Post by Hammer Smashed Ball on Aug 16, 2010 3:15:02 GMT -5
I was recently watching an old episode of Shotgun Saturday Night and had the honor ( : to view a match between Diesel and Marc Mero. It‘s kind of late, so it took me a second to realize that the Diesel in the ring was not Nash at all, but instead our dearest friend Kane. Later in the show the Rock would be taking on Razor Ramon, who, as we all know, was a very cheap fake. I was very surprised to hear how confidently Vince played off their identities. It was as if they were the same people that had always played those roles. I think this is what threw me off in the beginning. I didn‘t start watching wrestling until 98, so when people refereed to Fake Diesel and Fake Razor, I thought that was how they were ultimately presented, as impostors, not as the actual people.
So my question is, what was the reason for this? Was Vince on an ego trip and wanted to prove that he owned the characters that made Nash and Hall stars, or do you think he honestly thought no one would notice the difference, or if the fans did notice the difference, they wouldn‘t care?
I was very surprised to hear how confidently Vince played off their identities.
The thing that really surprised me was at another Show where the Fake Ramon had a Match and Gorilla Monsoon and JR basically fought about that character. Monsoon said that this wasn't Ramon (and even mentioned the name Scott Hall more than once), while JR basically said that Ramon was a character, played by an actor. I thought it was unbelievable how they, at that moment threw kayfabe out of the window and talked about the business.
It was an Ego-trip because it was clear from the beginning, that these are just imposters brought in by JR who then was on a Heel trip
Post by The Dark Order Inferno on Aug 16, 2010 8:09:03 GMT -5
It was Vince flexing his muscles and going on a bit of an ego trip, a way of saying 'I made Diesel and Razor, Hall and Nash would be nothing without me'. The WWE can be extraordinarily petty when it comes to former workers and their gimmicks, it's no better than the billionaire Ted skits with the Huckster, or the way they won't let people wrestle indies using their WWE name to make money (or names that were created in ECW or WCW) after they've been released.
I can't help but be amused by the fact that Rick Bognar/Fake Razor went on to become a part of nWo Japan. I wonder if he ever shared any screentime with Hall over there.
Kane has always had a mushy face, so there was no real fooling the public on Diesel. I have a hard time imagining what Vince was thinking with the heel JR and fake Diesel and Ramon. I guess he was stinging from two major investments jumping ship.
What's interesting to hear is the ways JR pitched it. In "Diesel"'s match against Aldo Montoya, JR is pitching that they are great athletes and that's what the fans want instead of wrestling clowns and plumbers. That was the campaign WCW had against WWF. I guess Vince maybe wanted to see if it was true, and if it was he would still have the payoff on the investment of Ramon and Diesel? I dunno.
Post by Trent Valentine on Aug 16, 2010 14:34:43 GMT -5
I remember them hyping Razor Ramon and Diesel returning, then Monsoon said that Scott Hall and Kevin Nash were under contract to "another company" The night it happened, I waited..and then they ended up throwing us off with JR shooting on Vince and the rest of the WWF Brass...THEN he brought out Razor. I then looked and said...thats not Razor. It was obvious this was a shot at WCW, bringing in two knockoffs of the original superstars. The fans didn't accept the "New" Razor Ramon and Diesel and they were sent back to USWA..though Diesel would later return as Kane.