salz4life
Grimlock
Prichard is a guy who gets that his job is to service his boss.
Posts: 13,913
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Post by salz4life on Feb 14, 2019 13:31:21 GMT -5
Heyman says Harper isn’t considering short term deals. Seems like the rest league isn't considering giving him a 10 year/$300 million deal either. Someone is going to have to budge.
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salz4life
Grimlock
Prichard is a guy who gets that his job is to service his boss.
Posts: 13,913
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Post by salz4life on Feb 14, 2019 13:35:28 GMT -5
I'm having a hard time reconciling how I feel about the current free agent market. It's the middle of February and two transcendent free agents who were expected to sign record-breaking contracts remain unsigned. Part of me wants to blame the owners for nickel-and-diming elite talent in the name of saving a buck here or there, even if it comes at a cost of wins on the field. But another part of me feels that this is sort of a market correction stemming from owners and general managers giving Carl Crawford a seven-year, $142 million deal; Albert Pujols' 10-year, $240 million contract; Chris Davis' seven-year, $161 million albatross; and Jason Heyward's eight-year, $184 million deal. Even though Manny Machado and Bryce Harper are both 26 and hypothetically just entering their primes, I'm struggling to lambast owners for not having some $300 million sword of damocles hanging over their heads for the next decade. I think baseball free agency is entering a new era of front-loaded short-term deals over these drawn-out, multi-year contracts. It just looks bad because billionaire baseball owners are lamenting their dollars and cents while top free agents remain on the block as Spring Training begins. I see both sides. I understand the players are frustrated with not having all these players signed by Spring Training. However, I think the owners are tired of giving all these long term/high dollar deals. I also see it as a bit of a market correction.
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Post by sfvega on Feb 14, 2019 18:55:44 GMT -5
I'm having a hard time reconciling how I feel about the current free agent market. It's the middle of February and two transcendent free agents who were expected to sign record-breaking contracts remain unsigned. Part of me wants to blame the owners for nickel-and-diming elite talent in the name of saving a buck here or there, even if it comes at a cost of wins on the field. But another part of me feels that this is sort of a market correction stemming from owners and general managers giving Carl Crawford a seven-year, $142 million deal; Albert Pujols' 10-year, $240 million contract; Chris Davis' seven-year, $161 million albatross; and Jason Heyward's eight-year, $184 million deal. Even though Manny Machado and Bryce Harper are both 26 and hypothetically just entering their primes, I'm struggling to lambast owners for not having some $300 million sword of damocles hanging over their heads for the next decade. I think baseball free agency is entering a new era of front-loaded short-term deals over these drawn-out, multi-year contracts. It just looks bad because billionaire baseball owners are lamenting their dollars and cents while top free agents remain on the block as Spring Training begins. I see both sides. I understand the players are frustrated with not having all these players signed by Spring Training. However, I think the owners are tired of giving all these long term/high dollar deals. I also see it as a bit of a market correction. It isn't just the expensive, long-term deals though, the market is colder for everyone. Plenty of mid-range guys like Moustakas, whose demands cannot be that high, are still out there. Moustakas also expected to cash in last year, but much like a Monday Night Raw cash-in, it was only a tease and signed a one year deal hoping for an improved market. This year it's even worse. Grandal hitting 24 HRs, rejecting a QO, and then signing a 1-year deal for only 300k more on the open market. Almost everybody is taking 1 to 3-year deals. So it isn't really a case of teams wanting to not be left on the hook for the twilight years of guys like Pujols. This is a league-wide issue for guys from the bottom to the top guys. Harper and Machado are the ones talked about the most, but they are actually impacted the least. This is a systemic issue, and last time it was a systemic issue, the owners were caught colluding. I'm leaning like 75% collusion, but I really think people are trying to come up with all these reasons why it isn't while not really looking at the market the last two years. This goes beyond market correction to market bottom-out.
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Post by Cyno on Feb 14, 2019 19:02:11 GMT -5
You have to wonder if there's any sort of collusion going around or if it's just the GM's of these teams are a lot smarter and use analytics that show just how bad the last years of these long term deals are for teams.
Logic suggests it's mostly the latter, but I wouldn't put anything past MLB owners, especially since they HAVE been guilty of collusion in the past about these sorts of things.
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salz4life
Grimlock
Prichard is a guy who gets that his job is to service his boss.
Posts: 13,913
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Post by salz4life on Feb 14, 2019 19:33:29 GMT -5
I see both sides. I understand the players are frustrated with not having all these players signed by Spring Training. However, I think the owners are tired of giving all these long term/high dollar deals. I also see it as a bit of a market correction. It isn't just the expensive, long-term deals though, the market is colder for everyone. Plenty of mid-range guys like Moustakas, whose demands cannot be that high, are still out there. Moustakas also expected to cash in last year, but much like a Monday Night Raw cash-in, it was only a tease and signed a one year deal hoping for an improved market. This year it's even worse. Grandal hitting 24 HRs, rejecting a QO, and then signing a 1-year deal for only 300k more on the open market. Almost everybody is taking 1 to 3-year deals. So it isn't really a case of teams wanting to not be left on the hook for the twilight years of guys like Pujols. This is a league-wide issue for guys from the bottom to the top guys. Harper and Machado are the ones talked about the most, but they are actually impacted the least. This is a systemic issue, and last time it was a systemic issue, the owners were caught colluding. I'm leaning like 75% collusion, but I really think people are trying to come up with all these reasons why it isn't while not really looking at the market the last two years. This goes beyond market correction to market bottom-out. Everyone is waiting for the big guys to set the market. This is more affecting the mid-range and below than anyone else.
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Post by sfvega on Feb 14, 2019 19:48:00 GMT -5
It isn't just the expensive, long-term deals though, the market is colder for everyone. Plenty of mid-range guys like Moustakas, whose demands cannot be that high, are still out there. Moustakas also expected to cash in last year, but much like a Monday Night Raw cash-in, it was only a tease and signed a one year deal hoping for an improved market. This year it's even worse. Grandal hitting 24 HRs, rejecting a QO, and then signing a 1-year deal for only 300k more on the open market. Almost everybody is taking 1 to 3-year deals. So it isn't really a case of teams wanting to not be left on the hook for the twilight years of guys like Pujols. This is a league-wide issue for guys from the bottom to the top guys. Harper and Machado are the ones talked about the most, but they are actually impacted the least. This is a systemic issue, and last time it was a systemic issue, the owners were caught colluding. I'm leaning like 75% collusion, but I really think people are trying to come up with all these reasons why it isn't while not really looking at the market the last two years. This goes beyond market correction to market bottom-out. Everyone is waiting for the big guys to set the market. This is more affecting the mid-range and below than anyone else. Machado and Harper don't set the market for guys like Moose. Most of the time, a team is in on Moose or Machado. The luxury FA guys price themselves out of most markets, who then turn to the the second-tier FAs. Those markets set the bar, not Machado.
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Post by prettynami on Feb 14, 2019 22:03:07 GMT -5
I personally thinks its the value of young players under the fairly ridiculous arbitration and intro deals have dampened the value of high priced players. It almost seems like most teams think they can fairly accurately predict "new" players contributions with modern analytics and scouting and this lessens one of the values of more veteran players, the fact that they are a "known quantity". So the risk of big contracts are more when you have so many players, who teams are convinced can be just as good, effectively locked down upon entering the majors.
The players union probably has to find a way to increase the cost of really young/minor league players in order to add value back to the more veteran players.
That's my 2 cents at least, I'm probably wrong.
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domrep
Hank Scorpio
Posts: 7,461
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Post by domrep on Feb 15, 2019 11:58:50 GMT -5
I think what shocks me about the whole thing is that Boras is a really good agent and usually has a handle on these things, and I'm sure he must be a bit surprised that his biggest client is still without a team a week or so before spring training starts. Not even the "mystery team" stuff that Heyman tweets (more than likely getting it from Boras himself) seems to be helping.
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Feb 15, 2019 13:05:50 GMT -5
Yanks and Severino agree to contract extension
4 years and $40 million and a 5th year club option
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Post by Cyno on Feb 15, 2019 14:58:15 GMT -5
Yanks bought out his arbitration years in the process. I think it's a good deal for both Sevy and the Yankees.
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Feb 15, 2019 16:09:30 GMT -5
Yanks bought out his arbitration years in the process. I think it's a good deal for both Sevy and the Yankees. $50 million top value for your Ace starter is great value even if he somehow don't work out
More of a risk for Sevy as he won't be a free agent until he's 30 but I don't blame him for taking life changing money up front and not getting greedy because if he kept the same progress and results he did now through his 4 arbitration years, he would no doubt top $50 million
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Post by häšhtå.gdālėÿ on Feb 15, 2019 19:42:22 GMT -5
Harper commented Rhys Hoskins’ latest IG post and now follows Embiid.
Troll job, nothing, or signing imminent?
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Feb 15, 2019 22:43:12 GMT -5
Harper commented Rhys Hoskins’ latest IG post and now follows Embiid. Troll job, nothing, or signing imminent? Hopefully a signing He was matched with Philly since the beginning of the offseason, hell I been saying it since November Bryce turned down $300 Million 10 year offer from Nats during the season That may seem bad to some, but that offer had no opt out. You ain't getting Bryce for that long with no opt out clause. You ain't getting any top player for that long with no opt out clause. Agreed. No longer is it good enough to secure a player a long term guaranteed deal In a deal that long it has to have at least an opt out if not 2 Also add on he will most likely surpass that deal with years and money if he wants it. Still think Philly breaks bank for him while ATL does the same for Machado
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Post by sfvega on Feb 15, 2019 22:50:40 GMT -5
Harper commented Rhys Hoskins’ latest IG post and now follows Embiid. Troll job, nothing, or signing imminent? Probably brought in when they were selling him on Philly and made friends. Absolutely wouldn't surprise me if he ends up there, but people just micro-analyze because there's nothing else to talk about.
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Post by häšhtå.gdālėÿ on Feb 16, 2019 1:01:36 GMT -5
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Feb 16, 2019 1:12:08 GMT -5
Harper commented Rhys Hoskins’ latest IG post and now follows Embiid. Troll job, nothing, or signing imminent? Probably brought in when they were selling him on Philly and made friends. Absolutely wouldn't surprise me if he ends up there, but people just micro-analyze because there's nothing else to talk about. At least games start next week
Whoever does get Machado and Harper better not expect anything for like 2 months in the season because while they may be in great shape it's still going take time to get back in game shape
Honestly, thought White Sox would get either or as well since they have a nice farm and talent coming and have money to spend. Wouldn't have been crazy if they splurged on Harper/Kimbrel
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Feb 16, 2019 10:17:52 GMT -5
With the Ybor Stadium deal dead, I'm now interested in Rays relocation talks.
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Post by sfvega on Feb 16, 2019 11:16:56 GMT -5
With the Ybor Stadium deal dead, I'm now interested in Rays relocation talks. Move them to Oakland and Megazord themselves a contender.
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Post by Heart of fools gold on Feb 16, 2019 12:48:56 GMT -5
With the Ybor Stadium deal dead, I'm now interested in Rays relocation talks. Move them to Vegas, make them share the Raiders new stadium. Move the Astros or Rangers to the AL Central and move Detroit or Cleveland to the AL East.
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Post by Cyno on Feb 16, 2019 13:24:45 GMT -5
The Rays aren't moving anywhere unless it's to another place in the Tampa Bay area or they get a new owner who has the intent to move them in the first place. In spite of the awful stadium attendance, the Rays have solid local television ratings (in fact they're among the best in the majors, which is impressive for a smaller market) and just got an amazing new TV deal last year. I've talked to Tampa locals who are Rays fans and it cannot be stressed enough how much they hate Tropicana Field. It's not just a terrible venue on its own (lack of) merits, but in a terrible location in St. Pete. It's a real pain in the ass to get there from Tampa proper and just not worth the effort.
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