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Post by Savage Gambino on Jan 10, 2020 13:21:50 GMT -5
A lot of speculation that Derrickson walked because he was asked to rewrite too much of his original story to accommodate the tie-in to WandaVision. It's definitely plausible. Wouldn't surprise me. IIRC, the killing blow for Edgar Wright at Marvel (besides him dragging his ass for almost a decade) was that his Ant-Man wasn't sufficiently tied to the greater MCU. I can't imagine how frustrating it must be writing for a movie that's "part of a greater universe", when you have to take four or five other projects you aren't even working on into account.
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Post by Kevin Hamilton on Jan 10, 2020 13:46:33 GMT -5
At this point though you've kind of got to know the deal-- they've been doing them that way for a decade.
You're not gonna be a McDonald's franchisee and say "cheeseburgers? Nope. We've got spaghetti! And blankets." /hedberg
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Post by Mighty Attack Tribble on Jan 10, 2020 13:55:04 GMT -5
A lot of speculation that Derrickson walked because he was asked to rewrite too much of his original story to accommodate the tie-in to WandaVision. It's definitely plausible. Wouldn't surprise me. IIRC, the killing blow for Edgar Wright at Marvel (besides him dragging his ass for almost a decade) was that his Ant-Man wasn't sufficiently tied to the greater MCU. I can't imagine how frustrating it must be writing for a movie that's "part of a greater universe", when you have to take four or five other projects you aren't even working on into account. "I wanted to make a Marvel movie, but Marvel didn't want to make an Edgar Wright movie." Marvel definitely want directors to stamp their own personality on their movies (Taika Waititi and James Gunn being a prime examples) but be able to accept that each movie isn't 100% "theirs." Wright definitely had trouble fitting his version of Ant-Man into the wider universe, and Doctor Strange 2 is following on directly from not only WandaVision but Loki as well, while also apparently planting seeds for Blade and Moon Knight. That's a lot of stuff to work in that Derrickson himself has no stake in.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Jan 10, 2020 14:47:37 GMT -5
Marvel afraid to rock the boat as per usual to keep the kiddies and adult kiddies entertained at the theme park. Well, it's only the millions upon millions of dollars invested into it that's likely holding them back. Plus, what kind of horror are we talking about here? Outside of existential, Lovecraftian horror, Dr. Strange doesn't have much to do with horror.
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Post by Fade is a CodyCryBaby on Jan 10, 2020 15:02:45 GMT -5
Marvel afraid to rock the boat as per usual to keep the kiddies and adult kiddies entertained at the theme park. Well, it's only the millions upon millions of dollars invested into it that's likely holding them back.. Yeah, creatively it’s depressing but thinking about it financially you can absolute see the sensibility in Marvels approach.
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Post by Mighty Attack Tribble on Jan 10, 2020 15:04:18 GMT -5
Marvel afraid to rock the boat as per usual to keep the kiddies and adult kiddies entertained at the theme park. Well, it's only the millions upon millions of dollars invested into it that's likely holding them back. Plus, what kind of horror are we talking about here? Outside of existential, Lovecraftian horror, Dr. Strange doesn't have much to do with horror. Feige clarified that it would be scary, but not necessarily horror, citing what Spielberg did with Raiders of the Lost Ark.
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riseofsetian1981
King Koopa
"I met him fifteen years ago. I was told there was nothing left."
Posts: 10,323
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Post by riseofsetian1981 on Jan 10, 2020 15:18:54 GMT -5
Marvel afraid to rock the boat as per usual to keep the kiddies and adult kiddies entertained at the theme park. That's been one of my complaints regarding the direction of the MCU. It's time that Marvel began to take some creative risks, venturing more into unique, experimental, and darker territory without being concerned about the reactions. Upon watching the first "Iron Man" and "The Incredible Hulk", obviously there's a lot of interesting elements, the stories were more serious, and they didn't necessarily play it safe. Once again I can't get mad at Marvel seeing as when Disney bought them up, literally all of their films have become critical and financially successful. I wish they'd go back to the tone and direction of the first "Iron Man", "Incredible Hulk", or even "Winter Soldier". Which it actually seems like "Black Widow" might be very similar to "Winter Soldier".
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Post by Kevin Hamilton on Jan 10, 2020 15:51:59 GMT -5
They absolutely played it fairly safe with Incredible Hulk. If anything, most of it was a direct response to the way more experimental Ang Lee version.
Further, darker takes only really work for very few characters.
Generally your superhero films, just like superhero comics SHOULD be accessible to general audiences and kids in particular. Notice I didn't say aimed at---accessible to. The stuff that isn't accessible should be fee and far between, otherwise it doesn't stand out and is just as formulaic as Marvel stuff can sometimes be the other direction.
But for the most part superheroes ARE for kids first and foremost. They just are. You can vary that up on occasion&play with those tropes in darker ways, but that's never going to be the norm, nor should it be.
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Post by Koda, Master Crunchyroller on Jan 10, 2020 16:35:49 GMT -5
I have to wonder if being told to change too many things again just annoyed him too.
Because I just remembered that he and his co-writer were told to cut out a lot of the stuff they really wanted to do with the first film because the higher powers felt it was too much for a Doctor Strange origin film, but they should hold onto their ideas for the sequel, and now we have the sequel and now the dude is gone(actually both of them are gone, since the co-writer wasn’t even brought back to start with), so I guess being told “No” again just tipped the scale too much for him to accept.
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Post by A Platypus Rave on Jan 10, 2020 17:48:05 GMT -5
I have to wonder if being told to change too many things again just annoyed him too. Because I just remembered that he and his co-writer were told to cut out a lot of the stuff they really wanted to do with the first film because the higher powers felt it was too much for a Doctor Strange origin film, but they should hold onto their ideas for the sequel, and now we have the sequel and now the dude is gone(actually both of them are gone, since the co-writer wasn’t even brought back to start with), so I guess being told “No” again just tipped the scale too much for him to accept. He mentioned in older tweets hating having a set release date. That probably didn't help. He got lucky with Strange one getting moved back so he had time to go back and rewrite the film again... but... since this is literally the first part of Phase 4 (movie wise anyway) it's going to be hard to move it without messing up literally everything else.
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Post by Kevin Hamilton on Jan 10, 2020 17:58:22 GMT -5
Particularly if Crazy Wanda is going to be a driving force of the set of movies like it seems to be setting up for.
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Post by "Cane Dewey" Johnson on Jan 10, 2020 21:55:24 GMT -5
The MCU method strikes again.
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Post by Natural Born Farmer on Jan 10, 2020 22:56:06 GMT -5
Scott Derrickson said numerous times of the original film that all the producer feedback he got was “can you make it weirder?”
This is also they studio that bankrolled two films where the biggest stars were a sentient tree and a cybernetic raccoon.
I think Derrickson’s exit is ominous but it’s not time to start sounding the seventh trumpet.
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Post by Mighty Attack Tribble on Jan 14, 2020 17:17:46 GMT -5
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Post by Koda, Master Crunchyroller on Jan 14, 2020 17:22:11 GMT -5
Hmm. I mean I always figured that Mordo would play part in it but the Time Stone again? Maybe one of the friction points was Disney wanted a bigger focus on Mordo while the director wanted to finally get his Nightmare-focused film(he wanted to use Nightmare in the first film and was apparently saying he’d be using Nightmare in this film too). Now obviously MCU films aren’t strangers(heh) to using multiple villains in a single film, but still.
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Post by A Platypus Rave on Jan 14, 2020 17:27:40 GMT -5
Hmm. I mean I always figured that Mordo would play part in it but the Time Stone again? Maybe one of the friction points was Disney wanted a bigger focus on Mordo while the director wanted to finally get his Nightmare-focused film(he wanted to use Nightmare in the first film and was apparently saying he’d be using Nightmare in this film too). Now obviously MCU films aren’t strangers(heh) to using multiple villains in a single film, but still. I wouldn't be surprised if Mordo was supposed to appear but I think the time stone showing up so quickly after Infinity War/End Game makes me think this isn't true. at least not the actual Stone.
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Post by Feyrhausen on Jan 14, 2020 18:35:08 GMT -5
A lot of speculation that Derrickson walked because he was asked to rewrite too much of his original story to accommodate the tie-in to WandaVision. It's definitely plausible. Wouldn't surprise me. IIRC, the killing blow for Edgar Wright at Marvel (besides him dragging his ass for almost a decade) was that his Ant-Man wasn't sufficiently tied to the greater MCU. I can't imagine how frustrating it must be writing for a movie that's "part of a greater universe", when you have to take four or five other projects you aren't even working on into account. IIRC Wright was even developing Ant Man before there was really a plan for a greater MCU. If so I see his point if he was developing something that they later required him to rework to fit the greater scheme.
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Post by burdette25159 on Jan 14, 2020 19:01:55 GMT -5
I can see Doctor Strange's spot being taken up by another movie
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Post by Mighty Attack Tribble on Jan 14, 2020 19:19:25 GMT -5
I can see Doctor Strange's spot being taken up by another movie It's possible, but production doesn't begin for another five months. Derrickson wasn't the screenwriter, so his leaving the movie won't affect the finishing of the script. These movies don't live or die on the directors as much as a regular movie does.
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Post by A Platypus Rave on Jan 14, 2020 21:03:32 GMT -5
Wouldn't surprise me. IIRC, the killing blow for Edgar Wright at Marvel (besides him dragging his ass for almost a decade) was that his Ant-Man wasn't sufficiently tied to the greater MCU. I can't imagine how frustrating it must be writing for a movie that's "part of a greater universe", when you have to take four or five other projects you aren't even working on into account. IIRC Wright was even developing Ant Man before there was really a plan for a greater MCU. If so I see his point if he was developing something that they later required him to rework to fit the greater scheme. From what I remember part of it was Wright didn't want to use Pym at all.
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