tms
Don Corleone
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Post by tms on May 17, 2019 20:55:07 GMT -5
I think Captain Marvel will be fine. Thor is basically unstoppable, especially with his hammer, and they found ways around it. So we are gonna see Fat Captain Marvel? Didn't Carol go through a period in the comics the last 10 years or so where she was referred to as being thick/"thicc" by other characters?
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on May 17, 2019 21:02:19 GMT -5
Saw it and liked it. Glad Nebula and Ant-Man got to play such significant parts in the film. I doubt we'll see it, but a film showing how Bruce integrated his personalities into Professor Hulk would be great. Teared up when Widow died. She was never a favorite of mine, but it was a sad moment when she basically told Clint "I have nothing to live for other than Avenging, which is Iwhy 'm the one who will make the sacrifice". Cap's "Hail Hydra" and wielding Mjolnir were great moments for a comic book fanboy like me, as was passing on the shield to Sam. Didn't need to see him admiring his own ass though. And the implications of him staying behind in the past to live his happy ending in relative anonymity doesn't really jibe with how I perceive the character. It's been built up though in the same way Tony sacrificed himself for the greater good Tony was too selfish but Cap was too selfless. They basically reversed that trend with Tony making the ultimate sacrifice (something Cap pointed too a while back about Tony) while Cap finally got a life by making a selfish decision for himself but he knew the world would be fine Cap had been through many wars at the end of the movie on top of being frozen, he was tired and it is understandable he would make a selfish decision for himself but also make it back to pass that mantle
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Post by A Platypus Rave on May 17, 2019 21:16:41 GMT -5
Saw it and liked it. Glad Nebula and Ant-Man got to play such significant parts in the film. I doubt we'll see it, but a film showing how Bruce integrated his personalities into Professor Hulk would be great. Teared up when Widow died. She was never a favorite of mine, but it was a sad moment when she basically told Clint "I have nothing to live for other than Avenging, which is Iwhy 'm the one who will make the sacrifice". Cap's "Hail Hydra" and wielding Mjolnir were great moments for a comic book fanboy like me, as was passing on the shield to Sam. Didn't need to see him admiring his own ass though. And the implications of him staying behind in the past to live his happy ending in relative anonymity doesn't really jibe with how I perceive the character. It's been built up though in the same way Tony sacrificed himself for the greater good Tony was too selfish but Cap was too selfless. They basically reversed that trend with Tony making the ultimate sacrifice (something Cap pointed too a while back about Tony) while Cap finally got a life by making a selfish decision for himself but he knew the world would be fine Cap had been through many wars at the end of the movie on top of being frozen, he was tired and it is understandable he would make a selfish decision for himself but also make it back to pass that mantle Also there is nothing saying he lived in anonymity, In fact, I'd wager that Peggy would be cross with him for trying to shirk his responsibility like that because it's not Steve. and by their own rules they established just by going back it makes a split timeline.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 17, 2019 21:22:09 GMT -5
It's been built up though in the same way Tony sacrificed himself for the greater good Tony was too selfish but Cap was too selfless. They basically reversed that trend with Tony making the ultimate sacrifice (something Cap pointed too a while back about Tony) while Cap finally got a life by making a selfish decision for himself but he knew the world would be fine Cap had been through many wars at the end of the movie on top of being frozen, he was tired and it is understandable he would make a selfish decision for himself but also make it back to pass that mantle Also there is nothing saying he lived in anonymity, In fact, I'd wager that Peggy would be cross with him for trying to shirk his responsibility like that because it's not Steve. and by their own rules they established just by going back it makes a split timeline. Yeah, easy enough for him to be an agent of or the head of SHIELD. Hell, make him the artist for Captain America comics like he was for a bit.
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Post by Mighty Attack Tribble on May 17, 2019 21:30:48 GMT -5
Cap had been through many wars at the end of the movie on top of being frozen, he was tired and it is understandable he would make a selfish decision for himself but also make it back to pass that mantle Plus, as far as Cap's concerned, he's leaving behind a world better protected than it ever had been before. Sure. he and Tony might be gone, and Vision and Natasha too, but Earth now has the Asgardians living on it (and evidently enough of them to form an army), the combined technological and mystical might of Wakanda and the sorcerers, and the ability to call on Captain Marvel, Thor, and the Guardians. Based on Far From Home, SHIELD have reformed, and the Sokovia Accords seem to have been dissolved. The good guys are all on the same page. Plus they know how to de-age him, should he ever be needed to take up the fight again. Also there is nothing saying he lived in anonymity, In fact, I'd wager that Peggy would be cross with him for trying to shirk his responsibility like that because it's not Steve. and by their own rules they established just by going back it makes a split timeline. Let's not forget, before he became an active soldier, Steve was a celebrity, starring in movies, doing stage tours, and had his own comic book. He was America's hero even before he went in the ice, and with WWII over, he'd never be able to simply settle down for a quiet, anonymous life.
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chrom
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Post by chrom on May 17, 2019 22:06:17 GMT -5
So we are gonna see Fat Captain Marvel? Didn't Carol go through a period in the comics the last 10 years or so where she was referred to as being thick/"thicc" by other characters? That was Doctor Doom who called her fat
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Post by mcmahonfan85 on May 17, 2019 22:51:14 GMT -5
It's been built up though in the same way Tony sacrificed himself for the greater good Tony was too selfish but Cap was too selfless. They basically reversed that trend with Tony making the ultimate sacrifice (something Cap pointed too a while back about Tony) while Cap finally got a life by making a selfish decision for himself but he knew the world would be fine Cap had been through many wars at the end of the movie on top of being frozen, he was tired and it is understandable he would make a selfish decision for himself but also make it back to pass that mantle Also there is nothing saying he lived in anonymity, In fact, I'd wager that Peggy would be cross with him for trying to shirk his responsibility like that because it's not Steve. wrong. after going to the alternate timeline, he focused on having a normal life. one of the first things he and Peggy did was get married and start a family, and Steve parlayed all that grit and determination he had as Captain America into being Captain Dad. one time, his five-year-old son refused to eat broccoli, so Cap told him he wasn't leaving the table until he cleaned his plate. all night long he sat there watching his son pout and not eat the broccoli. at two in the morning his son got sick of being there and shot him an evil look, and Cap looked him straight in the eyes and said "I can do this all day" later, Cap took a job as a paper pusher at an auto plant. one morning, when they were scheduled to have a tax audit, he was walking down the hall and accidentally bumped into a secretary carrying all the pertinent paperwork, sending it flying. realizing it was too much work for her to reorganize by herself, Cap sprang into action and put out the call "Accountants assemble!" unfortunately not all his attempts at a normal life were successful. Steve being Steve, he tried giving back and being active in community by volunteering as a track and field coach at the local high school, but was promptly fired during his first meet after all the judges were knocked out by his students during the discus throw. in retrospects, it was probably not a smart idea training them to aim for the head
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Post by Bang Bang Bart on May 17, 2019 23:40:41 GMT -5
Also there is nothing saying he lived in anonymity, In fact, I'd wager that Peggy would be cross with him for trying to shirk his responsibility like that because it's not Steve. and by their own rules they established just by going back it makes a split timeline. Yeah, easy enough for him to be an agent of or the head of SHIELD. Hell, make him the artist for Captain America comics like he was for a bit. I think a really cool way to tie-in Agents of SHIELD with the movies in the future is establish Old Man Steve as the (off-screen, given appearance costs to have Chris Evans show up regularly in old man makeup/CG would be ungodly expensive) Director of SHIELD.
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Post by mcmahonfan85 on May 18, 2019 2:36:42 GMT -5
Yeah, easy enough for him to be an agent of or the head of SHIELD. Hell, make him the artist for Captain America comics like he was for a bit. I think a really cool way to tie-in Agents of SHIELD with the movies in the future is establish Old Man Steve as the (off-screen, given appearance costs to have Chris Evans show up regularly in old man makeup/CG would be ungodly expensive) Director of SHIELD. but they'd have to dump the current version of Agents of SHIELD and create an entirely new show to do that
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Post by sunnytaker on May 18, 2019 11:27:12 GMT -5
I do like Feige also mentioned that internally it is believed during Age of Ultron, Steve was being polite with Mjolnir. He didn't want to literally steal his friends Thunder >_> I heard that scenario as well. but I also remember someone involved with the movie saying it was originally a nod to the comics where Cap was deemed worthy and could lift it. but if cap could already lift the hammer in age of Ultron it's be kind of anti-climatic since he wouldn't try to use it at any point in the movie considering he could in theory save someone by using the hammer but wouldn't out of politeness. my personal theory is that the hammer recognized that steve was potentially worthy due to his nature and thus moved slightly (and a small enough amount that only Thor- someone proven worthy- even noticed) but that steve hadn't quite gotten there yet. then come endgame now he's fighting for the planet, everyone (well ok half of them) on it and especially trying to save his friend- who is himself worthy, and the hammer deemed him worthy at last. I mean cap did look a bit surprised when the hammer flew back into his hand before realizing that they might have a chance after all and jumped back into the fight. To Thor watching that just confirmed his suspicions that steve could someday become worthy and finally did. I just don't think cap would have gone so long without mentioning it to Thor or trying to use it in battle had he been worthy the whole time. fighting with one hand tied behind your back seems too out of character for steve given the stakes the avengers usually faced.
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Rican
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Post by Rican on May 18, 2019 12:08:33 GMT -5
Apologize if this has been talked about already, but within the context of this movie does anyone else retroactively hate Vision picking up Mjolnir in Age of Ultron? I don’t think it made Cap doing it less special or anything but I kinda wish he had been the only other one able to do it. Especially given that in the end ultimately Vision wasn’t all that big of a deal.
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Post by mcmahonfan85 on May 18, 2019 12:21:12 GMT -5
I think there is an unspoken "need" factor in being able to lift the hammer. in the first Thor movie, when Thor was selfish he couldn't lift the hammer because he had no need. he was trying to use it just for himself, not others. it was only after the Destroyer came that he could lift it, because he wasn't trying to wield it for himself, he needed it to save the people of the town, which is a selfless act.
in Age of Ultron, Cap could budge it because he was worthy, but couldn't lift it because he didn't have a need to. what he was doing in that moment was basically trying win a bar bet, which is a selfish act. when he picked it up in Endgame, he wasn't trying for himself, he was doing it to save Thor, which is selfless.
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on May 18, 2019 21:09:48 GMT -5
Got to go back again and praise them in how they did the Thanos character
He is still despicable but their was at least a value in current Thanos and he knew the measure of the "sacrifice" he was trying to do and didn't take it lightly. He even f***ed up and crippled his body because his goal was so noble in his mind
Past Thanos didn't have any of the lessons or the years of experience in gathering the stones so he didn't learn. His arrogance and hubris showed through in many of his actions. Just liked the little things like current Thanos having a respect for Tony and some people but the past Thanos didn't give a f***
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Chainsaw
T
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Post by Chainsaw on May 19, 2019 0:42:18 GMT -5
Apologize if this has been talked about already, but within the context of this movie does anyone else retroactively hate Vision picking up Mjolnir in Age of Ultron? I don’t think it made Cap doing it less special or anything but I kinda wish he had been the only other one able to do it. Especially given that in the end ultimately Vision wasn’t all that big of a deal. I don't. The point to make in the movie was that Vision was the best "vision" (ahem) of what Tony and Bruce were going for when they started building Ultron, and could be trusted when they doubted that he could because he was created by Ultron. The mind stone had imbued Vision with a kind and understanding soul, and thus he was deemed "worthy". It was a great moment in the movie to me, and was pivotal to the plot. Also, it's been speculated that the main reason that Steve couldn't pick up Mjolnir was because he was carrying the weight of knowing that Hydra had arranged to have Howard and Maria Stark killed in the car accident, but never told Tony about it (at that point, he didn't know that Buck had killed them as the Winter Soldier). So, after all of the heroism that he had demonstrated and completely free of that weight, he was able to weild Mjolnir finally, at the right time.
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Post by Deleted on May 19, 2019 0:50:16 GMT -5
Honestly the main takeaway I have on the whole Mjolnir conversation is that I remember f***-all about Age of Ultron beyond that it was boring.
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Post by Feyrhausen on May 19, 2019 2:59:53 GMT -5
I think there is an unspoken "need" factor in being able to lift the hammer. in the first Thor movie, when Thor was selfish he couldn't lift the hammer because he had no need. he was trying to use it just for himself, not others. it was only after the Destroyer came that he could lift it, because he wasn't trying to wield it for himself, he needed it to save the people of the town, which is a selfless act. in Age of Ultron, Cap could budge it because he was worthy, but couldn't lift it because he didn't have a need to. what he was doing in that moment was basically trying win a bar bet, which is a selfish act. when he picked it up in Endgame, he wasn't trying for himself, he was doing it to save Thor, which is selfless. Thats exactly how I see it as well.
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Post by Prince Petty on May 19, 2019 3:23:04 GMT -5
Honestly the main takeaway I have on the whole Mjolnir conversation is that I remember f***-all about Age of Ultron beyond that it was boring. I rewatched it recently, after really disliking it when i first saw it. The only good bits are the two Mjolnir gags and Wanda.
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Bub (BLM)
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Post by Bub (BLM) on May 19, 2019 13:21:46 GMT -5
It's been built up though in the same way Tony sacrificed himself for the greater good Tony was too selfish but Cap was too selfless. They basically reversed that trend with Tony making the ultimate sacrifice (something Cap pointed too a while back about Tony) while Cap finally got a life by making a selfish decision for himself but he knew the world would be fine Cap had been through many wars at the end of the movie on top of being frozen, he was tired and it is understandable he would make a selfish decision for himself but also make it back to pass that mantle Also there is nothing saying he lived in anonymity, In fact, I'd wager that Peggy would be cross with him for trying to shirk his responsibility like that because it's not Steve. and by their own rules they established just by going back it makes a split timeline. Agreed. I think knowing he wasn't damaging the future he knew, he probably used his knowledge of the past to make a better timeline. He could save Bucky, stop Hydra from infiltrating S.H.I.E.L.D., form The Avengers 2 decades earlier with Hank and Janet Pym, possibly even T'Chaka. He definitely didn't sit around letting the bad play out. I think he probably just also made sure to have a life, as it's something Clint showed him was possible.
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Post by Bang Bang Bart on May 19, 2019 13:53:23 GMT -5
Also there is nothing saying he lived in anonymity, In fact, I'd wager that Peggy would be cross with him for trying to shirk his responsibility like that because it's not Steve. and by their own rules they established just by going back it makes a split timeline. Agreed. I think knowing he wasn't damaging the future he knew, he probably used his knowledge of the past to make a better timeline. He could save Bucky, stop Hydra from infiltrating S.H.I.E.L.D., form The Avengers 2 decades earlier with Hank and Janet Pym, possibly even T'Chaka. He definitely didn't sit around letting the bad play out. I think he probably just also made sure to have a life, as it's something Clint showed him was possible. I'd actually love to see this timeline play out just to see how things would be different than the "prime" MCU timeline: - Hydra's infiltration being nipped in the bud means that Bucky would've likely been saved from being the Winter Soldier, though he'd still have the metal arms and enhanced abilities. Maybe he fights alongside Cap? - No Winter Soldier means that Howard & Maria Stark don't get killed in 1991. Would it mean Howard develops the Iron Man armor years before Tony did, and would he be an Avenger? - Would Cap try to open up relations with Wakanda early on and have them be a key ally for decades? - Does SHIELD become less of a militarized outfit and more of a peacekeeping operation in keeping with the name due to Cap & Peggy's guidance? - Since there'd be two Captains America running around ("our" Steve living with Peggy and the one still frozen in the Arctic), would we get a misunderstanding once the frozen Cap is found?
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Post by eJm on May 19, 2019 13:55:23 GMT -5
Agreed. I think knowing he wasn't damaging the future he knew, he probably used his knowledge of the past to make a better timeline. He could save Bucky, stop Hydra from infiltrating S.H.I.E.L.D., form The Avengers 2 decades earlier with Hank and Janet Pym, possibly even T'Chaka. He definitely didn't sit around letting the bad play out. I think he probably just also made sure to have a life, as it's something Clint showed him was possible. I'd actually love to see this timeline play out just to see how things would be different than the "prime" MCU timeline: - Hydra's infiltration being nipped in the bud means that Bucky would've likely been saved from being the Winter Soldier, though he'd still have the metal arms and enhanced abilities. Maybe he fights alongside Cap? - No Winter Soldier means that Howard & Maria Stark don't get killed in 1991. Would it mean Howard develops the Iron Man armor years before Tony did, and would he be an Avenger? - Would Cap try to open up relations with Wakanda early on and have them be a key ally for decades? - Does SHIELD become less of a militarized outfit and more of a peacekeeping operation in keeping with the name due to Cap & Peggy's guidance? - Since there'd be two Captains America running around ("our" Steve living with Peggy and the one still frozen in the Arctic), would we get a misunderstanding once the frozen Cap is found? TUNE IN TO “WHAT IF?” ON DISNEY+ FOR ALL THESE QUESTIONS ANSWERED AND MORE! Seriously, I’d like to see that too.
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