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Post by Tiger Millionaire on Oct 26, 2018 22:44:28 GMT -5
It's also worth noting that unlike the other characters, Fat Tony's voice actor, Joe Mantegna, is actually an Italian-American himself.
Dan Castellenetta does Groundskeeper Willie, and he isn't Scottish, so lets 86 him too.
Whataboutism at it's finest.
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Post by Toilet Paper Roll on Oct 26, 2018 22:45:42 GMT -5
Dan Castellenetta does Groundskeeper Willie, and he isn't Scottish, so lets 86 him too.
Whataboutism at it's finest.
It's not a really great portrayal of the Scottish people.
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Post by Mighty Attack Tribble on Oct 26, 2018 23:34:50 GMT -5
Whataboutism at it's finest.
It's not a really great portrayal of the Scottish people.
Willie hasn't ever been the sole representative of Scottish people in prime time entertainment. Apu had been one of the only - and at time perhaps the only - prominent Indian characters on TV from 1989 until late into the last decade.
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Post by Fade is a CodyCryBaby on Oct 26, 2018 23:58:06 GMT -5
Perhaps the Simpsons should be more authentic and inclusive in terms of its voice casting? Bart should be played by an actual young boy, Mr. Burns by an actual old man, Smithers by an actual gay man, Dr. Hibbert by an actual black man, etc. Bumblebee Man should be played by an actual Bumblebee-Man. Who also happens to be a funny Hispanic stereotype.
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Welfare Willis
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Post by Welfare Willis on Oct 27, 2018 0:19:21 GMT -5
It's a little silly given the creator of the documentary suggested just changing Apu from the kwik-e-mart employee to it's owner or something along those lines. He didn't want to get rid of Apu.
You know, I get it. It's a horrible thing to be mocked for an unfair representation of your culture.
Yet at the same time, Apu is one of the better representative characters on the Simpsons. An intelligent, religious business owner. Sure they made fun of Indian culture on occasion, but the Simpsons mocks a lot of cultures.
We are in a different time now than in 1989, and I can see the documentary's view. Yet I feel like Apu isn't a grossly sterotypical character on par with something you'd see from the 1930s or 40s. It's a bit of a shame that the show feels like it has to go this route.
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chazraps
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Post by chazraps on Oct 27, 2018 0:35:36 GMT -5
It's a little silly given the creator of the documentary suggested just changing Apu from the kwik-e-mart employee to it's owner or something along those lines. He didn't want to get rid of Apu. You know, I get it. It's a horrible thing to be mocked for an unfair representation of your culture. Yet at the same time, Apu is one of the better representative characters on the Simpsons. An intelligent, religious business owner. Sure they made fun of Indian culture on occasion, but the Simpsons mocks a lot of cultures. We are in a different time now than in 1989, and I can see the documentary's view. Yet I feel like Apu isn't a grossly sterotypical character on par with something you'd see from the 1930s or 40s. It's a bit of a shame that the show feels like it has to go this route. But the fact that it's voiced by a white guy and written exclusively by non-Indians pushes it into that territory. I agree with the rest of your post, but I do think this is an important distinction to make this differentiates it from the other "stereotypes" you see handled on the show.
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Post by Z-A Sandbaggin' Son of a b!%@h on Oct 27, 2018 1:00:30 GMT -5
Like. It’s been on 30’years. Why are people just now offended lol. I hate society.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 27, 2018 1:00:57 GMT -5
I think the only evidence I need to see he's been a harmful stereotype for Indians is that people to this day still call any gas station ran by an Indian man a "Kwik-e-mart" usually in as horribly racist of an accent as they possibly can and think it's a very funny joke. If you believe that hasn't had harmful effects on the way people view and treat Indians in the US, you are flat out wrong. I live in a very racist town, in a fairly racist area of Canada. I hear all sorts of racial slurs on a near daily basis, and never once in my 32 years have I heard someone call a convenience store a Kwik E Mart, or the owner Apu. And there are ALOT of Indian owned convenience stores/gas stations in my area. I've literally heard it this week. Twice.
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chazraps
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Post by chazraps on Oct 27, 2018 1:19:55 GMT -5
Like. It’s been on 30’years. Why are people just now offended lol. I hate society. It's not just now, it's been years this has been going on.
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Post by arrogantmodel on Oct 27, 2018 1:26:26 GMT -5
It's also worth noting that unlike the other characters, Fat Tony's voice actor, Joe Mantegna, is actually an Italian-American himself. And thoroughly enjoys playing the character. Kill him off. He can be with Bleeding Gums Murphy and Dr. Marvin Monroe.
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Post by Mighty Attack Tribble on Oct 27, 2018 1:27:37 GMT -5
Like. It’s been on 30’years. Why are people just now offended lol. I hate society. Nope, it's only just now that people are listening to the complaints and taking them seriously rather than just dismissively saying "Uh-huh, uh-huh. Thank you, come again."
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Post by eJm on Oct 27, 2018 2:12:51 GMT -5
It's not a really great portrayal of the Scottish people.
Willie hasn't ever been the sole representative of Scottish people in prime time entertainment. Apu had been one of the only - and at time perhaps the only - prominent Indian characters on TV from 1989 until late into the last decade. I’ll put it this way; Craig Ferguson is Scottish and was the first non American to host a talk show for over a decade. He’s barely the stereotype of a Scottish person and more...well, Craig Ferguson. Not counting Kanal Nayyar’s one week stint as host of the same show before James Cordon took over, I can’t think of any host of a major talk show (so not smaller network, internet or Netflix) who wasn’t a white male of some kind.
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Post by Cyno on Oct 27, 2018 2:21:38 GMT -5
Willie hasn't ever been the sole representative of Scottish people in prime time entertainment. Apu had been one of the only - and at time perhaps the only - prominent Indian characters on TV from 1989 until late into the last decade. I’ll put it this way; Craig Ferguson is Scottish and was the first non American to host a talk show for over a decade. He’s barely the stereotype of a Scottish person and more...well, Craig Ferguson. Not counting Kanal Nayyar’s one week stint as host of the same show before James Cordon took over, I can’t think of any host of a major talk show (so not smaller network, internet or Netflix) who wasn’t a white male of some kind. As far as late night goes, the only one I can think of that achieved any sort of success was Chelsea Handler's show on E! but then that isn't exactly a major network.
There's also Trevor Noah's Daily Show which is pretty damned successful (though again, on basic cable), but that's less talk show and more political satire with a single interview spot.
Not that there haven't been attempts like with Arsenio Hall, but most of them haven't lasted long.
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Post by Sparvid on Oct 27, 2018 2:23:58 GMT -5
It's a little silly given the creator of the documentary suggested just changing Apu from the kwik-e-mart employee to it's owner or something along those lines. He didn't want to get rid of Apu. Doesn't Apu already own the Kwik-E-Mart (or co-own with his brother) and runs it his own way? It's not like he's the equivalent of someone behind the register at a McDonalds with a boss in the same building telling him what to do. Or did the documentary suggest he should be the owner of the whole (presumably national) Kwik-E-Mart organization? Also, didn't they already address Apu's stereotypicality a few years ago? tv.avclub.com/a-visitor-takes-a-long-look-at-apu-on-a-funny-thoughtf-1798186427
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Post by Tiger Millionaire on Oct 27, 2018 2:46:38 GMT -5
Like. It’s been on 30’years. Why are people just now offended lol. I hate society. That is what causes you to hate society? Let's look at it this way. The Simpsons have been on for 29 years. Let's pretend a show started in 1960 and was on in 1989? Would it be ok for the shows to have almost no black people on them, have women stickly as housewives, represent Native Americans as hooting savages in 1989 because it was acceptable behavior in 1960?
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Post by cosmo on Oct 27, 2018 3:01:26 GMT -5
Apu had been one of the only - and at time perhaps the only - prominent Indian characters on TV from 1989 until late into the last decade. No kidding. If you put a gun to my head and told me to name every Indian on prime time TV prior to Aziz Ansari, Kal Penn, and Mindy Kaling hitting it big, Apu would be it.
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Post by Starshine on Oct 27, 2018 4:06:07 GMT -5
Like. It’s been on 30’years. Why are people just now offended lol. I hate society. Nope, it's only just now that people are listening to the complaints and taking them seriously rather than just dismissively saying "Uh-huh, uh-huh. Thank you, come again." Weird... It's kind of exactly like how everything else similar to this has happened.
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Post by DZ: WF Legacy on Oct 27, 2018 4:59:37 GMT -5
Comedy in 20 years is going to be insufferably sterile.
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Johnny Flamingo
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Post by Johnny Flamingo on Oct 27, 2018 5:13:03 GMT -5
Probably for the best, With an established character it would be tough to change and risky that it could still be perceived as offensive.
Sad as Apu was one of the better characters. I understand why some are offended. I will miss the character.
I still enjoy The Simpsons and they have enough characters where this will not harm the show.
I respect Hank Azaria as he has been very understanding through everything.
I wish Hari, the guy who made the doc, would have been more mature in the aftermath of the film (he was a total jerk and resorted to insults instead of having a dialogue with people). Could have led to much needed and deep discussions regarding race and stereotypes but by acting the way he did it killed a lot of dialogue that could have happened.
Only criticism I disagree with is a white actor voicing him being a problem. If the character is respectful and not harmful I don’t see the issue with the voice actors race. I think Azaria, who is very talented, could easily play a respectful Indian character. Had the character been different I don’t think anyone would have had a problem with him doing the voice.
Which is why no one has an issue with a white voice actor playing Dr. Hibbert. The character on no way demeans/makes fun of African Americans.
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Johnny Flamingo
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Post by Johnny Flamingo on Oct 27, 2018 5:16:18 GMT -5
Comedy in 20 years is going to be insufferably sterile. I don’t think it will be sterile, it will simply evolve.
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