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Post by OVO 40 hunched over like he 80 on Feb 9, 2019 17:06:02 GMT -5
The ironic part was that Hawk loved the angle. He said in a shoot that he thought it would make a great story if they showed him going to rehab. Animal said that he almost broke character and started laughing when Hawk tripped on the middle rope. Having worked with drug addicts and alcoholics, unfortunately this is a mentality of a drug addict. Whether they are happy with their lives or upset with their addiction, the lifestyle becomes a part of them they have to make a part of the other parts of their lives, for example the work aspect. Ultimately, their embracement of the lifestyle, even in recovery puts them in a deeper trouble and they can't get out and get back to their habits. Hawk actually was clean around that time, he just wanted to tell a positive story about a wrestler going through all the phases of addiction and rehab then finally overcoming the addiction...well that was the idea, it only led us to Droz throwing him off the titantron. It went from a feel good dramatic story to a stupid bad comedy.
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Post by jason1980s on Feb 9, 2019 17:56:41 GMT -5
I would also say the night of Raw where the signature pharmacy users were destroyed by their opponents. I most remember HHH battering Umaga with the sledgehammer and Bradshaw, I'm sure enjoying EVERY second of it, beating down Harry Smith. I get WWE was in a jam and had to write these guys out somehow and punish them but this was overkill and again, I'm sure the egomaniacs on the other giving end of the beat downs enjoyed it all.
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Nr1Humanoid
Hank Scorpio
Is the #3 humanoid at best.
Posts: 5,526
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Post by Nr1Humanoid on Feb 10, 2019 7:43:15 GMT -5
The body shaming didn't really bother me, I just found it childish, but the way they kept hammering away at Vickie Guerrero after she'd clearly worked hard to lose weight and looked damn stunning, pissed me off.
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Post by Baldobomb-22-OH-MAN!!! on Feb 10, 2019 9:54:04 GMT -5
Pretty much any angle that involved JR getting beaten up or embarrassed. The Dr. Heiney sketch, I think, was the beginning of the end of my devotion to WWE, because I think a line got crossed with that, even more than them making fun of his Bell's Palsey, all because Vince doesn't really like JR. Prichard said that Vince humiliates JR because Ross legit gets mad and sells it but he also admitted that Vince crossed the line regularly, and that he would burst out laughing when Ed Ferrara did the impression in front of him. I'm also pretty disgusted with the way vince treats JR. what happened? did Vince call his mom and JR answered the phone?
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Post by OVO 40 hunched over like he 80 on Feb 10, 2019 10:09:48 GMT -5
Prichard said that Vince humiliates JR because Ross legit gets mad and sells it but he also admitted that Vince crossed the line regularly, and that he would burst out laughing when Ed Ferrara did the impression in front of him. I'm also pretty disgusted with the way vince treats JR. what happened? did Vince call his mom and JR answered the phone? Everyone passed around Ms. Askew back in the day JR: Bah Gawd Vince fell Vickie I’m gonna be late so she better save me a plate.
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agent817
Fry's dog Seymour
Doesn't Know Whose Ring It Is
Posts: 21,308
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Post by agent817 on Feb 10, 2019 11:10:05 GMT -5
VKM versus Christy Hemme is one of the worst angles a major wrestling company has ever run. It produced bad matches, bad promos, bad comedy, and is unlikely to have contributed to even a single ticket sale. Our heroic faces, the insecure, whining misogynists who are upset that they don't have the black and green to milk anymore. Compelling television. Let's not forget that when Kip James ripped Christy's shirt off of her was a heel move, when he was supposed to be one of the faces in this angle. I mean, yes, I love looking at hot women in a state of undress as much as any other guy, but with the way that was booked, especially with Christy being the heel in that angle, it was as if they were saying that she deserved it.
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Post by willywonka666 on Feb 10, 2019 11:23:40 GMT -5
Having worked with drug addicts and alcoholics, unfortunately this is a mentality of a drug addict. Whether they are happy with their lives or upset with their addiction, the lifestyle becomes a part of them they have to make a part of the other parts of their lives, for example the work aspect. Ultimately, their embracement of the lifestyle, even in recovery puts them in a deeper trouble and they can't get out and get back to their habits. Hawk actually was clean around that time, he just wanted to tell a positive story about a wrestler going through all the phases of addiction and rehab then finally overcoming the addiction...well that was the idea, it only led us to Droz throwing him off the titantron. It went from a feel good dramatic story to a stupid bad comedy. And there was really no redemption. No comeback. No feel good ending. Nothing. That's almost as bad as the angles themselves when nothing is gained. I mapped out in my head how the comeback angle could go, like Ken Patera when he was training every week. But NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
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Post by James Fabiano on Feb 10, 2019 11:23:55 GMT -5
I would also say the night of Raw where the signature pharmacy users were destroyed by their opponents. I most remember HHH battering Umaga with the sledgehammer and Bradshaw, I'm sure enjoying EVERY second of it, beating down Harry Smith. I get WWE was in a jam and had to write these guys out somehow and punish them but this was overkill and again, I'm sure the egomaniacs on the other giving end of the beat downs enjoyed it all. See also: Public Enemy.
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Post by James Fabiano on Feb 10, 2019 11:24:35 GMT -5
Didn't XPW do a vignette where one of the valets was about to be raped?
(XPW = shooting fish in a barrel, I know...)
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Post by OVO 40 hunched over like he 80 on Feb 10, 2019 12:04:41 GMT -5
Hawk actually was clean around that time, he just wanted to tell a positive story about a wrestler going through all the phases of addiction and rehab then finally overcoming the addiction...well that was the idea, it only led us to Droz throwing him off the titantron. It went from a feel good dramatic story to a stupid bad comedy. And there was really no redemption. No comeback. No feel good ending. Nothing. That's almost as bad as the angles themselves when nothing is gained. I mapped out in my head how the comeback angle could go, like Ken Patera when he was training every week. But NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! “Bro but bro the ratings! I swear on my children!”
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Post by OVO 40 hunched over like he 80 on Feb 10, 2019 12:07:02 GMT -5
VKM versus Christy Hemme is one of the worst angles a major wrestling company has ever run. It produced bad matches, bad promos, bad comedy, and is unlikely to have contributed to even a single ticket sale. Our heroic faces, the insecure, whining misogynists who are upset that they don't have the black and green to milk anymore. Compelling television. Let's not forget that when Kip James ripped Christy's shirt off of her was a heel move, when he was supposed to be one of the faces in this angle. I mean, yes, I love looking at hot women in a state of undress as much as any other guy, but with the way that was booked, especially with Christy being the heel in that angle, it was as if they were saying that she deserved it. That angle killed everyone involved, Billy and Road Dogg broke up and was Hemme’s last program. Unfortunately it was also the biggest exposure for Jimmy Rave.
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Post by OVO 40 hunched over like he 80 on Feb 10, 2019 12:14:49 GMT -5
Another career killing angle.
Turning Mosh into a domestic abuser. Beaver Cleavage was bad enough but the domestic abuse angle pretty much erased him.
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Post by Citizen Snips on Feb 10, 2019 12:28:50 GMT -5
The body shaming didn't really bother me, I just found it childish, but the way they kept hammering away at Vickie Guerrero after she'd clearly worked hard to lose weight and looked damn stunning, pissed me off. At some mid to late 20-numbered Wrestlemania, Vickie was in a multi-woman match. She goes up to the top, does Eddie's little shimmy taunt, the crowd gets it and pops, then hits a frog splash...and Michael Cole is telling fat jokes over it. It was a sweet moment, it was actually a spontaneous WRESTLEMANIA MOMENT as opposed to all the meaningless ones they create and they ruined it by telling fat jokes about a woman that wasn't fat.
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Post by clodhopper on Feb 10, 2019 13:33:52 GMT -5
Eugene
The Hawk alcoholism stuff
Daniel Puder being "taught a lesson" in the Rumble match.
Anytime the McMahons put themselves ahead of their roster, makes the entire WWE roster feel like nothing more than a bunch of very expensive toys for 4 very rich individuals to play with.
I'm also a bit sceptical of HHH getting 100% of the glory for the success of NXT.
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Post by James Fabiano on Feb 10, 2019 14:17:06 GMT -5
The body shaming didn't really bother me, I just found it childish, but the way they kept hammering away at Vickie Guerrero after she'd clearly worked hard to lose weight and looked damn stunning, pissed me off. At some mid to late 20-numbered Wrestlemania, Vickie was in a multi-woman match. She goes up to the top, does Eddie's little shimmy taunt, the crowd gets it and pops, then hits a frog splash...and Michael Cole is telling fat jokes over it. It was a sweet moment, it was actually a spontaneous WRESTLEMANIA MOMENT as opposed to all the meaningless ones they create and they ruined it by telling fat jokes about a woman that wasn't fat. This is why Heel Michael Cole was a bad thing. Among other reasons.
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Post by James Fabiano on Feb 10, 2019 14:19:06 GMT -5
Shooting segments in real bars, having Lawler pour real whiskey on his face.... just really abhorrent stuff. Or Austin pouring a beer on Scott Hall when he was taking antibuse. Hall was also an alcoholic btw. A multi million dollar company and they can’t afford to use something else? Combined with the times Austin used creative control discussed elsewhere, and we can conclude that Austin...wasn't such a great guy generally.
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Post by James Fabiano on Feb 10, 2019 14:23:30 GMT -5
Prichard said that Vince humiliates JR because Ross legit gets mad and sells it but he also admitted that Vince crossed the line regularly, and that he would burst out laughing when Ed Ferrara did the impression in front of him. I'm also pretty disgusted with the way vince treats JR. what happened? did Vince call his mom and JR answered the phone? "Too Southern". Wouldn't just fade away when they wanted someone new, younger. "WCW stank" on him. I'd call out Eric Bischoff's treatment in his WWE run, which you know was to take the Monday Night Wars out on him. But Bischoff is a terrible person, so whatever!
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Post by James Fabiano on Feb 10, 2019 14:24:37 GMT -5
I don’t remember the exact situation, but there was a Raw segment where babyfaces Jerry Lawler and John Cena completely berated Vickie Guerrero for being ugly. It was so cringeworthy. I mean, she's the bad guy and all that, but yeah. Could they get heat on her some other way?
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Post by James Fabiano on Feb 10, 2019 14:25:09 GMT -5
Pretty much World Class from David’s death and beyond. We often talk about WWE’s lack of tact in some cases but they will never hold a candle to the way Fritz tried to turn tragedies into profit. You mean WWF/E WASN'T the absolute worst! I know scores of IWC members you can educate!!!!
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Post by James Fabiano on Feb 10, 2019 14:28:12 GMT -5
To that end, yes, the Molly version was dumber cause Trish was supposed to be the face. And she was clearly lying/overexaggerating. I am with you on why it bothered you more, after reading the other posts. What's sad is, like I said, women of a certain size are still not being accepted today, not totally. With all the PC complaints, they are still "acceptable" targets. Doesn't help that PSW who are well-known play into the stereotypes and those are the most typical roles they get or accept. Like I said, maybe they don't all think they're PS role models and thus think nothing of it, and maybe only I'm taking it seriously. Or they don't see it as such, who can say? But...it makes me sad that people like Cass Elliott, Kate Smith, Marie Dressler, et al would be laughed out of a recording studio or movie studio today. Then you had people like Karen Carpenter whom the above mindset literally murdered. And that too still happens today from time to time. (EDIT, KIND OF OT: Gizzark? You were the Rita Hayworth/classic films fan, no?) Then again, you also had the likes of Jill Scott, Kelly Price, and Marsha Ambrosius, though they have also lost weight, as well as regained some of it. I don't recall some people making fun of them, but that didn't mean that it wasn't there. Did Carnie Wilson ever suffer anything like what you mentioned? I remember some people talking crap about Missy Elliott when she was bigger. Anyway, onto the topic at hand, I agree with a lot of what was mentioned, but I really didn't like how Charlie Haas accidentally knocking Lilian Garcia off the ring apron was turned into an angle. Some of that made me cringe even back then. Yeah...I mean it looked funny at first glance, but then you hear Lilian in great pain outside of the ring. I'm sure all those women you name had mud flung at them, no matter how famous they were. Joan Rivers cracking jokes about Adele was another example. But at least they got a chance. Not everyone who doesn't look like what showbiz wants in a woman is as lucky. And the ones who are there suffer in other ways too (whether by the jokes from their peers and fans, or by being typecast....in some ways the fatty falldown roles are right down there with blackface. Yeah I said it. And then, even facing the same fate as Karen Carpenter because of the pressure to conform...)
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