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Post by HMARK Center on May 28, 2019 12:17:45 GMT -5
One of the best choices in Last Jedi was having Rey come from a family of "nobodies", please PLEASE don't make some obvious Star Wars twist with this stuff, it's just so, so tired.
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Push R Truth
Patti Mayonnaise
Unique and Special Snowflake, and a pants-less heathen.
Perpetually Constipated
Posts: 39,281
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Post by Push R Truth on May 28, 2019 12:20:22 GMT -5
I too love the nobody part.
Remember Obi Wan's family history? Mace's? Yoda's? Palps? Qui Gonns?
No. Because their bloodlines didn't mean jack shit in the movies.
Yes I'm fully expecting to have somebody point out that one of these guys is probably from a long line of jedi-ninja-assassin-Robocop warriors but frankly I don't give a shit. NEEEEEEEEEEEEEERRRRDDDDDD! /ogre
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Post by YAKMAN is ICHIBAN on May 28, 2019 12:38:19 GMT -5
Chewie as a surrogate father figure would at least be something more interesting than Chewie, Porg Sidekick and Chauffeur.
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Post by YAKMAN is ICHIBAN on May 28, 2019 12:41:22 GMT -5
One of the best choices in Last Jedi was having Rey come from a family of "nobodies", please PLEASE don't make some obvious Star Wars twist with this stuff, it's just so, so tired. One might suggest that people watch Star Wars for Star Wars stuff. Ultimately I'm fine with it, but you can't take both mysteries (Snoke/Rey's parents) and do nothing for both. ESPECIALLY when her force capabilities far exceed anything to have come before. That is just begging for a special parentage question, or previous training being wiped for her memory, or something. Everyone else needed to train for years and years to do half of what she can do. Maybe the third movie will explain that the force is going bonkers, I don't know.
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The Heenan Family
Unicron
I'm a legend in this sport. If you don't believe me, ask me.
Posts: 2,566
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Post by The Heenan Family on May 28, 2019 12:49:26 GMT -5
According to a reportedly credible source, Rey's true parentage will be revealed. {Spoiler}{Spoiler}{Spoiler}Daughter of Han Solo, conceived during his and Leia's estrangement. That credible source said it was an unverified rumor and that several of his sources say it's not true. So I think we can move on.
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Post by Cyno on May 28, 2019 13:11:26 GMT -5
One of the best choices in Last Jedi was having Rey come from a family of "nobodies", please PLEASE don't make some obvious Star Wars twist with this stuff, it's just so, so tired. One might suggest that people watch Star Wars for Star Wars stuff. Ultimately I'm fine with it, but you can't take both mysteries (Snoke/Rey's parents) and do nothing for both. ESPECIALLY when her force capabilities far exceed anything to have come before. That is just begging for a special parentage question, or previous training being wiped for her memory, or something. Everyone else needed to train for years and years to do half of what she can do. Maybe the third movie will explain that the force is going bonkers, I don't know. The only canon "Force is strong because family" line is the Skywalker line. And Anakin's mother had no Force sensitivity anyway. All the other known great Jedi and Sith didn't come from these storied families or anything. Force sensitivity is otherwise completely random, it seems, unless you're part of an alien race or subgroup that naturally has Force sensitivity in its genes like Yoda's people or the Dathomirian Zabrak.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on May 28, 2019 13:15:18 GMT -5
According to a reportedly credible source, Rey's true parentage will be revealed. {Spoiler}{Spoiler}{Spoiler}{Spoiler}Daughter of Han Solo, conceived during his and Leia's estrangement. That credible source said it was an unverified rumor and that several of his sources say it's not true. So I think we can move on. It's the internet. People will not move on.
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Chainsaw
T
A very BAD man.
It is what it is
Posts: 90,480
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Post by Chainsaw on May 28, 2019 13:24:01 GMT -5
One of the best choices in Last Jedi was having Rey come from a family of "nobodies", please PLEASE don't make some obvious Star Wars twist with this stuff, it's just so, so tired. My biggest fear, and the main reason why I haven't been too excited about TROS, is that JJ will end up undoing much of the groundwork Rian laid out in TJL, and Rey's lineage in particular. It's much more interesting to think that more people may be Force sensitive in the universe, and that they don't have to be related to a Jedi in order to be a Jedi Knight. It was something that was more prevalently hinted at in the original trilogy, with Ben's talk that the Force "binds us, ties us all together", but it feels like Lucas explained himself into a corner by introducing the midochloridian angle. It became less spiritual and more of a genetic thing, and that took a lot of steam out of the idea of the Jedi. Hopefully it's not something that he's going to jettison at the behest of a few finicky fans, and possibly Kathleen Kennedy.
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Post by Hit Girl on May 28, 2019 13:28:14 GMT -5
The whole thing is disjointed. Characters are inconsistent even within the same film, like Kylo Ben.
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Post by HMARK Center on May 28, 2019 14:39:43 GMT -5
One of the best choices in Last Jedi was having Rey come from a family of "nobodies", please PLEASE don't make some obvious Star Wars twist with this stuff, it's just so, so tired. One might suggest that people watch Star Wars for Star Wars stuff. Ultimately I'm fine with it, but you can't take both mysteries (Snoke/Rey's parents) and do nothing for both. ESPECIALLY when her force capabilities far exceed anything to have come before. That is just begging for a special parentage question, or previous training being wiped for her memory, or something. Everyone else needed to train for years and years to do half of what she can do. Maybe the third movie will explain that the force is going bonkers, I don't know. Then let's just watch the originals, the actual really good movies in the series. It's not "Star Wars stuff" to introduce a character motivation or something like that and then just back off on it because, I dunno, some fans complained or something. Maybe that rumor won't be true at all, so it could all be moot, but the obvious point in all of this from the get-go should've been "Don't bother making a new trilogy if you don't have a 3-move storyline already thought up".
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Post by Kevin Hamilton on May 28, 2019 14:46:21 GMT -5
Snoke wasn't any more mysterious than Palpatine was in Jedi. Emperor didn't have any big backstory till later, he was the main evil guy and that was it. You CAN add lore, but don't necessarily need it. It wasn't there with Palpatine originally. Vader chucked him down a hole and you knew almost nothing about him
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Post by Fade is a CodyCryBaby on May 28, 2019 14:56:12 GMT -5
I’d be down if the rumor was true. It’d cling on execution. Kinda crazy to see people losing their shit over it though..lol.
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Post by YAKMAN is ICHIBAN on May 28, 2019 14:58:23 GMT -5
Snoke wasn't any more mysterious than Palpatine was in Jedi. Emperor didn't have any big backstory till later, he was the main evil guy and that was it. You CAN add lore, but don't necessarily need it. It wasn't there with Palpatine originally. Vader chucked him down a hole and you knew almost nothing about him Of course that just gets you to Snoke being a shitty remake of Palpatine. With Palpatine you at least had a sense of the galactic political situation so you knew what he was.
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Post by Kevin Hamilton on May 28, 2019 15:08:02 GMT -5
Snoke wasn't any more mysterious than Palpatine was in Jedi. Emperor didn't have any big backstory till later, he was the main evil guy and that was it. You CAN add lore, but don't necessarily need it. It wasn't there with Palpatine originally. Vader chucked him down a hole and you knew almost nothing about him Of course that just gets you to Snoke being a shitty remake of Palpatine. With Palpatine you at least had a sense of the galactic political situation so you knew what he was. Not really any more than you do here though. You knew he was the head of Empire that was against some rebels. That's about it. You know about as much about First Order. They're a threat to the Republic. In both cases you've got bad guys and good guys without much more motivation or explanation than that. I won't argue that Snoke is a retread of Palpatine. It seemed like that was sort of the point both of him existing in 7 and being cut down in 8. Plus outside of a few hologram appearances, you never even saw Emperor till an hour in the third movie. Does backstory make stuff more interesting? Sometimes sure (it hurt Vader), but not having that backstory in the movies is very much a Star Wars thing.
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Post by Hit Girl on May 28, 2019 16:37:25 GMT -5
You could piece together the backstory with Palpatine to reasonsably understand how he attained power. The old Republic fell, the Jedi virtually wiped out, aided in part by Vader, formidable military officers like Tarkin, and the ability to simply dissolve political institutions at a stroke. He was the spider in the web. With Snoke, we got very little to demonstrate why he was so powerful, where the new empire came from, why Luke was so dumb, why Kylo Papa Roach was so emo, and why the republic was so weak. It also didn't help that Snoke was a CGI pile of shit, while Palpatine was played with expert malevolence by the incredible Ian McDiarmid. Physical presence really matters a lot.
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Post by YAKMAN is ICHIBAN on May 28, 2019 16:39:35 GMT -5
Of course that just gets you to Snoke being a shitty remake of Palpatine. With Palpatine you at least had a sense of the galactic political situation so you knew what he was. Not really any more than you do here though. You knew he was the head of Empire that was against some rebels. That's about it. You know about as much about First Order. They're a threat to the Republic. In both cases you've got bad guys and good guys without much more motivation or explanation than that. I won't argue that Snoke is a retread of Palpatine. It seemed like that was sort of the point both of him existing in 7 and being cut down in 8. Plus outside of a few hologram appearances, you never even saw Emperor till an hour in the third movie. Does backstory make stuff more interesting? Sometimes sure (it hurt Vader), but not having that backstory in the movies is very much a Star Wars thing. Those are all good points, if you ignore that the sequel scripts are shit. Evil Empire vs Rebels makes sense. You can't just undo all of that without sufficient explanation to do it all over again, making the good guys some sort of underdog "Resistance" apart from the good guy Republic. Well I guess you can, they did, but it is no surprise that this is unsatisfying to many. We didn't have a lot of details about the emperor, but we knew he was the head of an evil empire, who was consolidating his power, and that Darth Vader of all people kneels to him. We didn't really need to know more than that before ROTJ. That works on a blank slate. You can't just do it again though and have it work. You could piece together the backstory with Palpatine to understand how he attained power. The old Republic fell, the Jedi virtually wiped out, aided in part by Vader, formidable military officers like Tarkin, and the ability to simply dissolve political institutions at a stroke. He was the spider in the web. With Snoke, we got very little to demonstrate why he was so powerful, where the new empire came from, and why the republic was so weak. It also didn't help that Snoke was a CGI pile of shit, while Palpatine was played with expert malevolence by the incredible Ian McDiarmid. Physical presence really matters a lot. It helps to not rip off scenes, camera angles, and dialogue outright from better, beloved movies as well.
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Post by HMARK Center on May 28, 2019 21:40:40 GMT -5
Snoke wasn't any more mysterious than Palpatine was in Jedi. Emperor didn't have any big backstory till later, he was the main evil guy and that was it. You CAN add lore, but don't necessarily need it. It wasn't there with Palpatine originally. Vader chucked him down a hole and you knew almost nothing about him I think it's the big flaw with the way a lot of people look at Star Wars...it's frankly not a lore-rich franchise, that's simply not what it was built on, and it's not what drove the original trilogy. It's part of why the Solo movie was so cornball: Han offhandedly mentioning "the Kessel run" or the fact he knows what Chewie's saying aren't major plot points, they're just little bits of color to add character to him, we don't need a movie telling us "THIS is what the Kessel run is! HERE'S how Han won the Falcon from Lando! And THAT'S why Han calls him 'Chewie'!" Bruh, don't care. The old expanded universe kind of created this whole desire to see everything explained, and while I enjoyed a lot of that as a kid I can look back on it and realize that, yeah, a lot of it was crappy, with a few gems scattered here and there. But Star Wars never thrived on explaining stuff, it thrived on dropping you into this interesting, fantastical setting filled with mythic archetypes you could recognize but with alien trappings that kept it strange and weird.
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Post by Kevin Hamilton on May 28, 2019 21:53:33 GMT -5
Snoke wasn't any more mysterious than Palpatine was in Jedi. Emperor didn't have any big backstory till later, he was the main evil guy and that was it. You CAN add lore, but don't necessarily need it. It wasn't there with Palpatine originally. Vader chucked him down a hole and you knew almost nothing about him I think it's the big flaw with the way a lot of people look at Star Wars...it's frankly not a lore-rich franchise, that's simply not what it was built on, and it's not what drove the original trilogy. It's part of why the Solo movie was so cornball: Han offhandedly mentioning "the Kessel run" or the fact he knows what Chewie's saying aren't major plot points, they're just little bits of color to add character to him, we don't need a movie telling us "THIS is what the Kessel run is! HERE'S how Han won the Falcon from Lando! And THAT'S what Han called him 'Chewie'!" Bruh, don't care. The old expanded universe kind of created this whole desire to see everything explained, and while I enjoyed a lot of that as a kid I can look back on it and realize that, yeah, a lot of it was crappy, with a few gems scattered here and there. But Star Wars never thrived on explaining stuff, it thrived on dropping you into this interesting, fantastical setting filled with mythic archetypes you could recognize but with alien trappings that kept it strange and weird. Exactly. Things are simple by design. It's a fairy tale. You CAN deep dive into all that stuff, but it's not needed. And again, I'm not saying that if you want that stuff with more backstory etc in the new movies you're necessarily wrong, BUT not one bit of that was in the original three movies. It just wasn't. If you're gonna say you can piece together how powerful Palpatine was, the galactic governnent was etc in the original trilogy---fine. But you can't then act like you can't do the same with the new stuff. I'm not saying you have to even LIKE the new stuff; but to act like it's some sort of betrayal of what a Star Wars movie is or to act like it's ever been more than a fairy tale just ain't true. I've said it before, but from the jump the series let's you know exactly what kind of story you're gettin: 'A long time ago in a galaxy far, far away' is Once Upon A Time.
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Post by BorneAgain on May 28, 2019 22:05:13 GMT -5
Snoke didn't need a deep backstory or connection to lore, he just needed to be interesting, original, or intimidating.
He just ended up being none of them, at least to me.
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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2019 6:55:28 GMT -5
Snoke didn't need a deep backstory or connection to lore, he just needed to be interesting, original, and/or intimidating. He just ended up being none of them, at least to me. He was interesting when I thought he legit was a gigantic man thanks to that TFA hologram. Lord help me, I don't know why but it was a weirdly novel idea at the time. Instead he just ended up being 8 feet tall or something.
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