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Post by koreycaskets on Mar 19, 2023 11:54:16 GMT -5
Asuka for the win! Bianca wins it back at SummerSlam
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Chiral
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Post by Chiral on Mar 19, 2023 12:01:08 GMT -5
I feel like she has a better chance of finding E&C's time machine from SVR11 and going back to change one of her past WM results than to lose to current Bianca.
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Timeless Hayterade
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Post by Timeless Hayterade on Mar 19, 2023 12:13:47 GMT -5
I want to be wrong, but I doubt she'll win.
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Post by mistery on Mar 19, 2023 12:44:57 GMT -5
I think the problem at the end of the day is that people want Asuka to win, but those people aren't making the creative decisions. And Bianca herself has grown incredibly stale as champion and hasn't evolved in well over a year at this point. It doesn't help that Bianca herself is incredibly limited character wise and massively protected, to the detriment of the health of the division. There's no one they've really built up to beat Bianca, and they don't seem interested in doing so, which is harming her. Its either that, or Bianca just outright sucks at selling people as threats, which is equally likely since she's probably the second or third worst seller in the entire company, only behind Charlotte and maybe Ronda.
They have basically two weeks to build up to a title change, and I don't think they'll do it. Which sucks for Asuka as this new character is one of the hottest acts in the company right now, but she's just going to be used to put over Bianca again, which kills any sort of mystique and momentum the new character might have. Because Bianca has been no selling her mind games.
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Post by "Evil Brood" Jackson Vanik on Mar 19, 2023 12:46:03 GMT -5
This hasn't been built like a feud where you would expect a title change.
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Post by ThankGodForSidJustice on Mar 19, 2023 13:40:33 GMT -5
I will say yes mainly because I don't know why they would go through all the trouble of giving Asuka this big sudden repush just for her to lose. Although I wouldn't be surprised at all if Bianca wins.
While Bianca as champion is stale, I don't think Asuka winning helps the overall problem either. That being they are really lacking strong heels that are either interesting or have credibility. Really all they can do is have several rematches to kill a few months or have them feud with the likes of Becky or Bayley in which all of those combinations have already been done countless times.
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Post by mistery on Mar 19, 2023 14:08:16 GMT -5
I will say yes mainly because I don't know why they would go through all the trouble of giving Asuka this big sudden repush just for her to lose. Although I wouldn't be surprised at all if Bianca wins. While Bianca as champion is stale, I don't think Asuka winning helps the overall problem either. That being they are really lacking strong heels that are either interesting or have credibility. Really all they can do is have several rematches to kill a few months or have them feud with the likes of Becky or Bayley in which all of those combinations have already been done countless times. I think the heel issue is more easily addressed by the fact that unlike Asuka, Bianca has ran over almost the entire heel side of the division multiple times in the past year alone. Where Asuka has way more feuds she could do as champion. It seems obvious they are building up women like Doudrop/Piper Niven to be threats going forward, but it wouldn't help against Bianca, considering we just saw that feud last year and it was basically 8 weeks of Piper/Bianca rematches, with Bianca easily winning every time.
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Post by ThankGodForSidJustice on Mar 19, 2023 14:29:52 GMT -5
I will say yes mainly because I don't know why they would go through all the trouble of giving Asuka this big sudden repush just for her to lose. Although I wouldn't be surprised at all if Bianca wins. While Bianca as champion is stale, I don't think Asuka winning helps the overall problem either. That being they are really lacking strong heels that are either interesting or have credibility. Really all they can do is have several rematches to kill a few months or have them feud with the likes of Becky or Bayley in which all of those combinations have already been done countless times. I think the heel issue is more easily addressed by the fact that unlike Asuka, Bianca has ran over almost the entire heel side of the division multiple times in the past year alone. Where Asuka has way more feuds she could do as champion. Even if Asuka wins though, Bianca running through all the heels is still a problem since now they aren't credible if you want to put them against Asuka. Also what feuds can you do with Asuka? We've already seen her against Becky a bunch. We've already seen her against Bayley a bunch. Then after those two there's nobody else that has been presented as mattering on Raw. Also Asuka has already mowed through quite few women herself. In the last month she's destroyed both Liv and Carmella several times and while neither of those two are believable title threats at this point I guess they could've been used as secondary filler challengers. I guess the biggest potential match for her would be Iyo Sky who hasn't been presented as being at that level on the main roster at this point. Honestly as stale as she is as champion I think there's probably more value in keeping the belt on Bianca in that at least if they do a draft you can have matches with her against Charlotte/Rhea or Ronda which are the only fresh combinations of the main event women left and would be bigger money matches then anything you can potentially do with Asuka at this point. There's really nothing big you could do with either as champion in Raw's current landscape.
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Post by joeiscool on Mar 19, 2023 14:43:20 GMT -5
I hope not
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john84
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Post by john84 on Mar 19, 2023 15:13:06 GMT -5
I'd like her to but sadly I don't see it (or, rather, expect it to lol). Especially since she's up against Bianca who they clearly seem to have long-term plans for as a top woman in the women's division.
I'd be one happy poster if I'm wrong though lol, nothing against Bianca though.
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Post by sarkerpolseng on Mar 19, 2023 15:17:31 GMT -5
I think Asuka is gonna go to a dark place at WM and win the title against Bianca. Scary Asuka heel champ for Bianca to feud with in the months ahead.
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Post by mistery on Mar 19, 2023 15:25:24 GMT -5
I think the heel issue is more easily addressed by the fact that unlike Asuka, Bianca has ran over almost the entire heel side of the division multiple times in the past year alone. Where Asuka has way more feuds she could do as champion. Even if Asuka wins though, Bianca running through all the heels is still a problem since now they aren't credible if you want to put them against Asuka. Also what feuds can you do with Asuka? We've already seen her against Becky a bunch. We've already seen her against Bayley a bunch. Then after those two there's nobody else that has been presented as mattering on Raw. Also Asuka has already mowed through quite few women herself. In the last month she's destroyed both Liv and Carmella several times and while neither of those two are believable title threats at this point I guess they could've been used as secondary filler challengers. I guess the biggest potential match for her would be Iyo Sky who hasn't been presented as being at that level on the main roster at this point. Honestly as stale as she is as champion I think there's probably more value in keeping the belt on Bianca in that at least if they do a draft you can have matches with her against Charlotte/Rhea or Ronda which are the only fresh combinations of the main event women left and would be bigger money matches then anything you can potentially do with Asuka at this point. There's really nothing big you could do with either as champion in Raw's current landscape. I have to 100% disagree on there being any sort of value left with Bianca as champ. She's grown incredibly stale as champion and her flaws have gotten incredibly noticeable at this point to where even casual fans are starting to point it out. She's awful at selling, her promos are incredibly one dimensional, and she can't have a good match with anyone who isn't a 4HW or Asuka really. And her character hasn't changed at all. You have to remember that if Bianca wins at Mania this year, she likely isn't losing the title until at least Summerslam, and if she makes it through Summerslam, she probably is making it to Mania next year as well. And at that point, her likability will be completely shot to pieces because there's zero chance they try and address her flaws. As for the draft, Charlotte coming over to RAW and taking the title from Bianca would absolutely suck and be an all time bad decision (I also don't think the match would have any sort of real heat behind it since they have anti-chemistry in the ring), and Ronda has been incredibly vocal about wanting the women's tag titles, plus FOX wants both her and Charlotte for Smackdown. Asuka can easily go back and feud with Damage CTRL, and you can have her be in a tweener role for feuds with women like Mia Yim, Candice LeRae, Nikki Cross, etc. As for their credibility, Asuka will do a hell of a lot more to make them look good than Bianca does, who no sells their promos, goes "girl nuh uh", calls herself the EST, and then effortlessly beats them in a match with literally zero suspense in it. I think it's just time to face reality here in that Bianca absolutely sucks at building up feuds and is more focused on putting herself over than actually making other women look good. And like mentioned above and before, Asuka getting this repackage just to be fed to Bianca would absolutely murder Asuka to the point where I don't think she would ever recover from it. And as for Asuka's lack of promo ability, I'm sure fans would rather listen to her talk than listen to yet another Bianca promo where she just says the same thing every week.
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Post by ThankGodForSidJustice on Mar 19, 2023 15:58:06 GMT -5
Even if Asuka wins though, Bianca running through all the heels is still a problem since now they aren't credible if you want to put them against Asuka. Also what feuds can you do with Asuka? We've already seen her against Becky a bunch. We've already seen her against Bayley a bunch. Then after those two there's nobody else that has been presented as mattering on Raw. Also Asuka has already mowed through quite few women herself. In the last month she's destroyed both Liv and Carmella several times and while neither of those two are believable title threats at this point I guess they could've been used as secondary filler challengers. I guess the biggest potential match for her would be Iyo Sky who hasn't been presented as being at that level on the main roster at this point. Honestly as stale as she is as champion I think there's probably more value in keeping the belt on Bianca in that at least if they do a draft you can have matches with her against Charlotte/Rhea or Ronda which are the only fresh combinations of the main event women left and would be bigger money matches then anything you can potentially do with Asuka at this point. There's really nothing big you could do with either as champion in Raw's current landscape. I have to 100% disagree on there being any sort of value left with Bianca as champ. She's grown incredibly stale as champion and her flaws have gotten incredibly noticeable at this point to where even casual fans are starting to point it out. She's awful at selling, her promos are incredibly one dimensional, and she can't have a good match with anyone who isn't a 4HW or Asuka really. And her character hasn't changed at all. You have to remember that if Bianca wins at Mania this year, she likely isn't losing the title until at least Summerslam, and if she makes it through Summerslam, she probably is making it to Mania next year as well. And at that point, her likability will be completely shot to pieces because there's zero chance they try and address her flaws. As for the draft, Charlotte coming over to RAW and taking the title from Bianca would absolutely suck and be an all time bad decision (I also don't think the match would have any sort of real heat behind it since they have anti-chemistry in the ring), and Ronda has been incredibly vocal about wanting the women's tag titles, plus FOX wants her for Smackdown. Asuka can easily go back and feud with Damage CTRL, and you can have her be in a tweener role for feuds with women like Mia Yim, Candice LeRae, Nikki Cross, etc. As for their credibility, Asuka will do a hell of a lot more to make them look good than Bianca does, who no sells their promos, goes "girl nuh uh", calls herself the EST, and then effortlessly beats them in a match with literally zero suspense in it. I think it's just time to face reality here in that Bianca absolutely sucks at building up feuds and is more focused on putting herself over than actually making other women look good. And like mentioned above and before, Asuka getting this repackage just to be fed to Bianca would absolutely murder Asuka to the point where I don't think she would ever recover from it. And as for Asuka's lack of promo ability, I'm sure fans would rather listen to her talk than listen to yet another Bianca promo where she just says the same thing every week. I agree about Belair with her reign being uninteresting and her only being good at putting herself over. However I don't really see any great alternatives either. I don't care for Charlotte or Ronda either but like it or not they are two of the few women they actually present as stars. Mia Yim, Candice LeRae, Nikki Cross are all midcard at best and have all been devalued a good bit. Nobody is going to care about them against Asuka. If they had done a better job protecting Piper Niven the last couple years I think her and Asuka is something that could've had potential. But they haven't so that would be a hard sell too. If it came down to it I would rather have Asuka as champion too. However business wise I don't think it's going to lead to some huge improvement either mainly for the reason I mentioned earlier about there being no opponents for her that would be both fresh and interesting. It will be just like her 2020 title reign where she was a really good wrestler who had good matches but there wasn't anything interesting storyline wise that really made you want to watch mainly due the fact she was primarily feuding with other women who had been on top and pushed hard (Bayley, Sasha, Alexa, Charlotte) for years.
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Post by EoE: Well There's Your Problem on Mar 19, 2023 16:32:22 GMT -5
I’m leaning towards no, mostly because I think it’s more likely that Ripley beats Flair and I’m not sure they’ll have both women’s belts change hands.
This card could easily have every belt that’s up for grabs change hands, but the only ones I’m a bit iffy on are Belair and Theory.
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Post by mistery on Mar 19, 2023 16:58:02 GMT -5
I’m leaning towards no, mostly because I think it’s more likely that Ripley beats Flair and I’m not sure they’ll have both women’s belts change hands. This card could easily have every belt that’s up for grabs change hands, but the only ones I’m a bit iffy on are Belair and Theory. Normally I would agree, but with the women's tag titles no longer seemingly being defended at the event, I think its more likely both women's titles change hands. Also with it being Wrestlemania, I can see them wanting to put over Muta and his legacy in some shape or form and having Asuka mist Bianca to get the win. I think its likely that Gunther and Theory retain their titles though.
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gl83
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Post by gl83 on Mar 19, 2023 17:15:11 GMT -5
I think the heel issue is more easily addressed by the fact that unlike Asuka, Bianca has ran over almost the entire heel side of the division multiple times in the past year alone. Where Asuka has way more feuds she could do as champion. Even if Asuka wins though, Bianca running through all the heels is still a problem since now they aren't credible if you want to put them against Asuka. Also what feuds can you do with Asuka? We've already seen her against Becky a bunch. We've already seen her against Bayley a bunch. Then after those two there's nobody else that has been presented as mattering on Raw. Also Asuka has already mowed through quite few women herself. In the last month she's destroyed both Liv and Carmella several times and while neither of those two are believable title threats at this point I guess they could've been used as secondary filler challengers. I guess the biggest potential match for her would be Iyo Sky who hasn't been presented as being at that level on the main roster at this point. Honestly as stale as she is as champion I think there's probably more value in keeping the belt on Bianca in that at least if they do a draft you can have matches with her against Charlotte/Rhea or Ronda which are the only fresh combinations of the main event women left and would be bigger money matches then anything you can potentially do with Asuka at this point. There's really nothing big you could do with either as champion in Raw's current landscape. Really says a lot about how piss-poor their booking is that Damage Ctrl(for all their problems) are basically your de facto Top Heels on Raw. I mean you have Rhea, who’s set to win the SD Women’s title and move over to Smackdown; Alexa Bliss, who’s gone MIA; and it’s not like a Draft will fix anything since Ronda & Shayna are more interested in the tag team thing and Smackdown’s other girls aren’t perceived as threats either(Sonya, Xia Li, etc.)
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 19, 2023 17:24:24 GMT -5
Even if it just for a couple months it is IMO better to have Asuka lead the division as champion simply because WWE isn't likely to have her steamroll the entire division the same way they have had Bianca do.
Idk how much the draft will make things worse or better for each division but alot of women just need a damn change of sceneary.
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Post by mistery on Mar 19, 2023 17:35:54 GMT -5
Even if it just for a couple months it is IMO better to have Asuka lead the division as champion simply because WWE isn't likely to have her steamroll the entire division the same way they have had Bianca do. Idk how much the draft will make things worse or better for each division but alot of women just need a damn change of sceneary. To add onto this, it was pretty telling how negatively received Bianca was in her feud with Alexa. When you had Bianca's own home town chanting ONE MORE TIME when Alexa DDTed her on the stairs, that was telling.
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PKO
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Post by PKO on Mar 19, 2023 19:14:31 GMT -5
Where with Bianca her reactions have cooled off fairly noticeably, likely due to how stale she is, and her flaws becoming more and more glaring. You’ve made it clear you’re not fond of Bianca which, hey fair enough, and I don’t disagree with some of your grievances. But you constantly say she’s cooling off with fans which just…isn’t fact. She’s consistently one of the most popular acts and has been for a long time now. It’s incredibly impressive that fans haven’t turned against her considering how overly strong she’s been booked and how audiences tend to turn against that. There are valid criticisms of Bianca and her booking, but saying anything about negative crowd reactions isn’t one of them.
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Post by theironyuppie on Mar 19, 2023 19:49:17 GMT -5
Where with Bianca her reactions have cooled off fairly noticeably, likely due to how stale she is, and her flaws becoming more and more glaring. You’ve made it clear you’re not fond of Bianca which, hey fair enough, and I don’t disagree with some of your grievances. But you constantly say she’s cooling off with fans which just…isn’t fact. She’s consistently one of the most popular acts and has been for a long time now. It’s incredibly impressive that fans haven’t turned against her considering how overly strong she’s been booked and how audiences tend to turn against that. There are valid criticisms of Bianca and her booking, but saying anything about negative crowd reactions isn’t one of them. I agree it’s an exaggeration to say fans have turned on her, and credit to her for that, but it genuinely does feel that crowds are less enthusiastic about her than they used to be. They still like her entrance, usually like the ‘Bianca taunts on the turnbuckle and backflips her opponent’ bit, sometimes the KOD still gets a good pop, but it’s not like it used to be when they were going nuts for just about anything she did in her matches. And on the point about whether her run’s been bad for the division, I’d say in some ways it’s been damaging for herself as being locked into this flawless-babyface role hasn’t really let her grow as a performer, and it’s not easy to see the best path forward for trying to rectify that. I think in hindsight a telling moment was her post-Mania Raw promo last year where she lost the crowd despite them going molten for her beating Becky two days before. She hasn’t really had any long solo promos since. Maybe they wouldn’t have worked, but it denied her more chances to work on one of her weaknesses.
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