|
Post by Koda, Master Crunchyroller on Dec 25, 2008 2:21:17 GMT -5
Then again 300 was like 1/25 the length of Watchmen, and as such Snyder is having to do the opposite of what he did with 300(fully adapt the graphic novel and add content, he had to instead fully adapt the graphic novel and then remove content). Not only that, but Watchmen makes full use of its medium. Like with the graffiti that never finishes until the end, Rorschach's changing mask, the essays, diary, ect. Watchmen was meant to be a comic book, which is one of the reasons I think Alan Moore hates it without even seeing it. After all, he convinced Terry Gilliam not to do it. Told him it couldn't be done. Well, going to the movie format, I can bet Rorschach's diary wil instead be a narrative voice over by Rorschach, and his changing mask is perfectly fine, I mean it moves in real time, something the comic medium couldn't do for obvious reasons. Of course it won't be a 100% perfect adaptation. For one, they'd have to make a series of films ala the Lord of the Rings to get everything in the graphic novel, but from all the trailers and screenshots shown so far, it looks like the Watchmen movie will make great use of the techniques of the movie industry just like the graphic novel did with the comic industry.
|
|
|
Post by thwak is T.hawk on Dec 25, 2008 2:27:32 GMT -5
umm koda, everything I'm hearing from reports at BNAT about the watchman say it's a dead-on representation of the book.
the only problem is that it's TOO MUCH of a dead-on representation since they were shown the first 22 minutes of it and all they got to was page 13 of the book.
|
|
|
Post by Jason Todd Grisham on Dec 25, 2008 2:28:43 GMT -5
Well, going to the movie format, I can bet Rorschach's diary wil instead be a narrative voice over by Rorschach, and his changing mask is perfectly fine, I mean it moves in real time, something the comic medium couldn't do for obvious reasons. Of course it won't be a 100% perfect adaptation. For one, they'd have to make a series of films ala the Lord of the Rings to get everything in the graphic novel, but from all the trailers and screenshots shown so far, it looks like the Watchmen movie will make great use of the techniques of the movie industry just like the graphic novel did with the comic industry. I bet the changing mask in the comic was intended for a different effect than the changing mask in the movie will have. It slowly dawned on me the mask was changing, it the movie it will be far more obvious. I'm not sure if this was intended by them or not. I agree that the Watchmen movie will make great use of different techniques, and it does have a good look. But honestly, that's all I see going for it right now. I haven't seen it, so I don't want to be too critical. I'm still open to it, and I loved the trailer they attached to The Dark Knight. But if they want to remake the comic for the screen, they're going to have to do better than shot by shot. The comic wasn't made for that. If they want the comic to use film like it used comic books, it's going to require much more ingenuity. So it can't be dead on if they really want to translate the comic's soul. But if they want to make a movie that will generate a lot of buzz, make money, and look cool. They don't have to.
|
|
The Line
Patti Mayonnaise
Real Name: Bumkiss. Stanley Bumkiss.
Peanut Butter & JAAAAAMMMM!
Posts: 36,698
|
Post by The Line on Dec 25, 2008 2:30:12 GMT -5
If they change the ending of
*SPOILERS*
Manhattan vaporizing Rorschach
*END SPOILER*
then I'll be upset. Not only is it unexpected the first time you read it, it also is a pretty contraversial moment in the book. I've had discussions/debates with people from this board about the ending.
|
|
|
Post by salsashark on Dec 25, 2008 2:32:45 GMT -5
I'll give you three examples off the top of my head: 1) The Silk Spectre redesign is awful. It makes her look very sultry, very sexy, and almost too confident to remain true to the print character. Sally is "playing" superhero more than anyone else in the book, and in the movie, she movies like Angelina Jolie's character in Wanted. 2) Look at Dreiberg's pudgy belly and the way he acts more like a bad ass than just an upstanding citizen working within his means. Again, nothing like the comics. He's supposed to very intelligent but never in good shape. 3) I don't want to dare discuss potential spoilers, but I've heard rumblings about a major change to the ending. I'll grant you that some of this sounds like nitpicking (Watchmen is, after all, my favorite book of all time, bar none), but I don't believe that the movie can be "damn near perfect" with these changes to the basic characters intact. 1) Silk's outfit is an updated version of her graphic novel outfit, she still looks dead sexy, just like she did in the graphic novel. No real change, and we really haven't seen much of her "in action" in the trailers, just a few dramatic poses. 2) That's too much of a nitpick, really. 3) Yes, they changed the attack on New York City from a *spoilers way below* Giant monster attack to a nuclear explosion. Still, it carries the same effect, New York City goes bye-bye, millions die, everything else remained intact about the ending. *end spoilers* They are just slight changes. Another change that happened is Nite Owl II's fantasy of him and Silk Spectre II, in the movie, both will be clothed, instead of being buck naked. That would be like complaining about in 300 how none of the Spartans ran around with their dicks flopping around like in the graphic novel. I'll forget about the detail talk because like I said, I am deeply attached to the original book and those kinds of details were what really set it apart for me. When I first read it, it was totally different from anything that I had read before, especially in terms of how it portrayed its cast as more than muscular stock characters, and to me, the essence of breaking down those stereotypes is one of the things that makes it so powerful and original. However, moving on... In terms of the ending: The terror that comes at the end from what happens is what makes it so great. It's so snorked up and unimaginable. It's the last thing that I thought would come to life, and seeing it on-screen done right would really create a moment that could make for an incredible piece of cinema (I'm talking close in scope to Heston seeing the head of the Statue of Liberty and making a big revelation) that did not compromise. As it stands, their alternative is something that, while certainly not regular, just cannot have the power and horror of something that we've never seen before.
|
|
|
Post by Koda, Master Crunchyroller on Dec 25, 2008 2:34:35 GMT -5
umm koda, everything I'm hearing from reports at BNAT about the watchman say it's a dead-on representation of the book. the only problem is that it's TOO MUCH of a dead-on representation since they were shown the first 22 minutes of it and all they got to was page 13 of the book. ! Holy shit..... Then the movie better be f***ing long as hell...
|
|
|
Post by Jason Todd Grisham on Dec 25, 2008 2:35:47 GMT -5
= Then the movie better be snorking long as hell... I heard it was around three hours, and they were told to cut some of it. But largely the higher ups seem cool with the length.
|
|
The Line
Patti Mayonnaise
Real Name: Bumkiss. Stanley Bumkiss.
Peanut Butter & JAAAAAMMMM!
Posts: 36,698
|
Post by The Line on Dec 25, 2008 2:36:10 GMT -5
This post contains spoilers.
Exactly. It can't really be just a regular nuclear explosion. Ozy's whole point of having the monster "attack" the city is to pose a fake threat of aliens, thus releaving Cold War tensions between The US and the USSR. If its just a regular nuke, then that would only heighten the tensions, thus making Ozy's whole point(and thus, his character) pointless.
|
|
|
Post by Koda, Master Crunchyroller on Dec 25, 2008 2:38:39 GMT -5
This post contains spoilers. Exactly. It can't really be just a regular nuclear explosion. Ozy's whole point of having the monster "attack" the city is to pose a fake threat of aliens, thus releaving Cold War tensions between The US and the USSR. If its just a regular nuke, then that would only heighten the tensions, thus making Ozy's whole point(and thus, his character) pointless. *This post also has spoilers* Well maybe it isn't really a nuke, but in the most recent trailer, downtown New York City is engulfed in a rapidly expanding blue fire like energy.
|
|
|
Post by Koda, Master Crunchyroller on Dec 25, 2008 2:40:22 GMT -5
= Then the movie better be snorking long as hell... I heard it was around three hours, and they were told to cut some of it. But largely the higher ups seem cool with the length. Oh, well then 3 hours should be good. It also shouldn't have too much of an effect on the money it makes other than the obvious, fewer showings flaw. I mean the Lord of the Rings movies made hand over fist at the box office, and they are roughly 3 hours each, and also The Dark Knight is 2.5 hours and it is one of the highest grossing films ever.
|
|
|
Post by salsashark on Dec 25, 2008 2:40:33 GMT -5
Also, I want to add one more thing about my tastes (since I've become embedded in this discussion!): I am one of those sorts who does not believe that a movie adaptation has to have everything from the book (that would render many adaptations impossible), but I do believe that the filmmakers should stay as close to the book as possible. If they don't want to stick as close to the spirit of the source material as possible, go write your own movie. Changing something as integral as an extremely resonating and apt ending is one of those situations in which I would tell them to put their energy into something else.
|
|
|
Post by Koda, Master Crunchyroller on Dec 25, 2008 2:44:10 GMT -5
Also, I want to add one more thing about my tastes (since I've become embedded in this discussion!): I am one of those sorts who does not believe that a movie adaptation has to have everything from the book (that would render many adaptations impossible), but I do believe that the filmmakers should stay as close to the book as possible. If they don't want to stick close to the spirit of the source material, go write your own movie. I agree, but let's expand it from just books(this includes comics) to video games as well. I mean for f***s sakes, only Mortal Kombat 1 and Silent Hill stayed with the spirit of the games they were adapted from. Resident Evil had almost nothing to do with the games, and then Resident Evil: Apocalypse and Resident Evil: Extinction just threw the game series away and did their own thing. I mean for f***s sakes, if Paul W. Anderson wanted to make zombie films, he should've made his own series of zombie films and not named them Resident Evil. AND he managed to f*** up Alien vs. Predator, which was an adaptation of books, comics, AND video games, and he f***ed it up!
|
|
|
Post by thwak is T.hawk on Dec 25, 2008 2:44:11 GMT -5
umm koda, everything I'm hearing from reports at BNAT about the watchman say it's a dead-on representation of the book. the only problem is that it's TOO MUCH of a dead-on representation since they were shown the first 22 minutes of it and all they got to was page 13 of the book. ! Holy excretory matter..... Then the movie better be snorking long as hell... snyder's cut was around 3 hours and 30 minutes long but the studio is making him cut an hour out of it... yeah that's why people over at AICN are worried about it.
|
|
The Line
Patti Mayonnaise
Real Name: Bumkiss. Stanley Bumkiss.
Peanut Butter & JAAAAAMMMM!
Posts: 36,698
|
Post by The Line on Dec 25, 2008 2:44:52 GMT -5
This post contains spoilers. Exactly. It can't really be just a regular nuclear explosion. Ozy's whole point of having the monster "attack" the city is to pose a fake threat of aliens, thus releaving Cold War tensions between The US and the USSR. If its just a regular nuke, then that would only heighten the tensions, thus making Ozy's whole point(and thus, his character) pointless. *This post also has spoilers* Well maybe it isn't really a nuke, but in the most recent trailer, downtown New York City is engulfed in a rapidly expanding blue fire like energy. still, if it looks anything that could be a weapon(a bomb, explosion, laser, fire, etc), then the genreal public would assume it as a Russian attack. Some might find this at a minor gripe, but its potentially a major flaw in the main antagonist's key objective and convictions. Without this, the whole story falls flat. I was totally 100% behind the movie until I heard the ending was changed. I mean, an ending is important in every story, but it is EXTREMELY important in the watchmen. The whole story builds to it.
|
|
|
Post by Koda, Master Crunchyroller on Dec 25, 2008 2:45:36 GMT -5
! Holy excretory matter..... Then the movie better be snorking long as hell... snyder's cut was around 3 hours and 30 minutes long but the studio is making him cut an hour out of it... yeah that's why people over at AICN are worried about it. Well then I can't wait for the Director's Cut DVD of the movie, as they better include that extra hour Snyder had to cut.
|
|
|
Post by salsashark on Dec 25, 2008 2:48:07 GMT -5
Also, I want to add one more thing about my tastes (since I've become embedded in this discussion!): I am one of those sorts who does not believe that a movie adaptation has to have everything from the book (that would render many adaptations impossible), but I do believe that the filmmakers should stay as close to the book as possible. If they don't want to stick close to the spirit of the source material, go write your own movie. I agree, but let's expand it from just books(this includes comics) to video games as well. I mean for snorks sakes, only Mortal Kombat 1 and Silent Hill stayed with the spirit of the games they were adapted from. Resident Evil had almost nothing to do with the games, and then Resident Evil: Apocalypse and Resident Evil: Extinction just threw the game series away and did their own thing. I mean for snorks sakes, if Paul W. Anderson wanted to make zombie films, he should've made his own series of zombie films and not named them Resident Evil. AND he managed to snork up Alien vs. Predator, which was an adaptation of books, comics, AND video games, and he snorked it up! I agree. I would much rather see an original zombie flick than something that is "Resident Evil" only in name. This reminds me of my reaction to seeing The Cider House Rules after reading the book. I was blown away by how incredibly awful and hodge-podge it was. Huge chunks and character traits were eliminated to make room for some simple story. I don't remember the details now (it's been about 6 years since I have seen the work in either form), but I remember being incredibly depressed that this book I loved made it to the screen with the kind of script it had. I do think that Watchmen will probably end up very good as a flick. It just kills me to see something as integral as the ending changed. Even if the movie was a total bomb, I would be seeing it anyway.
|
|
The Line
Patti Mayonnaise
Real Name: Bumkiss. Stanley Bumkiss.
Peanut Butter & JAAAAAMMMM!
Posts: 36,698
|
Post by The Line on Dec 25, 2008 2:51:04 GMT -5
yeah, I'll still see the movie, but I'll probably be pissed about the ending.
Normally, I wouldn't get too mad. Like with "Max Payne", it was blatantly an extremely loose adaptation, so I saw the two in different lights. But the Watchmen wants to be a tight adaptation, but then decides to change an integral part of the story. I wish they'd go one way or the other, but not inbetween.
|
|
|
Post by Hulkshi Tanahashi on Dec 25, 2008 11:21:48 GMT -5
How does FOX win this!? They owned it for some time in the 1980s, didn't film it, and let it go to some other studio. I mean, they're gonna profit off of a movie they didn't film. And, this could delay the release! SON OF A BITCH!!!!
|
|
|
Post by Voldemar H. "Brak" Guerta on Dec 26, 2008 3:50:26 GMT -5
How does FOX win this!? They owned it for some time in the 1980s, didn't film it, and let it go to some other studio. I mean, they're gonna profit off of a movie they didn't film. And, this could delay the release! SON OF A BITCH!!!! This. Fanboy nitpicking aside, the real news at hand is that Fox is committing highway robbery here. They didn't spend one penny on this film (no, the legal fees for this lawsuit don't count, smart ass), and thus they don't deserve a single one.
|
|
|
Post by Topher is Human on Dec 26, 2008 4:29:41 GMT -5
*This post also has spoilers* Well maybe it isn't really a nuke, but in the most recent trailer, downtown New York City is engulfed in a rapidly expanding blue fire like energy. still, if it looks anything that could be a weapon(a bomb, explosion, laser, fire, etc), then the genreal public would assume it as a Russian attack. Some might find this at a minor gripe, but its potentially a major flaw in the main antagonist's key objective and convictions. Without this, the whole story falls flat. I was totally 100% behind the movie until I heard the ending was changed. I mean, an ending is important in every story, but it is EXTREMELY important in the watchmen. The whole story builds to it. You mean exactly like the changed ending to "I Am Legend" The PERFECT shock ending (to anyone who didn't know the book) to... well a "Oh, touching..." ending.
|
|