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Post by Diamond Dallas Dom on Dec 28, 2009 14:48:29 GMT -5
Jeff Hardy and Goldberg were one-dimensional on the mic, but they always had the Spark to excite crowds Jeff Hardy had the "spark" and Christian doesn't? The only reason Hardy had any indication of "spark" was because he was willing to jump off 30 ft ladders into tables. Plus Jeff only seemed to have "spark" because he was forced down our throats in a "PG" era. Christian is ten times more charismatic, and a much better wrestler. And he's also willing to do some of that crazy stuff as well. Jeff Hardy is/was just a product of the WWE PG machine, and Christian appeals to an older audience.
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Post by cabbageboy on Dec 28, 2009 15:40:08 GMT -5
Christian is doing okay but is mostly in a placeholder champ position. It isn't his fault that he's on a nothing show. There is literally no one who could make anyone care about ECW at this point. Put him on a real show, give him a serious push to a viable belt, and let's see how he does.
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Post by Lionheart on Dec 28, 2009 15:46:00 GMT -5
Can we please have a moratorium on the use of the figure of speech "forced down our throats" for every single pushed wrestler somebody doesn't like?
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Post by xxshoyuweeniexx on Dec 28, 2009 16:07:20 GMT -5
Jeff Hardy and Goldberg were one-dimensional on the mic, but they always had the Spark to excite crowds Jeff Hardy had the "spark" and Christian doesn't? The only reason Hardy had any indication of "spark" was because he was willing to jump off 30 ft ladders into tables. Plus Jeff only seemed to have "spark" because he was forced down our throats in a "PG" era. Christian is ten times more charismatic, and a much better wrestler. And he's also willing to do some of that crazy stuff as well. Jeff Hardy is/was just a product of the WWE PG machine, and Christian appeals to an older audience. Yeah, I guess that match with Taker where the crowd went nuts and those giant pops are all just because WWE shoved him down the fans throat. If they didn't want him there, he'd have very audible boos when he comes out like Cena, not insane pops. Hardy may have his demons, but he is STILL more over than anyone has been in years. He's the anti-Cena in WWE's eyes, a non company man who connects with the crowd to get the right reaction while selling merchandise like a fiend. There's a big difference between not liking a guy and giving him his props, and not liking the guy and ignoring all the work he's done.
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AriadosMan
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Posts: 15,620
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Post by AriadosMan on Dec 28, 2009 16:16:04 GMT -5
Yeah, I guess that match with Taker where the crowd went nuts and those giant pops are all just because WWE shoved him down the fans throat. If they didn't want him there, he'd have very audible boos when he comes out like Cena, not insane pops. Hardy may have his demons, but he is STILL more over than anyone has been in years. He's the anti-Cena in WWE's eyes, a non company man who connects with the crowd to get the right reaction while selling merchandise like a fiend. There's a big difference between not liking a guy and giving him his props, and not liking the guy and ignoring all the work he's done. Let me put it this way. Jeff, like Rey and Goldberg, was a guy who never really said anything interesting in and of itself, but had a sort of weird ability to make fans connect with them when they were there. If you just listen to a Jeff promo in terms of actual dialogue, then yeah, it kinda sucks. But in terms of actually getting a crowd reaction, Jeff had some sort of natural ability to make even a corny line seem like a big deal to the audience. He wasn't "forced down the audience's throat"--he spent alot more time in midcard than Rock or Cena ever did. If anything, he's as much of a natural choice of the fanbase as Austin was in his time. If Christian was a "natural choice" in the same matter Jeff was, ECW ratings would be alot higher. This is not an insult to Christian or any of his abilities in the ring or on the mic-its just saying that he isn't really a big draw, and his reign should have ended by now or been used to give a younger talent a shot (there was a time when I really wanted to see Yoshi win the belt off him, for example).
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Post by xxshoyuweeniexx on Dec 28, 2009 16:27:51 GMT -5
Yeah, I guess that match with Taker where the crowd went nuts and those giant pops are all just because WWE shoved him down the fans throat. If they didn't want him there, he'd have very audible boos when he comes out like Cena, not insane pops. Hardy may have his demons, but he is STILL more over than anyone has been in years. He's the anti-Cena in WWE's eyes, a non company man who connects with the crowd to get the right reaction while selling merchandise like a fiend. There's a big difference between not liking a guy and giving him his props, and not liking the guy and ignoring all the work he's done. Let me put it this way. Jeff, like Rey and Goldberg, was a guy who never really said anything interesting in and of itself, but had a sort of weird ability to make fans connect with them when they were there. If you just listen to a Jeff promo in terms of actual dialogue, then yeah, it kinda sucks. But in terms of actually getting a crowd reaction, Jeff had some sort of natural ability to make even a corny line seem like a big deal to the audience. He wasn't "forced down the audience's throat"--he spent alot more time in midcard than Rock or Cena ever did. If anything, he's as much of a natural choice of the fanbase as Austin was in his time. If Christian was a "natural choice" in the same matter Jeff was, ECW ratings would be alot higher. This is not an insult to Christian or any of his abilities in the ring or on the mic-its just saying that he isn't really a big draw, and his reign should have ended by now or been used to give a younger talent a shot (there was a time when I really wanted to see Yoshi win the belt off him, for example). Yeah...I guess I should have worded it better. FTW, I think Christian would make a good experimental transition champion like Punk in his first run. Punk didn't really do a lot but beat JBL and Snitsky, and with Christian's record he could do some damage in the upper mid-card/main event if they gave him the ball. I don't think he can carry a company, since TNA is an entirely different ballgame and was even less so when Christian was there, but him being like Jericho in the roll of upper-mid carder and semi-main eventer doesn't seem so far'fetched to me.
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AriadosMan
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Your friendly neighborhood superhero
Posts: 15,620
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Post by AriadosMan on Dec 28, 2009 16:37:40 GMT -5
Yeah...I guess I should have worded it better. FTW, I think Christian would make a good experimental transition champion like Punk in his first run. Punk didn't really do a lot but beat JBL and Snitsky, and with Christian's record he could do some damage in the upper mid-card/main event if they gave him the ball. I don't think he can carry a company, since TNA is an entirely different ballgame and was even less so when Christian was there, but him being like Jericho in the roll of upper-mid carder and semi-main eventer doesn't seem so far'fetched to me. That's very reasonable. Even Jericho, as great as he is, was primarily used as either a transitional champion face or a heel who gets other people over (including the guest hosts). It just seems that the ECW championship had 2 (conflicting) purposes: 1. Worn by a "big star" of a viable 3rd brand (RVD, Big Show) 2. Midcard belt to elevate new talent (Lashley, Punk) Christian isn't really "new" and won't be elevated any further than his current position as long as he has the belt anyway. And he isn't a big enough name like RVD and Show were to make casuals actually take notice of the show just by being there. BTW,I didn't have a problem with your phrasing-just with the guy who claimed Jeff was "forced down people's throats". I remember the "Jeff can't draw" stuff persisting here forever even after he had proven that he was a draw. And if Christian does become a huge star, I will be the first to admit I was wrong in believing that he could not be a big mainstream draw. But that won't happen in his current slot, as many people posting on this thread have argued.
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Post by Diamond Dallas Dom on Dec 28, 2009 18:01:50 GMT -5
Jeff Hardy had the "spark" and Christian doesn't? The only reason Hardy had any indication of "spark" was because he was willing to jump off 30 ft ladders into tables. Plus Jeff only seemed to have "spark" because he was forced down our throats in a "PG" era. Christian is ten times more charismatic, and a much better wrestler. And he's also willing to do some of that crazy stuff as well. Jeff Hardy is/was just a product of the WWE PG machine, and Christian appeals to an older audience. Yeah, I guess that match with Taker where the crowd went nuts and those giant pops are all just because WWE shoved him down the fans throat. If they didn't want him there, he'd have very audible boos when he comes out like Cena, not insane pops. Hardy may have his demons, but he is STILL more over than anyone has been in years. He's the anti-Cena in WWE's eyes, a non company man who connects with the crowd to get the right reaction while selling merchandise like a fiend. There's a big difference between not liking a guy and giving him his props, and not liking the guy and ignoring all the work he's done. I'm sorry but I can't look at Jeff Hardy as somebody as a top tier kind of guy like an Austin, Rock, or Goldberg because they were at a high point in the industry, and let's face it, right now, the business has been in a dull period (hopefully that will turn around with things that are developing as of late), and Jeff Hardy was somebody that was put in the forefront because of that. And I like Jeff, I think he's very entertaining, but not main event level.
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Bub (BLM)
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Post by Bub (BLM) on Dec 28, 2009 18:06:59 GMT -5
How "good" does someone need to be in order to be the champion of Velocity 2.0? Christian defends the title regularly and often has the best match of the week on TV. Sounds good to me.
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Post by Diamond Dallas Dom on Dec 28, 2009 18:20:35 GMT -5
He does awesome for ECW. He's actually overqualified to be ECW champion. Christian I think has proved his worth and deserves to be a top tier guy on RAW or Smackdown.
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