ICBM
King Koopa
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Post by ICBM on Apr 13, 2015 11:20:00 GMT -5
Damn, no spoiler tags on my phone version!
Well as a reader I won't even offer a dead pool. I don't mind Dany but jeezus is her angle getting long in the tooth. Please please please no Lady Stoneheart. The only positive of the ***redacted*** wedding is the enjoyment from seeing or reading that character's demise. Don't mistake me, I want vengeance too but it hasn't been satisfying nor interesting. Jon...still knows nothing
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 13, 2015 12:06:52 GMT -5
I never thought I would say this: {Spoiler}The whole Maggie the frog scene sucked hard! It didn't work on any level. Why did they cut it in half and why did they add extra dialog? The actuall written scene is fantastic.
I felt it got the season off to a poor start and the rest of the episode really didn't add much. Except the Unsullied being killed which was great.
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Post by 2 time pro bowler Fred Dryer on Apr 13, 2015 12:13:59 GMT -5
So given that none of the characters in the show are safe since it's going to deviate from the book, my prediction on the big death of this season is Loras Tyrell. He apparently suffers a nasty injury in the book anyway, so I can see the show going all the way and offing him. I don't know if that would qualify as "big". Hell, Mance has probably been a bigger character i since his introduction. Also, I think the streamlined TV story has cut quite a few principles who would set in motion the events in question.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 13, 2015 12:41:46 GMT -5
Stannis is such a f****** idiot. I don't see why anyone likes him. He is to me what Jaime Lannister is to Snakebite. People like him and I don't get it whatsoever. Here, let me burn the leader of the group I want helping me retake the north. Not to mention said group outnumbers me a shitload to one. Oh...shit. I forgot. How am I supposed to ensure their loyalty now? I've read the books and know what happens next here but, still. I'd like to hear why anyone likes Stannis. This guy: 1. Killed his own brother and then refused to take any responsibility for it. 2. Treats his family like complete shit. 3. Is too stupid to realize Melisandre is not to be trusted. 4. Burns people simply for disagreeing with him. 5. Shits all over the only guy who shows him any loyalty. I guess, like Hodor, he's now too much of a meme for people to not like for some f****** reason. 1. He did what he had to do, Renly had no right to the throne and he had the army he needed. Dick move yes but it was an action that had to happen. 2. He's just a distant man doesnt mean he doesnt love his daughter. And with his wife most noble weddings they dont usually get to pick their bride so falling in love doesnt always happen. 3. How is she not to be trusted? So far her god is they only one who makes themselves known by actually doing shit. 4. He's asserting dominance, showing his people while he can be a fair man he is also a man who will take action. 5. He does but at the same time will also go to him in a time of need and for the most part respects his ideas and opinions.
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Bobeddy
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Post by Bobeddy on Apr 13, 2015 12:51:06 GMT -5
I've read the books and know what happens next here but, still. I'd like to hear why anyone likes Stannis. This guy: 1. Killed his own brother and then refused to take any responsibility for it. 2. Treats his family like complete shit. 3. Is too stupid to realize Melisandre is not to be trusted. 4. Burns people simply for disagreeing with him. 5. Shits all over the only guy who shows him any loyalty. I guess, like Hodor, he's now too much of a meme for people to not like for some f****** reason. To address the points. 1. Under succession, Stannis is the true king. Renly had no right to assume he could claim the throne. In both book and show Stannis gives Renly opportunities to back down and rescind his claim but he chose not to. Stannis didn't want to kill Renly but he had to. In the show he takes responsibility by outright saying "I killed my brother" after he is defeated at the Blackwater. In the books we're told how Stannis spent the night of Renly's murder basically screaming in his sleep and expresses sorrow at Renly's death later on. Albeit "for the boy he was, not the man he grew to be". 2. I wouldn't say that. Him and Selyse clearly don't have any great warmth but he doesn't disrespect her. And in the show you can see how ashamed he is when he admits to her he slept with Melisandre. In the books there's nothing to suggest he doesn't care for Shireen. Spoiler for info from leaked episodes {Spoiler}there's a great scene in the fourth episode (probably my favourite scene from the season so far) where he tells Shireen exactly how much he cares about her. 3. One of my criticisms of the show is how much Stannis appears to be being played by Melisandre. In the books I always got the impression that Stannis saw her as a means to an end and that it was more his wife was the fanatic, but the show makes him seem much more in her thrall. For example in the show, Stannis only spares Davos and goes North after Mel tells him it's important. In the books, Stannis is the one who decides to spare Davos after he brings the Night's Watch letter to his attention and reminds him of his duty. 4. Basically repeating point 3. I see that more as a Mel thing that Stannis just goes along with because, hey, it seems to get results and burning is just a different form of execution. 5. He made Davos a lord and his Hand. He might be cold, gruff and incredibly stubborn and rigid but he clearly respects him. If Stannis didn't see him as someone of worth he would've executed him about 4 times over now. But beyond those points, the reason why I like Stannis is that he rewards loyalty, but punishes those that need punishing. Of all the contenders for the throne he is the most capable, the most seasoned and in my opinion has the strongest claim. But basically it can all be summed up with this quote, "Lord Seaworth is a man of humble birth, but he reminded me of my duty, when all I could think of was my rights. I had the cart before the horse, Davos said. I was trying to win the throne to save the kingdom, when I should have been trying to save the kingdom to win the throne." He took his council from a former thief raised in the slums and realised what a king should actually do. Protect the realm. tl;dr, much more than a meme.
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Post by SsnakeBite, the No1 Frenchman on Apr 13, 2015 14:25:57 GMT -5
Kind of a meh episode. Not particularly good, not particularly bad. It's pretty obvious they're just setting things up. The part with the Night's Watch was awkward to me. It feels like it should have come at the final episode of the previous season, not in the first episode of a new one. And I kind of agree with Artificial Samael (not to mention the explanations given by people really don't work for me) but I don't care about the plot he's involved in enough to get pissed so... whatever. On the plus side, the masked person killing Unsullied soldiers is actually breathing new life to Daenery's plot. In fact, Dany is one of the many things I have to disagree with most people on. I think she's on of the most interesting characters, as is her storyline. Really wish a wildling would shoot Mellisandre and shoot that plot device fast. Yeah... can't quite disagree here. This whole storyline feels like a waste of time to me and her character has "deus ex machina" written all over it. Ever since she first appeared I've had the feeling she only exists for very literal uses of "a wizard did it" non-explanations. Also... You know, that last scene loses a lot of its luster if you consider how hard it is to actually kill someone with a single arrow...
"AAAGGH!! You FOOL!! You missed the heart! You pierced my lung! You didn't put an end to my suffering, you just made it more painful! This is far worse than before! Now I'm burning AND choking! Why didn't you go for the head, you twat?! AAARGGH! Don't you know anything, Jon Snow?!" And since I saw people listing their "death pool", I think I'll play too: - Loras Tyrell - Stannis - Daario - Littlefinger - Roose Bolton - Gregor Clegane (I'll even predict he'll be killed by Tyrion for some "David vs Goliath" action. And revenge. And it would give him an opportunity to say "looks like the Gods have changed their mind, huh?". Wow, shit, the more I think abut it the more it actually makes sense)
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Post by Cyno on Apr 13, 2015 14:37:17 GMT -5
{Spoiler}If the show sticks with some of the book stuff, Gregor dies from his injuries after the fight with Oberyn, as his spear was tipped with a lethal poison. But then a really big guy becomes a part of Tommen's Kingsguard named Ser Robert Strong, who is likely Gregor's reanimated corpse after it was "donated" to Qyburn for his experiments.
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Post by Cela on Apr 13, 2015 15:55:17 GMT -5
I've been wondering about where Sansa and Littlefinger are headed. I have an idea, and am slightly worried what it might mean. Book Spoiler/Original Plotlines Theory {Spoiler} She's heading to Winterfell, where she might take the story place of "Arya" and be forced to marry Ramsay. This of course assumes also that Littlefinger will be killed by Ramsay, which would be interesting, since Littlefinger is a master of city politics, but what happens when you meet someone brutal who plays by no rules whatsoever?
I missed this show.
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chrom
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Post by chrom on Apr 13, 2015 17:01:14 GMT -5
I've been wondering about where Sansa and Littlefinger are headed. I have an idea, and am slightly worried what it might mean. Book Spoiler/Original Plotlines Theory {Spoiler}{Spoiler} She's heading to Winterfell, where she might take the story place of "Arya" and be forced to marry Ramsay. This of course assumes also that Littlefinger will be killed by Ramsay, which would be interesting, since Littlefinger is a master of city politics, but what happens when you meet someone brutal who plays by no rules whatsoever?
I missed this show. {Spoiler}{Spoiler} That has about less than zero chance of happening and makes no sense. Why would Littlefinger make Sansa marry him and claim she's Arya? Littlefinger's a bastard, but the only redeeming quality he has is caring somewhat for Sansa since she reminds him of Cat.
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Bobeddy
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Post by Bobeddy on Apr 13, 2015 17:09:31 GMT -5
I've been wondering about where Sansa and Littlefinger are headed. I have an idea, and am slightly worried what it might mean. Book Spoiler/Original Plotlines Theory {Spoiler}{Spoiler}{Spoiler} She's heading to Winterfell, where she might take the story place of "Arya" and be forced to marry Ramsay. This of course assumes also that Littlefinger will be killed by Ramsay, which would be interesting, since Littlefinger is a master of city politics, but what happens when you meet someone brutal who plays by no rules whatsoever?
I missed this show. {Spoiler}{Spoiler}{Spoiler} That has about less than zero chance of happening and makes no sense. Why would Littlefinger make Sansa marry him and claim she's Arya? Littlefinger's a bastard, but the only redeeming quality he has is caring somewhat for Sansa since she reminds him of Cat. {Spoiler}I don't think he was suggesting that Littlefinger tries to pass Sansa off as Arya, rather that Sansa fills the role of the fake Arya from the books. Whether she does this as Sansa Stark or as the niece of the Lord of the Vale and Harrenhal is another question. Either is likely as both would make strategic sense as far as the Boltons are concerned.
And it's not so far-fetched as Littlefinger's goal in the books seems to be marrying Sansa to Harry the Heir and securing the Vale and the North.
So Cela's prediction seems to be the merging of the two storylines from the books.
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Gecko
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Post by Gecko on Apr 13, 2015 17:18:42 GMT -5
I enjoyed it. Nothing special, but not terrible either. It was fine for what it was, a set up for future episodes. I named Grey Worm as one of my picks to get bumped off this season, but thinking about it some more I could see it being Missandei instead. I forgot how much I like the music in this series as well. I've been wondering about where Sansa and Littlefinger are headed. I have an idea, and am slightly worried what it might mean. Book Spoiler/Original Plotlines Theory {Spoiler}{Spoiler}{Spoiler} She's heading to Winterfell, where she might take the story place of "Arya" and be forced to marry Ramsay. This of course assumes also that Littlefinger will be killed by Ramsay, which would be interesting, since Littlefinger is a master of city politics, but what happens when you meet someone brutal who plays by no rules whatsoever?
I missed this show. {Spoiler}{Spoiler} That could be an interesting change, but I don't see it happening. I've not got any better ideas of where they might be off to, but I can't see them letting Ramsay "play" with Sansa in the way that he would with "Arya", it would seem like a step back for Sansa from what she ended up as at the end of last season.
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Post by Cela on Apr 13, 2015 18:00:55 GMT -5
{Spoiler}{Spoiler}{Spoiler}{Spoiler}{Spoiler} That has about less than zero chance of happening and makes no sense. Why would Littlefinger make Sansa marry him and claim she's Arya? Littlefinger's a bastard, but the only redeeming quality he has is caring somewhat for Sansa since she reminds him of Cat. {Spoiler}{Spoiler}{Spoiler}I don't think he was suggesting that Littlefinger tries to pass Sansa off as Arya, rather that Sansa fills the role of the fake Arya from the books. Whether she does this as Sansa Stark or as the niece of the Lord of the Vale and Harrenhal is another question. Either is likely as both would make strategic sense as far as the Boltons are concerned.
And it's not so far-fetched as Littlefinger's goal in the books seems to be marrying Sansa to Harry the Heir and securing the Vale and the North.
So Cela's prediction seems to be the merging of the two storylines from the books.
Also, Edit: new theory, makes way too much sense. {Spoiler}{Spoiler}{Spoiler}Littlefinger wants revenge for the killing of Cat. As we've learned from the Lysa Aryn plot, wives have a certain advantage when it comes to husband killing.
Oh f***... you know who else needs a new wife? Walder Frey. And he is definitely west, and the last place Cersei would expect Sansa to go.
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ICBM
King Koopa
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Post by ICBM on Apr 13, 2015 20:49:55 GMT -5
{Spoiler}Sansa to Winterfell to stand in as Arya also makes sense from an HBO standpoint. Ran say has pushed the envelope pretty f$&@ing far, but the shit he does to Jayne Poole in the books is not near suitable for TV or movie no matter how far GOT has gone. She is an innocent. Theon was a treacherous bastard who got ASOIAF comeuppance. I'm not saying it was all good what happened to Theon. Ramsay SNOW (yeah come at me bro) is a sick bastard, but I'm just sayin Theon was a villain and HBO was likely cool with the allusion to his torture. Jayne Poole being raped and tortured after doing nothing is pretty far out there for them and reluctance for national heat by Network heads makes Cela's merge an acceptable compromise. Say Sansa gets betrothed to Ramsay, little finger sells it to her cause he's a ruthless bastard, the Boltons get to be diplomats as Roose is Warden of the. North and all, and Sansa gets to keep being abused by men she trusts cause apparently that is her gimmick
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Capt Lunatic
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Post by Capt Lunatic on Apr 13, 2015 22:31:51 GMT -5
Here, let me burn the leader of the group I want helping me retake the north. Not to mention said group outnumbers me a shitload to one. Oh...shit. I forgot. How am I supposed to ensure their loyalty now? I believe by killing their leader, he absorbs them into his army. They have to fight for him now. Loyalty is meh, but they'll fight.
I may be mistaken, but I think that's one of the main reasons he killed Renly, to absorb his army.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 13, 2015 22:36:30 GMT -5
Here, let me burn the leader of the group I want helping me retake the north. Not to mention said group outnumbers me a shitload to one. Oh...shit. I forgot. How am I supposed to ensure their loyalty now? I believe by killing their leader, he absorbs them into his army. They have to fight for him now. Loyalty is meh, but they'll fight.
I may be mistaken, but I think that's one of the main reasons he killed Renly, to absorb his army. You'd be correct he killed Renly so he could take the joint army of the Tyrells and Baratheons
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Futureraven: Beelzebruv
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Post by Futureraven: Beelzebruv on Apr 14, 2015 1:30:06 GMT -5
Here, let me burn the leader of the group I want helping me retake the north. Not to mention said group outnumbers me a shitload to one. Oh...shit. I forgot. How am I supposed to ensure their loyalty now? I believe by killing their leader, he absorbs them into his army. They have to fight for him now. Loyalty is meh, but they'll fight.
I may be mistaken, but I think that's one of the main reasons he killed Renly, to absorb his army. Yeah, but the Wildlings aren't southern lords. They followed Mance because they believed in him and he was one of them, they're not just going to go straight over to the next guy.
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ICBM
King Koopa
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Post by ICBM on Apr 14, 2015 6:43:22 GMT -5
I believe by killing their leader, he absorbs them into his army. They have to fight for him now. Loyalty is meh, but they'll fight.
I may be mistaken, but I think that's one of the main reasons he killed Renly, to absorb his army. Yeah, but the Wildlings aren't southern lords. They followed Mance because they believed in him and he was one of them, they're not just going to go straight over to the next guy. Jon sells the wildings on defending against the others (white walkers). He also shields them a bit from Stanis and gives them the gift as wilding land. All the same that created a different heat in another area...
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Futureraven: Beelzebruv
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Post by Futureraven: Beelzebruv on Apr 14, 2015 7:26:40 GMT -5
Yeah, but the Wildlings aren't southern lords. They followed Mance because they believed in him and he was one of them, they're not just going to go straight over to the next guy. Jon sells the wildings on defending against the others (white walkers). He also shields them a bit from Stanis and gives them the gift as wilding land. All the same that created a different heat in another area... This a theory or what happens? I can see it happening, but I can also see it being another conflict.
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ICBM
King Koopa
Didn't know we did status updates here now
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Post by ICBM on Apr 14, 2015 8:37:07 GMT -5
Jon sells the wildings on defending against the others (white walkers). He also shields them a bit from Stanis and gives them the gift as wilding land. All the same that created a different heat in another area... This a theory or what happens? I can see it happening, but I can also see it being another conflict. Explanation from source. Someone asked why
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Futureraven: Beelzebruv
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Post by Futureraven: Beelzebruv on Apr 14, 2015 9:33:29 GMT -5
Ah, ok.
Still don't totally buy it if it took 1 guy a lifetime to unite the warring clans, and every other time they've immediately disbanded when their king dies, and they know Jon as a traitor.
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