chrom
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Post by chrom on Nov 26, 2014 11:21:09 GMT -5
I've never seen people come out of the woodwoorks like this with this kind of hate for AJ Styles. One, the move is a bit sketchy, but this only started happening in the last year. AJ's been using that move for around a decade before with no reported injuries from anyone, and now some of you are calling him a dangerous spot monkey who deserves to have his neck broken. Wow. Welcome to the IWC
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Post by Deleted on Nov 26, 2014 11:22:33 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Nov 26, 2014 11:32:13 GMT -5
I've never seen people come out of the woodwoorks like this with this kind of hate for AJ Styles. One, the move is a bit sketchy, but this only started happening in the last year. AJ's been using that move for around a decade before with no reported injuries from anyone, and now some of you are calling him a dangerous spot monkey who deserves to have his neck broken. Wow. Who here said AJ deserves to have his neck broken?
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Post by Just call me D.j.m. on Nov 26, 2014 11:36:15 GMT -5
Amazing how the pack of rats are out to make AJ the scapegoat when he's doing nothing wrong at all, I've seen The Clash, up close and personal as well and everytime he did it perfectly. He's done it on guys of all shapes and sizes including Minoru Suzuki, Abyss, and others. Lionheart admitted he lied to AJ about knowing how to take the move, and Yoshi claimed it was all his fault as well cause they didn't know what to do and tucked their heads in. If you're too stubborn or stupid enough to not know how to take the move or practice it with him, then perhaps you deserve to have your neck broken. It was this nugget of joy. Along with a cute little "welcome to the IWC" remark that's straight outta the YouTube comments.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 26, 2014 11:38:36 GMT -5
Amazing how the pack of rats are out to make AJ the scapegoat when he's doing nothing wrong at all, I've seen The Clash, up close and personal as well and everytime he did it perfectly. He's done it on guys of all shapes and sizes including Minoru Suzuki, Abyss, and others. Lionheart admitted he lied to AJ about knowing how to take the move, and Yoshi claimed it was all his fault as well cause they didn't know what to do and tucked their heads in. If you're too stubborn or stupid enough to not know how to take the move or practice it with him, then perhaps you deserve to have your neck broken. It was this nugget of joy. Re-read that post. They said the people who got hurt deserved it because they didn't want to go over the move with AJ.
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Post by Slammy Award-Winning Cannibal on Nov 26, 2014 11:41:20 GMT -5
It was this nugget of joy. Re-read that post. They said the people who got hurt deserved it because they didn't want to go over the move with AJ. Looks like me calling him a spot monkey seems pretty tame in retrospect, huh?
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Post by Mayonnaise on Nov 26, 2014 13:07:29 GMT -5
Every injury from it has been caused by the person taking the move, not by AJ. It's a pretty damn safe move, as long as the person takes it correctly, like most moves in wrestling. I think Richards was AJ's fault but Stevie may not have been injured either. Seems like some of these lanky guys he has trouble getting up enough. Like with Richards, AJ didn't get him up enough to get his head off the mat and he had no way to take the move but on his head. Tatsu seemed that way at the start but barely got him up enough for Tatsu to mess it up. Sad situation. Like was said, AJ has so many moves that it seems crazy to stick with the Clash. There could be a fun little angle run out of this where AJ loses a match and has it banned to explain why he stops using it and far down the line if absolutely needed they could use the move in another angle.
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Post by mcmahonfan85 on Nov 26, 2014 14:19:16 GMT -5
Reposting my thoughts from other areas on the web... gotten a little feedback there... I watched the Yoshi Tatsu gif multiple times last night, trying to figure out what happened... Did Yoshi tuck his chin, as is natural instinct of a wrestler? Yes. But that isn't the problem with the move. Watch the way AJ drops in the Clash. From my perspective on the Yoshi botch gif, AJ simply drops to his knees and leans forward... He has ZERO control over Yoshi's center of gravity, in his hips. So, while Yoshi's legs are coming forward, the rest of his body is coming straight down as AJ drops to his knees. Now, watch Cesaro's Neutralizer... it is essentially the same bump for the recipient, except that Cesaro never loses control of the two most vital parts of his opponent's body: the neck, and the hips. Cesaro's legs keep the opponent's neck covered and protected when he drops, and the locked arms around the hip secure them so that when Cesaro drops, he can throw the opponents hips forward, sending the center of gravity, from the hips up to the chest and neck, down onto the mat AT THE SAME TIME... spread out the bump over the maximum space, minimal injury. During AJ's Styles Clash, he has control over NEITHER of these parts of the body. I'm nowhere near an expert on the situation, but these are my observations. by landing only on his hands and knees (which is what he actually does in the gif), he lessens the actually impact of the move because he isn't landing on his opponents. thats the secret of the move, and if you go back and look, he pretty much always lands on his hands and knees: if you go back to the gif, there are buttons underneath it that let will let you watch it slowed down (as well as sped up) as well as being able to watch it in reverse, and if you do, you will see that AJ does the move the same way he always does it. the problem is that Yoshitatsu tucked his head. had he kept his head back, it would have been aligned with the rest of his body, which landed flat.
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Toates Madhackrviper
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Post by Toates Madhackrviper on Nov 27, 2014 2:08:40 GMT -5
I think the reaction to this is kind of ridiculous honestly. This string of injuries is bad luck on AJ's part and not to do with the move itself because he's been using it for how long now with no problems and then suddenly three f***ups in a short period and now its a HORRIBLE DANGEROUS MOVE AND MUST BE RETIRED. Doesn't make sense to me. Lets not forget that a lot of other wrestlers, including Tanahashi* from the same damn company, use the move or slight variations of it with no problems as well. (That I'm aware of and feel free to correct me if I'm wrong on any of this). Lets not forget that the safety obsessed WWE decided that the move was safe enough for the DIVAS. And yep, guess what, McCool never injured anyone with it. A string of injuries does not mean that a move is objectively unsafe, it could be bad luck and thats what the situation seems to be. ESPECIALLY when the problems with the move seem entirely on the receiving end's side. Excuse my sense of justice but I don't understand why Styles should have to retire his signature finisher because a few guys took his finisher incorrectly and got hurt. I can't fathom how thats his fault or how he should be punished for it. * This reminds me of the whole "Alicia Fox better stop using that scissor kick! It looks dangerous it MIGHT injure someone. It hasn't but it MIGHT" thing. At least this move is actually hurting people though I guess.
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Ultimo Gallos
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Post by Ultimo Gallos on Nov 27, 2014 2:27:20 GMT -5
I think the reaction to this is kind of ridiculous honestly. This string of injuries is bad luck on AJ's part and not to do with the move itself because he's been using it for how long now with no problems and then suddenly three f***ups in a short period and now its a HORRIBLE DANGEROUS MOVE AND MUST BE RETIRED. Doesn't make sense to me. Lets not forget that a lot of other wrestlers, including Tanahashi* from the same damn company, use the move or slight variations of it with no problems as well. (That I'm aware of and feel free to correct me if I'm wrong on any of this). Lets not forget that the safety obsessed WWE decided that the move was safe enough for the DIVAS. And yep, guess what, McCool never injured anyone with it. A string of injuries does not mean that a move is objectively unsafe, it could be bad luck and thats what the situation seems to be. ESPECIALLY when the problems with the move seem entirely on the receiving end's side. Excuse my sense of justice but I don't understand why Styles should have to retire his signature finisher because a few guys took his finisher incorrectly and got hurt. I can't fathom how thats his fault or how he should be punished for it. * This reminds me of the whole "Alicia Fox better stop using that scissor kick! It looks dangerous it MIGHT injure someone. It hasn't but it MIGHT" thing. At least this move is actually hurting people though I guess. Over the past decade Styles has injured people with the Styles Clash,this isn't just a recent thing. A local guy worked Styles back during the summer. And was worried cause supposedly Styles has a rep for being a bit reckless with his opponents.
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The Sam
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Post by The Sam on Nov 27, 2014 2:29:23 GMT -5
Styles should just give the clash back to Jimmy Rave. 0 people have been injured by the Rave Clash.
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Toates Madhackrviper
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Post by Toates Madhackrviper on Nov 27, 2014 2:30:26 GMT -5
I think the reaction to this is kind of ridiculous honestly. This string of injuries is bad luck on AJ's part and not to do with the move itself because he's been using it for how long now with no problems and then suddenly three f***ups in a short period and now its a HORRIBLE DANGEROUS MOVE AND MUST BE RETIRED. Doesn't make sense to me. Lets not forget that a lot of other wrestlers, including Tanahashi* from the same damn company, use the move or slight variations of it with no problems as well. (That I'm aware of and feel free to correct me if I'm wrong on any of this). Lets not forget that the safety obsessed WWE decided that the move was safe enough for the DIVAS. And yep, guess what, McCool never injured anyone with it. A string of injuries does not mean that a move is objectively unsafe, it could be bad luck and thats what the situation seems to be. ESPECIALLY when the problems with the move seem entirely on the receiving end's side. Excuse my sense of justice but I don't understand why Styles should have to retire his signature finisher because a few guys took his finisher incorrectly and got hurt. I can't fathom how thats his fault or how he should be punished for it. * This reminds me of the whole "Alicia Fox better stop using that scissor kick! It looks dangerous it MIGHT injure someone. It hasn't but it MIGHT" thing. At least this move is actually hurting people though I guess. Over the past decade Styles has injured people with the Styles Clash,this isn't just a recent thing. A local guy worked Styles back during the summer. And was worried cause supposedly Styles has a rep for being a bit reckless with his opponents. Fair enough. I've only seen Strong, Tatsu, Lionheart, and something about Stevie Richards? mentioned in this thread so I didn't know there was a long term reputation. I still don't see how, from the footage I've seen anyway, its AJ's fault but if there's a long history like that then the move is clearly dangerous at least in AJ's hands (for some reason).
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Post by CATCH_US IS the Conversation on Nov 27, 2014 3:19:28 GMT -5
Roddy got hurt with the Styles Clash too? Yep, that move's gotta go.
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Ultimo Gallos
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Post by Ultimo Gallos on Nov 27, 2014 4:46:35 GMT -5
Over the past decade Styles has injured people with the Styles Clash,this isn't just a recent thing. A local guy worked Styles back during the summer. And was worried cause supposedly Styles has a rep for being a bit reckless with his opponents. Fair enough. I've only seen Strong, Tatsu, Lionheart, and something about Stevie Richards? mentioned in this thread so I didn't know there was a long term reputation. I still don't see how, from the footage I've seen anyway, its AJ's fault but if there's a long history like that then the move is clearly dangerous at least in AJ's hands (for some reason). I can't say who told me this,but it is someone that worked with AJ in NWA Wildside and has since worked shows with him since. But AJ has been reckless in the ring for a long time. And seems to not care about his opponent. Plus really the Styles Clash is a stupid looking move. He has plenty of other moves that look better and have a lesser chance of injuring someone. The guy that worked with AJ back in the summer also talked about how AJ wanted to plan out the entire match without input from his opponent. Thankfully his opponent is well loved by the workers and they made AJ let this guy help plan the match. I saw the match,two versions actually, and it was one of the worst matches AJ's opponent has had.
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Post by N E O G E O B O Y S on Nov 27, 2014 8:28:57 GMT -5
the styles clash looks almost as fake as the canadian destroyer.
Is funny, I'm ok with watching a show with bunnies, ladders winning titles, and the muppets, but watching moves that at times looks like the opponent is helping in the setup is a no no for me
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Post by Deleted on Nov 27, 2014 8:38:02 GMT -5
the styles clash looks almost as fake as the canadian destroyer. Is funny, I'm ok with watching a show with bunnies, ladders winning titles, and the muppets, but watching moves that at times looks like the opponent is helping in the setup is a no no for me I see the Styles Clash as a shitty looking move, but it doesn't look to me like the opponent is helping in the setup. At least not on Canadian Destroyer/Flipping fallaway slam/Reverse 'Rana levels.
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Post by berlynwright on Nov 27, 2014 8:48:03 GMT -5
Roddy got hurt with the Styles Clash too? Yep, that move's gotta go. agree with the move needs to go, but Strong made a mess of that styles clash. he tucked his head at very last minute
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Post by N E O G E O B O Y S on Nov 27, 2014 10:05:11 GMT -5
the styles clash looks almost as fake as the canadian destroyer. Is funny, I'm ok with watching a show with bunnies, ladders winning titles, and the muppets, but watching moves that at times looks like the opponent is helping in the setup is a no no for me I see the Styles Clash as a shitty looking move, but it doesn't look to me like the opponent is helping in the setup. At least not on Canadian Destroyer/Flipping fallaway slam/Reverse 'Rana levels. Fair enough, your examples are worse cases of my criticism. Maybe I didn't liked how yoshi used his hands to fix his position
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Post by Brood Lone Wolf Funker on Nov 27, 2014 10:19:00 GMT -5
Every injury from it has been caused by the person taking the move, not by AJ. It's a pretty damn safe move, as long as the person takes it correctly, like most moves in wrestling. I think Richards was AJ's fault but Stevie may not have been injured either. Seems like some of these lanky guys he has trouble getting up enough. Like with Richards, AJ didn't get him up enough to get his head off the mat and he had no way to take the move but on his head. Tatsu seemed that way at the start but barely got him up enough for Tatsu to mess it up. Sad situation. Like was said, AJ has so many moves that it seems crazy to stick with the Clash. There could be a fun little angle run out of this where AJ loses a match and has it banned to explain why he stops using it and far down the line if absolutely needed they could use the move in another angle. During his feud with Bully Ray is when barely used the Clash and instead adopted the Calf Killer because it suited that feud
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Post by Lupin the Third on Nov 27, 2014 12:02:14 GMT -5
This kinda reminds me of the backlash Akitoshi Saito received after Misawa died after taking a back body drop from Saito. If I remember, he was getting death threats and all that sort. I felt bad for the poor guy. Especially the day after, I see highlights of the show, and Saito's just bawling his eyes out.
Which is also depressing to think that half the members of that match are dead, as Bison Smith passed away three years ago.
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