this kind of stuff but hey). Dreamer, on the other hand, has been wrestling for over 20 years. He, of all people, should know better than to do shit like this. Talk about not learning a thing from the past.

What would Dreamer learn from the past though? If anything, he'd learn that "hardcore = good" because that style of wrestling is responsible for him having success in the wrestling business. For him, hitting people with shit and getting hit with shit and bleeding all over the place has been positively reinforced since the mid 90s. And that's still happening, because there's still a market for it. There's still fans who think wrestling peaked with ECW and everything after blows, and those are the people that continue to line his pockets.

I don't really blame Dreamer, he's just doing what he's always done, TNA knows exactly what they're going to get.

At the same time, all he needs to do is take one look at most of his ECW buddies to see how stupid this shit is. Like, how many of his peers are physically wrecked or dead? Even if he experienced success with that style, he should be old enough to look at his past and be like, "man, I was an idiot." If you don't look at yourself from 20 years ago and think that, you aren't progressing. That's what makes me mad. The past is the past but it is 2014 and we have infinitely more knowledge about this stuff than than we did in 1996. How can you be in this business for so long and have so little hindsight? It's ignorance at it's finest and that's something I just won't tolerate. Ignorance deserves to be insulted and destroyed.

I'm not gonna pretend like matches like this will just stop happening because Dreamer stops doing them. There will always be young guys out there desperate for an opportunity that will do dumb shit like this. Dreamer, however, is only making the situation worse by participating in these matches and making it seem like they are still the way to go. He's an enabler.

Finally, if you absolutely have to do a match like this...HAVE IT MEAN SOMETHING. At least when Dreamer was doing this in the 90's, it was memorable because nobody had really done it before on such a consistent basis.  It is 2014. I can't think of a single spot I saw in this match that I was impressed by because I've seen it all 1000 times before. Nobody is gonna remember this shit in a month. At least the Hardys and the Dudleys got immortalized through video packages when they killed themselves in those TLC matches. Why kill yourself for no reward? Wrestling is a business about getting the most out of the least. These guys went out there and did the exact opposite.