Albino Heat
Don Corleone
You're a nasty bastard, and your momma said so!!
Posts: 2,095
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Post by Albino Heat on Nov 15, 2009 1:04:24 GMT -5
If I had to pick one wrestler to guarantee me a great match, I'd pick Shawn Michaels.
So Ill say yes.
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Post by steamboat1 on Nov 15, 2009 1:05:41 GMT -5
All around I gotta go with Christian....every match the guy has is a *** match....+ how many guys can make Koslov look good?
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Post by superkickkid on Nov 15, 2009 1:32:30 GMT -5
I think Shawn has the potential to be the Best Wrestler in the World today.
But as long as he is content with being Triple H's sidekick or not being the main focus of a brand, he will never be.
One of the major problems I have had with Shawn since his return is that he doesn't seem to care anymore about being the very best in the company.
In the 90s, Shawn seemed to have a chip on his shoulder which pushed him to the very limits and nearly ended his career. But it also established how awesome he could really be when firing on all cylinders.
When Shawn has been forced to become the main focus of Raw, he has made everyone else look like they are second rate. I point to when Triple H got injured in early 07 at NYR and Shawn had to step it up. His work with Cena up to WM 23 and until his knee gave out was far above anyone else in the company.
His one sided feud with Hogan leading up to SummerSlam 2005 was also another shining moment of Shawn, he again showed that he can still be the best in the world in all aspects of this business in that feud.
And in the feud with Jericho in 08, he once again showed he can be up there with the best of the best. Naturally because Jericho was the heel, he was allowed to have more of a spectrum of character. But could Jericho have pulled that feud off with anyone else in that babyface role at that time? Absolutely not.
And again in his feud with Undertaker, he showed again that he can be the most entertaining and interesting wrestler on the roster. Each week it was HBK's segments that were the highlights of the show.
The problem is that Shawn doesn't have the same mindset as he had in the 90s and he doesn't push himself as hard as he once did or push for himself to be featured as the main guy in the company as he once did.
The point is that, when probably motivated, Shawn can be the best wrestler in the business at this point in time today, in and out of the ring. But most of the time he stays on the sidelines and allows other people to shine. This is noble, but in my opinion I'd rather watch a show dominated by Shawn Michaels than a show where he is a comedy sidekick to Triple H.
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Hogasm
Trap-Jaw
Gots that Thrillbilly Style
Posts: 392
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Post by Hogasm on Nov 15, 2009 1:51:35 GMT -5
Shawn can just coast for the rest of his career and he'll still be held in high regard.
Although his match w/ Ric Flair shoulda had Ric doing the moonsault to the outside. And missing completely. And Flair Flopping into a fat lady's drink. The woman will become enraged and rip off her tearaway clothing to reveal that this is no woman, but RIKISHI!
Rikishi will take Ric's place, sit on HBK's face and win clean. He will then dance his way into our hearts with the theme that took America by storm:
TURN IT UP!!! BANGINITBANGINITBANGINIT
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Post by The Deadly Snake on Nov 15, 2009 1:52:51 GMT -5
Like others said: Could be the best, but in reality, only one of the best. The problem mainly with Triple H isn't because he can't work a match. The guy can work a GREAT match, or I should say, set up a match. But his ring-work is otherwise limited. He isn't really a convincing brawler, he isn't a great technician, and he isn't flashy or good at aerial moves. Plus, because of WWE's emphasis on brawling, he can't really "wrestle", but also, because WWE's now-tendency to have less intense matches, the brawling looks really lame.
His matches tend to be solid, if unspectular, if paired with an average worker (the exception being John Cena. They have really, really, bad chemistry together).
Shawn MIchael can do what Triple H does, but also much more than that. He is flashy enough. He's good at high-flying. He's above average in chain wrestling, and he can mat wrestle (if not very well). On top of that, he's really, really good at selling. Triple H does a good job at selling (if he wants to), but he's selling is nothing like Shawn Michael's. On top of that, Shawn Michaels can get the crowd hot. Triple H has a hard time doing that. Triple H is a very, very consistent, and he has the minimum to work a match. He just doesn't add much to it.
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Post by faceinyourcrowd on Nov 15, 2009 2:57:22 GMT -5
Christian Morrison and Jericho seem like they have the most consistent work rate right now.
At least IMO
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Post by calibancalhoun on Nov 15, 2009 3:01:32 GMT -5
Like others said: Could be the best, but in reality, only one of the best. The problem mainly with Triple H isn't because he can't work a match. The guy can work a GREAT match, or I should say, set up a match. But his ring-work is otherwise limited. He isn't really a convincing brawler, he isn't a great technician, and he isn't flashy or good at aerial moves. Plus, because of WWE's emphasis on brawling, he can't really "wrestle", but also, because WWE's now-tendency to have less intense matches, the brawling looks really lame. His matches tend to be solid, if unspectular, if paired with an average worker (the exception being John Cena. They have really, really, bad chemistry together). Shawn MIchael can do what Triple H does, but also much more than that. He is flashy enough. He's good at high-flying. He's above average in chain wrestling, and he can mat wrestle (if not very well). On top of that, he's really, really good at selling. Triple H does a good job at selling (if he wants to), but he's selling is nothing like Shawn Michael's. On top of that, Shawn Michaels can get the crowd hot. Triple H has a hard time doing that. Triple H is a very, very consistent, and he has the minimum to work a match. He just doesn't add much to it. Wow thread...great analysis I pretty much have to agree especially what you said about selling. Shawn is personally my favorite wrestler for sentimental reasons (he was on top when I first started watching and he had a catchy theme). But after a while I realized I really enjoyed watching his matches more than I did Stone Cold's and the Rock's in the years to follow when they became "the guy". I think it's because of his ability to sell ANYTHING. You can put HBK in the ring with anyone and he could make them look threatening, maybe it's because of his size but I never get that "oh hurry up and win already" feeling with any shawn michaels match. I'm always slightly uneasy hoping he pulls ahead and gets the win, and when he does win I'm happy. Nobody else on the roster can do that right now. I think it was Randy Orton that said you could put shawn michaels in the ring with a broomstick and he could sell it like it was the beating of a lifetime.
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Madagascar Fred
El Dandy
TAFKA roidzilla and SUFFERIN' SUCCOTASH SON!
Posts: 8,784
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Post by Madagascar Fred on Nov 15, 2009 3:15:32 GMT -5
Jericho, JoMo and Christian are better right now...but thats because they can wrestle every week, unlike Shawn
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Cranjis McBasketball
Crow T. Robot
Knew what the hell that thing was supposed to be
Peace Love and Nothing But
Posts: 42,373
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Post by Cranjis McBasketball on Nov 15, 2009 4:54:45 GMT -5
If matched up properly, he's one of the few guys I'd still buy a PPV to see wrestle. The other is Jericho.
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Mozenrath
FANatic
Foppery and Whim
Speedy Speed Boy
Posts: 121,950
Member is Online
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Post by Mozenrath on Nov 15, 2009 5:20:22 GMT -5
I think Shawn has the potential to be the Best Wrestler in the World today. But as long as he is content with being Triple H's sidekick or not being the main focus of a brand, he will never be. One of the major problems I have had with Shawn since his return is that he doesn't seem to care anymore about being the very best in the company. In the 90s, Shawn seemed to have a chip on his shoulder which pushed him to the very limits and nearly ended his career. But it also established how awesome he could really be when firing on all cylinders. When Shawn has been forced to become the main focus of Raw, he has made everyone else look like they are second rate. I point to when Triple H got injured in early 07 at NYR and Shawn had to step it up. His work with Cena up to WM 23 and until his knee gave out was far above anyone else in the company. His one sided feud with Hogan leading up to SummerSlam 2005 was also another shining moment of Shawn, he again showed that he can still be the best in the world in all aspects of this business in that feud. And in the feud with Jericho in 08, he once again showed he can be up there with the best of the best. Naturally because Jericho was the heel, he was allowed to have more of a spectrum of character. But could Jericho have pulled that feud off with anyone else in that babyface role at that time? Absolutely not. And again in his feud with Undertaker, he showed again that he can be the most entertaining and interesting wrestler on the roster. Each week it was HBK's segments that were the highlights of the show. The problem is that Shawn doesn't have the same mindset as he had in the 90s and he doesn't push himself as hard as he once did or push for himself to be featured as the main guy in the company as he once did. The point is that, when probably motivated, Shawn can be the best wrestler in the business at this point in time today, in and out of the ring. But most of the time he stays on the sidelines and allows other people to shine. This is noble, but in my opinion I'd rather watch a show dominated by Shawn Michaels than a show where he is a comedy sidekick to Triple H. You do raise good points, but I don't think mindset is the only problem. Shawn isn't the man he use to be. It's a cold, hard truth that his knees and his back are in terrible shape compared to his youth. Triple H gets more focus than him because Shawn likely wants to help a friend, but more realistically, it's to keep Shawn on the show where otherwise he couldn't really be in the main event. He probably isn't capable right now of doing with the likes of Orton what he did with Cena only a year or two ago. Triple H isn't likely holding him back, he's more plausibly(at least to me) giving Shawn someone to lean on.
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Post by backslide on Nov 15, 2009 6:14:39 GMT -5
I don't disagree with most of what said, personally I really hopw HBK wins the tripple threat
but Christian, just does not do it for me, albe it he does not get much to work with his match with Bill regal was decent, but of course he won so that turned me right off
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Post by Pagan Warrior on Nov 15, 2009 6:25:47 GMT -5
The best wrestler in WWE, and the world today is Chris Jericho. Sorry Shawn, but that torch was past in 2008. You can't have it back.
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Post by hbk4ever09 on Nov 15, 2009 10:20:48 GMT -5
I think Shawn is contempt proving that at 43 or 44 he can still be better than anyone in the company when he feels like it. If he did it everytime at his age, he'd be done in months. Remember how he was conserving himself int he weeks before his match with Taker? it was worth it.
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Post by varzens on Nov 15, 2009 14:17:21 GMT -5
Y2J is overrated
Shawn Michaels still has what it takes but I just can't like the way he works in a tag team match.
Orton may not be that technical, but I believe he's the best when it comes to storytelling and facial expressions, but that's just my opinion
So, the prize goes to Orton, or THE Miz, just because he's awesome
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Post by Bishblast on Nov 15, 2009 15:24:48 GMT -5
All things considered, I'd say so.
He's not consistently putting on the best matches or the best promos... those honors would go to Punk, Jericho, Morrison and on occasion Cena, Orton, and Edge.
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Post by TheDarkestKnight on Nov 15, 2009 15:33:13 GMT -5
Nope, that accolade goes to Christian who week in and week out puts on consistently great matches.
HBK however is fantastic when it matters most, and I really do enjoy watching his matches. However he doesn't wrestle every week so thats why I give the title to Christian.
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Post by thedavefather on Nov 15, 2009 16:28:29 GMT -5
YES yes he is...i mean there are other greats to but nobody delivers as much as often as HBK does!
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Toates Madhackrviper
King Koopa
Is owed an Admin life-debt.
This avatar is so far out of date I might as well stick with it forever now.
Posts: 10,736
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Post by Toates Madhackrviper on Nov 15, 2009 16:34:51 GMT -5
Noone's mentioned Kofi yet?
I think Jericho is the best all around performer in the WWE right now, followed by Kofi. They may be the only two wrestlers who can keep me enthralled by an entire match, rather than drifting off like I do sometimes.
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4real
Wade Wilson
Posts: 28,673
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Post by 4real on Nov 15, 2009 16:35:23 GMT -5
When Chris Jericho says he's the best in the world today.....I believe him.
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Post by mauled on Nov 15, 2009 16:38:16 GMT -5
I love people's different takes on this for my money Y2J and Christian (And Edge when he is not injured) are the best at the moment. And before that for me it Kurt Angle (Argubly the best of this Generation) before he left for TNA who was the best wrestler in the WWE. And Edge certainly had that title after Angle left and was the top heel. And if you watch his match with Taker at 24 and HBK's at 25 you cant deny they are slightly similar in all the pin attempts.
Which isnt to say HBK is not quality but I would not say he is the best ever. When he was the best for that it would have to be 1996/97 where he peaked (Argubly at Hell in a Cell where turned essentialy a glorified cage match with a roof into its own event) and surpassed Bret (His only real rival at the time and previous best wrestler 92-95) as the "top man" in the ring.
As for Triple H dont rate him at all any skill (upper midcard at best in JMO) he had he lost when he broke his first quad in 01 and since then has to be carried by others in the match.
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