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Post by Kevin Hamilton on Apr 29, 2022 11:50:11 GMT -5
It changed the wrestling landscape entirely, sold massive amounts of tickets, ppvs, and merch. It did all that while providing compelling viewing.
By any measure you want to use it's a good angle.
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tafkaga
Samurai Cop
the Dogfather
Posts: 2,169
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Post by tafkaga on Apr 29, 2022 13:00:49 GMT -5
Thank you everyone for responding to my question. I am early in my rewatch and these perspectives have infused me with a bit more enthusiasm to trudge forward.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Apr 29, 2022 13:15:02 GMT -5
It became overplayed and really, it should have ended at Starrcade. Maybe with Hogan getting increasingly paranoid at not only the thought of finally facing Sting, but also of Hall and Nash taking his spot. Sting ends up destroying Hogan, who then takes a hiatus as the rest of the nWo crumbles. If it ends at Starrcade with Sting willing decisively, then I genuinely think it goes down as the single greatest wrestling angle of all time. Even over Austin/McMahon. Let it stand as a good example of why you start from the beginning, figure out your end, and THEN fill in the middle.
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Post by bogussting on Apr 30, 2022 6:35:25 GMT -5
The first year and a half is still the greatest angle in history.
1998: Solid.
Started to get pretty stale by early 1999.
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Post by evilone on Apr 30, 2022 9:52:10 GMT -5
It was the greastest storyline and stable in history of wrestling. Period.
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Post by "Evil Brood" Jackson Vanik on Apr 30, 2022 10:01:44 GMT -5
Rewatch the first 6-12 months of it. It was revolutionary and created a sort of excitement that you rarely see. The stakes felt high, you never knew where it might go, the characters were over, and the crowds were hot. It was incredible. They just couldn't find the right off ramp.
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Post by Milkman Norm on Apr 30, 2022 10:08:21 GMT -5
Historically important, game changing and industry revitalizing? Yes. Good? The first part was for sure. The trouble was the seeds of it's demise were planted from the start. The initial run worked because of the way the group functioned. Once they did clean(ish) jobs that was over. So those jobs were delayed way past when they should have happened and fans stated to lose interest. At some point there either needed to be clean face/heel split among the nWo that lasted, or the group needed to blown up after doing a job(s) at a major show.
The other problem was that the nWo was so over WCW didn't bother to build babyfaces, other then Page & later Goldberg. Instead they took an established face, changed his gimmick and had him not wrestle for a year. So when he finally did wrestle he hadn't figured out how to work differently then he used to. Granted the match was sabotaged but even it hadn't been it was clear he wasn't the guy.
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Post by sfvega on Apr 30, 2022 15:48:56 GMT -5
Was it really a good angle? Yeah, easily a top 3 angle in the history of wrestling. Dragged on and had the ending sabotaged by an old shithead, but that first year+ was the most interesting TV WCW ever produced. I think the biggest issue with it other than Bisch getting too close and Hogan being an unprofessional jerk is that Bischoff fundamentally misunderstood the thing that made him. He wanted separate shows, he gave NWO a PPV that tanked. NWO always worked best as a disruptive force. Hall breaking up a match, Nash powerbombing Bischoff in the middle of GAB, the gang fight in Orlando, the baseball bats. How the f*** are you going to be a disruptive force ON YOUR OWN SHOW? Taking an anti-establishment group and making them the establishment. Eric didn't understand. Historically important, game changing and industry revitalizing? Yes. Good? The first part was for sure. The trouble was the seeds of it's demise were planted from the start. The initial run worked because of the way the group functioned. Once they did clean(ish) jobs that was over. So those jobs were delayed way past when they should have happened and fans stated to lose interest. At some point there either needed to be clean face/heel split among the nWo that lasted, or the group needed to blown up after doing a job(s) at a major show. The other problem was that the nWo was so over WCW didn't bother to build babyfaces, other then Page & later Goldberg. Instead they took an established face, changed his gimmick and had him not wrestle for a year. So when he finally did wrestle he hadn't figured out how to work differently then he used to. Granted the match was sabotaged but even it hadn't been it was clear he wasn't the guy.I'm not sure that you're giving any credit to how absolutely bad WCW's world title matches/main events were. The bar for the in-ring work was....I don't know, bad? Awful? Hogan and Giant were the guys, Luger for a bit, some transitional reigns for Savage and Flair but Savage was past his prime and before his career Renaissance. Not to mention guys moving through PPV main events like an old, bad hip Roddy Piper or Tiny Lister. Sting would have been fine as "The Guy", and fine is damn-near a high-water mark for WCW's main event at that point.
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Post by Hit Girl on Apr 30, 2022 16:46:44 GMT -5
You should get an nWo beatdown for asking such an impertinent question, followed by having your back spray painted with "nWo 4 life".
A week later, you will join the nWo.
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Post by Hypnosis on Apr 30, 2022 17:03:55 GMT -5
You should get an nWo beatdown for asking such an impertinent question, followed by having your back spray painted with "nWo 4 life". A week later, you will join the nWo. And then get kicked out if you can't "cut the mustard", brother.
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Post by TOK Hehe'd Around & Found Out on May 1, 2022 10:17:20 GMT -5
The whole thing blew up because Sting just wasn't in condition to be champ ("he didn't have a tan" is Bischoff not wanting to air out Sting's personal issues and battle with addiction) when they got to Starcade. Why didn't any decision makers talk to Sting at all in the month prior to their biggest show of all time at that point? Because WCW! They could have done anything else afterwards to kickstart the NWO break-up and the new era of WCW but instead they made both their franchise at the height of his popularity and their brand-new signing of the hottest free agent in pro wrestling history look like dorks to make sure that nothing would come close to overshadowing the NWO split. The angle was fantastic, they just never let it end because they didn't want to kill the cash cow that kept the lights on. I think one of the issues is the end game of the angle. A heel faction like that needs comeuppance on a big stage. Whether it was by Sting, Goldberg, Bret Hart, whomever. It needs the final nail in the coffin to put it down. Instead Bischoff started running NWO PPV's and eventually wanted to basically turn WCW into NWO. And like, where does that really lead to? The heels run a wrestling company? Then what? It would have just ended up being the Wolfpac/Hollywood angle, but for control of Nitro. Still stupid but there was at least an endgame and someone finally turned face.
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Post by Baldobomb-22-OH-MAN!!! on May 1, 2022 15:11:10 GMT -5
It started good but then WCE forgot the part where they were supposed to lose in the end.
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khali
Dennis Stamp
Posts: 4,646
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Post by khali on May 2, 2022 18:40:31 GMT -5
The endgame was botched, but the beginnings and the Sting aspect of the story are some of the best things ever done in wrestling. The build up to Fall Brawl 1996, the angle done on the show, the promo that came the night after were all so good. There’s some great storytelling in the nWo stuff before it faded out.
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Post by EP 54 is banned from Collision on May 2, 2022 19:08:44 GMT -5
I always think that, yes it was a good angle for getting people through the door... but it wasn't what made peple stay. WCW was providing a better product at the time right up until the main event. The cruisers, lucha and puro guys were tearing shit up on a weekly basis. The main event was meh at best. Compare that to WWF who had some of the best guys to ever lace them up in the mains, but had a terrible undercard.
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Allie Kitsune
Crow T. Robot
Always Feelin' Foxy.
HaHa U FaLL 4 LaVa TriK
Posts: 46,254
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Post by Allie Kitsune on May 2, 2022 19:21:36 GMT -5
I think the angle really fell apart completely during the finger poke of doom. It started declining when the Sting/Hogan match was botched. It was feeling played out by 98, but the Wolfpack stuff honestly gave it more life. People forget who enormously popular the NWO Red and White was. The problem was they never had a proper blowoff. Which is probably the major issue of the storyline as a whole. I think one problem is that NWO probably got too popular and drew too much money. That’s incredibly weird to say, but in Bischoff’s perfect world, he would have rode that train forever. It wasn’t as simple as having a Wargames match to blowoff a feud with a faction. The NWO was legit the most popular thing going for so long. So in Bischoff’s mind probably, why end it? Of course, that goes against the basic idea of the babyfaces finally going over. And even when they did, it was completely botched (Starrcade 97) and happened at the wrong time (Goldberg beating Hogan.) That’s why the Finger Poke of Doom was a complete failure. It made all those victories meaningless because now the NWO is at full strength again, and now back to square one. And of course it didn’t matter, because it all died with a whimper anyway. I will put the NWO angle in 96 and 97 to a high degree, because I felt they were very compelling. But they never knew what the right time was to blow it off…and I don’t think they ever wanted to. Which is the biggest issue. To me, it was the Bret stuff that killed it for me. The whole weird "Well, he's kind of nWo, but he isn't" thing they were doing by having him wear Hogan (instead of nWo) shirts and kiss Hogan's ass.
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Johnny B. Decent
Patti Mayonnaise
Had one once
Everybody's Favorite Arizonian.
Posts: 31,084
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Post by Johnny B. Decent on May 2, 2022 22:40:12 GMT -5
It changed the wrestling landscape entirely, sold massive amounts of tickets, ppvs, and merch. It did all that while providing compelling viewing. By any measure you want to use it's a good angle. It definitely went on far past it's expiration date, but in 96-97? It made WCW money hand over fist. You'd see nWo shirts everywhere.
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Post by oxbaker on May 4, 2022 1:50:26 GMT -5
Started off great, then got ruined when nearly everyone on the WCW roster and even special guests (the Dinner & A Movie guys and Kyle Petty) joined. I remember a long car ride to a wrestling show out of state with my buddy and we, of course, talk wrestling to pass the time over and back. And one time we said, ‘Let’s try to think of everyone in WCW who didn’t end up joining the nWo in some form or fashion.’ It didn’t take very long, haha. And much of the time it did take was ‘what about so-and-so … oh yeah, he was in Wolfpack’ or whatever.
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