Shai
Hank Scorpio
Posts: 6,507
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Post by Shai on Aug 20, 2019 16:26:06 GMT -5
Listen, Into the Spiderverse was great, Venom was great....Sony is still dumb as hell for taking Spidey out a multi-billion dollar franchise where they don't actually have to make the goddamn movies.
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Rican
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
July 17, 2011 - HHHe called it
Posts: 16,461
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Post by Rican on Aug 20, 2019 16:28:14 GMT -5
No more Hot Aunt May. Sad. OK now I'm furious.
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Post by Cyno on Aug 20, 2019 16:32:07 GMT -5
Also, Sony is constantly teetering on bankruptcy and they'd probably be there already if not for the Playstation division. The chances of them buying any major media company, much less freakin' Disney, is pretty much nil.
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Dub H
Crow T. Robot
Captain Pixel: the Game Master
I ❤ Aniki
Posts: 47,825
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Post by Dub H on Aug 20, 2019 16:42:27 GMT -5
On the one hand, the MCU/Sony partnership produced two really fun movies. On the other hand, Sony all by their lonesome produced Into the Spider-Verse, which I actually prefer over both of those. So...*shrug* Completely different theam tho.
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mattperiolat
King Koopa
Thank you, Brodie... for everything.
Posts: 11,403
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Post by mattperiolat on Aug 20, 2019 16:46:14 GMT -5
On one hand I’m pissed that Sony is basically telling the company that reinvigorated their franchise and gave them their highest grossing movie to eat a dick. How much money from this deal did they use to get Venom and Spider-Verse off the ground and to find their other Venom-verse ventures? On the other hand, Kevin Feige’s cocky ass had it coming. That’s what you get for basically sweeping everything on the tv side under a rug and basically saying that it’s possible the Netflix shows aren’t canon. Well there goes my Daredevil/Spidey crossover. Eat a dick to everyone involved. I’ll counter. He didn’t sweep Netflix aside because he didn’t like them, he did it because Marvel Television is still under the control of Ike Pearlmutter. Pearlmutter was ready to fire the entire Avengers cast as expendable due to their costs after Age of Ultron. It’s also known Ike doesn’t think much of female characters - why the Black Widow movie didn’t achieve liftoff until now. Plus Civil War would have been very different had he stuck around. It drove Feige to basically say it’s Ike or me. Marvel separates Marvel Studios from Marvel Television and we get the MCU from Civil War forward. It’s only because of the friction between Ike and Feige. It’s not being cocky, it’s Ike is an asshole. And I blame Sony in as much than negotiation beyond their 95/5 counter, Sony broke talks, took Spidey and went home, effectively cutting out the MCU completely at this point. That’s arrogant at an appalling level given Venom may have been dumb luck thanks to the Chinese market. But I will concede they got Into the Spider-Verse right so... plus one, Sony? There will be two more Tom Holland Spider-Man movies currently in the works, but MCU is out. So God only knows.
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Dub H
Crow T. Robot
Captain Pixel: the Game Master
I ❤ Aniki
Posts: 47,825
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Post by Dub H on Aug 20, 2019 16:49:25 GMT -5
yeh 50 percent is a big juml. at least go for 10.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2019 16:50:57 GMT -5
Maybe it has been know already but I wonder what this does to Tom Holland...he was brought in to be the Spiderman of the MCU and so I guess he is done as Spiderman right? unless he signed on to do movies under Sony at some point or contract isn't voided.
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Shai
Hank Scorpio
Posts: 6,507
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Post by Shai on Aug 20, 2019 16:51:49 GMT -5
Marvel/Disney handing Sony billion-dollar movies on a silver platter and they took they ball and went home. That's insanity.
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Chainsaw
T
A very BAD man.
It is what it is
Posts: 90,480
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Post by Chainsaw on Aug 20, 2019 16:52:40 GMT -5
Oh happier times This just breaks my heart so, so much.
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Post by eJm on Aug 20, 2019 16:52:51 GMT -5
And I blame Sony in as much than negotiation beyond their 95/5 counter, Sony broke talks, took Spidey and went home, effectively cutting out the MCU completely at this point. That’s arrogant at an appalling level given Venom may have been dumb luck thanks to the Chinese market. But I will concede they got Into the Spider-Verse right so... plus one, Sony? You can't go into a negotiation like that, demanding as much as that and not expect the company involve to at the very least feel negative about it. As @kn said, if they went in with a solid number like 20-30, they'd probably still have the deal or at least room to negotiate down from or up if the terms were right. Considering how much Far From Home made, that's a MASSIVE chunk to be giving away even if Marvel were making the movie themselves. I'm sad he's gone from the MCU too but at the same time, this was Disney's bed to lay in.
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Post by 2coldMack is even more baffled on Aug 20, 2019 16:54:08 GMT -5
I swear to god, if they throw another f***ing origin movie at us because of this bullshit....
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Chainsaw
T
A very BAD man.
It is what it is
Posts: 90,480
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Post by Chainsaw on Aug 20, 2019 16:55:14 GMT -5
I just hate that we can't have any f***ing good thing in this world anymore.
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Chainsaw
T
A very BAD man.
It is what it is
Posts: 90,480
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Post by Chainsaw on Aug 20, 2019 16:56:11 GMT -5
I swear to god, if they throw another f***ing origin movie at us because of this bullshit.... Worse...they rehire Marc Webb and Andrew Garfield to make Amazing Spider-Man 3: Revenge of The Sinister 6.
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Post by Rolent Tex on Aug 20, 2019 16:58:18 GMT -5
On one hand I’m pissed that Sony is basically telling the company that reinvigorated their franchise and gave them their highest grossing movie to eat a dick. How much money from this deal did they use to get Venom and Spider-Verse off the ground and to find their other Venom-verse ventures? On the other hand, Kevin Feige’s cocky ass had it coming. That’s what you get for basically sweeping everything on the tv side under a rug and basically saying that it’s possible the Netflix shows aren’t canon. Well there goes my Daredevil/Spidey crossover. Eat a dick to everyone involved. I’ll counter. He didn’t sweep Netflix aside because he didn’t like them, he did it because Marvel Television is still under the control of Ike Pearlmutter. Pearlmutter was ready to fire the entire Avengers cast as expendable due to their costs after Age of Ultron. It’s also known Ike doesn’t think much of female characters - why the Black Widow movie didn’t achieve liftoff until now. Plus Civil War would have been very different had he stuck around. It drove Feige to basically say it’s Ike or me. Marvel separates Marvel Studios from Marvel Television and we get the MCU from Civil War forward. It’s only because of the friction between Ike and Feige. It’s not being cocky, it’s Ike is an asshole. And I blame Sony in as much than negotiation beyond their 95/5 counter, Sony broke talks, took Spidey and went home, effectively cutting out the MCU completely at this point. That’s arrogant at an appalling level given Venom may have been dumb luck thanks to the Chinese market. But I will concede they got Into the Spider-Verse right so... plus one, Sony? There will be two more Tom Holland Spider-Man movies currently in the works, but MCU is out. So God only knows. Oh, I know all about the drama with Perlmutter. I can’t stand that prick.
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Crappler El 0 M
Dalek
Never Forgets an Octagon
I'm a good R-Truth.
Posts: 58,479
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Post by Crappler El 0 M on Aug 20, 2019 17:01:14 GMT -5
Poor Disney.
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Post by BlackoutCreature on Aug 20, 2019 17:04:15 GMT -5
Anyway according to the Deadspin article, Disney were asking for a 50% split in profits, up from the original 95-5 in Sony's favour. It doesn't really matter how much they "improved" the Spider-Man in the eyes of the average Marvel fan, because with a split like that Sony is making far more money from their homegrown Venom movies and even shlock on the tier of the Amazing Spider-Man franchise than anything Disney makes. This is definitely a case of Disney badly misreading the power dynamics. Reading the article, it doesn't look like there was much in the way of negotiation. It may have been a case where the 50-50 split was simply Disney's initial offer and they fully expected they'd have to negotiate it down to something more reasonable like 20-25%. It's like when management negotiates with my union for our new contract. The union always walks in demanding for twice as many vacation days, management demanding half as many, and after a couple weeks of posturing we wind up with the same amount of vacation days we had to begin with. Unfortunately Sony just didn't think it was worth bothering and walked without even giving a counter-offer.
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mattperiolat
King Koopa
Thank you, Brodie... for everything.
Posts: 11,403
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Post by mattperiolat on Aug 20, 2019 17:12:22 GMT -5
And I blame Sony in as much than negotiation beyond their 95/5 counter, Sony broke talks, took Spidey and went home, effectively cutting out the MCU completely at this point. That’s arrogant at an appalling level given Venom may have been dumb luck thanks to the Chinese market. But I will concede they got Into the Spider-Verse right so... plus one, Sony? You can't go into a negotiation like that, demanding as much as that and not expect the company involve to at the very least feel negative about it. As @kn said, if they went in with a solid number like 20-30, they'd probably still have the deal or at least room to negotiate down from or up if the terms were right. Considering how much Far From Home made, that's a MASSIVE chunk to be giving away even if Marvel were making the movie themselves. I'm sad he's gone from the MCU too but at the same time, this was Disney's bed to lay in. But that’s you start a negotiation - you make a high offer, knowing you will get a low counter and you go from there. Sony pulled the rug out by going low, then after the no, they went home. Not much of a negotiation really.
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Bub (BLM)
Patti Mayonnaise
advocates duck on rodent violence
Fed. Up.
Posts: 37,742
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Post by Bub (BLM) on Aug 20, 2019 17:14:10 GMT -5
We're still keeping Tom Holland, which means favorites like Ned and MJ are probably safe too.
You know what? I'm okay with this. I got to see Spider-Man go to battle alongside the Avengers. Now I'm actually excited about a Spider-Man with Tom Holland with no MCU references. He's truly going to feel like Friendly Neighborhood Spider-Man now.
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Post by eJm on Aug 20, 2019 17:15:00 GMT -5
You can't go into a negotiation like that, demanding as much as that and not expect the company involve to at the very least feel negative about it. As @kn said, if they went in with a solid number like 20-30, they'd probably still have the deal or at least room to negotiate down from or up if the terms were right. Considering how much Far From Home made, that's a MASSIVE chunk to be giving away even if Marvel were making the movie themselves. I'm sad he's gone from the MCU too but at the same time, this was Disney's bed to lay in. But that’s you start a negotiation - you make a high offer, knowing you will get a low counter and you go from there. Sony pulled the rug out by going low, then after the no, they went home. Not much of a negotiation really. No, because basically, the starting offer was shit. Like, I'm not experienced in negotiation at all but if you were coming up to me and saying "Hey, I originally asked you for 5% of something and now I want 50% of it", sure, I can get it climbed down but if you've already shown your intentions from that, why would I bother? That's a massive jump.
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EyeofTyr
Hank Scorpio
Strange and Mystical
Posts: 5,744
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Post by EyeofTyr on Aug 20, 2019 17:18:39 GMT -5
By all accounts Spiderverse was as good as it was because Sony didn't really have a huge hand in its making, they didn't see it being even remotely the success it became, this tracks even with how they talked about it to investors and in emails. They were banking on Venom and their co-MCU efforts bringing in the bank, Spiderverse was a passion project of those working on it that Sony thought could make them some quick cash like a lot of their animated movies.
Now that it's a success though, now that they're seeing an opportunity through it to do their hair brained Spider-Man Cinematic Universe, it's clear they're going to be more hands on. I pray that the Spiderverse sequel and any spin-off's don't get Amazing Spider-Man'd. Nobody deserves to have happen to them what happened to Marc Webb. Or what happened to Sam with Spider-Man 3.
This is an idiotic move on Sony's part. Either we're getting a heavily redacted new Spider-Man 3 or we're in for a third reboot of the Spider-Man live action cinematic experience.
Neither particularly fills me with joy.
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