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Post by ScottishProWrestling on Dec 30, 2010 11:28:58 GMT -5
Instead of trying to pick a team from the premier league, if an american loves football/soccer, why they don't better support the mls? As someone who did support MLS this season, it's because the rest of the world treats MLS like a joke (as the best players don't really want to play there). The best players in the world aren't ever going to come to MLS unless they're hanging on way past their prime (and therefore, just aren't that good anymore), the money isn't there in MLS when compared to the Euro, South American, and Asian leagues. That, and I'm not saying ALL of them are this way, but a number of American Euro-league fans are Euro-league fans as a way of trying to look more "cultured" than your typical American NFL, NBA, or MLB fan. I think if there was a way to get better players and coaches in the MLS, and if some of our best athletes actually wanted to be professional soccer players (and stay in the US to play, instead of going over to Europe (again, where the money is)) instead of (American) Football, Baseball, or Basketball players, you'd see MLS's profile rise. This is what should happen, I actually keep an eye on the NY Red Bulls and before that I kept an eye on the Metro Stars, I wouldnt call myself a fan though . Though i lived the early years of my life over in NY. I feel the MLS and US Soccer has alot of potential, there are alot of very good young lads coming through the system in the USA, though as shown in the case of Freddy Adu, the media need to back off and let them develop before you go making him a star, too much pressure will lead to players cracking, which is the reason I think Adu has not even scraped the level that the media hyped him at, despite a mass of natural talent. The wage cap makes sense to stop teams going bust, but is holding the league back from bringing the best players in. Let teams go wild, if you offer a top player competitive contract and sponsorship and the chance to live in work in the likes of New York, LA, Chicago, Seattle, Washington etc. I guarantee you that that lifestyle would appeal more than the like of Bolton, Manchester, Newcastle, Birmingham, etc, in the UK. MLS also limits the amount of overseas players. Crazy move. I understand the need to develop talent from the USA but if the college and youth team systems are doing their job properly then the talent will come through anyway and make the grade alongside the pros from around the world. Plus, the overseas talent gives the young local talents someone to aspire too in their own teams. I am a huge fan of American football and i really feel it can make the grade, its growing every year. With one or two adjustments the league could really work and people would watch.
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Post by FrankGotch on Dec 30, 2010 11:31:39 GMT -5
In America a lot of people have been born into a football team that was passed down from grandfather to father to son. The difference? Our football teams play in the NFL. You see over here in America most people could care less about your style of football, but we are very passionate about ours. I'm a third generation Cleveland Browns fan for example. In fact being a Browns fan actually lead me to becoming an Astin Villa supporter after Browns own Randy Learner bought the team.
In any case you should be happy that anyone from America has any interest at all in European football since it would take a monumental effort to for the average Americans follow any team on a more than casual basis.
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Post by BK From WV on Dec 30, 2010 11:32:03 GMT -5
But I do scratch my head at American "sports-team-choosing" more and more and more. It's like the songs on the radio listener: "Whoever gets exposure is who I'll like." (Not saying everyone here is like that; I'm just saying that a lot of American fans seem to be that way.) I hate that people can't see it from the other perspective when they're trying to talk sports with you, and they ask, "So who do you like?" You tell them and they laugh and giggle as if to say, "For God's sake, why?!" And then you realize who their team is, and the only thing they expected as a response was one of the three-five teams who EVER get talked about on television, as if they are the only teams around. Honestly, the worst thing is when your team goes from one of the "God, why would you ever watch them?" teams to one of the overexposed teams almost overnight. You go from being "A loser who likes to root for losers" to "A bandwagon fan who only discovered the team yesterday". Only for people that subscribe to the ESPN "Everybody Loves Boston!!! EVERYBODY. NO EXCEPTIONS." Ethos. Well,that's not true at all. I don't like any Boston sports teams but I love reading Bill Simmons' articles. Heck,one of my best friends despises everything Boston but he owns all of Simmons' books. Simmons is about the only thing I read on ESPN. Anyway,back on point,when I was younger I just kind of picked the teams I wanted to support and have stuck with them. It had nothing to do with family or location because all my favorite teams are in the midwest. And it sure wasn't because they were winning. It wasn't until this last year that one of my favorite teams(the Chicago Blackhawks) finally won a title. My favorite NBA,MLB,and NFL team haven't ever won one. My NFL team(Detroit Lions) hasn't even been in a Super Bowl.
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Post by FrankGotch on Dec 30, 2010 11:47:27 GMT -5
This is what should happen, I actually keep an eye on the NY Red Bulls and before that I kept an eye on the Metro Stars, I wouldnt call myself a fan though . Though i lived the early years of my life over in NY. I feel the MLS and US Soccer has alot of potential, there are alot of very good young lads coming through the system in the USA, though as shown in the case of Freddy Adu, the media need to back off and let them develop before you go making him a star, too much pressure will lead to players cracking, which is the reason I think Adu has not even scraped the level that the media hyped him at, despite a mass of natural talent. The wage cap makes sense to stop teams going bust, but is holding the league back from bringing the best players in. Let teams go wild, if you offer a top player competitive contract and sponsorship and the chance to live in work in the likes of New York, LA, Chicago, Seattle, Washington etc. I guarantee you that that lifestyle would appeal more than the like of Bolton, Manchester, Newcastle, Birmingham, etc, in the UK. MLS also limits the amount of overseas players. Crazy move. I understand the need to develop talent from the USA but if the college and youth team systems are doing their job properly then the talent will come through anyway and make the grade alongside the pros from around the world. Plus, the overseas talent gives the young local talents someone to aspire too in their own teams. I am a huge fan of American football and i really feel it can make the grade, its growing every year. With one or two adjustments the league could really work and people would watch. The MLS will never be higher than a fifth tier league no matter what the quality of play is. Most Americans simply aren't interested in soccer if its not the world cup or our kid isn't playing. Much like the Olympics the only reason most get excited about the World Cup is because its and event. Take that away and give the average US viewer a regular season game between N.Y. and Columbus and it wouldn't matter who was playing on either side, because most people would not watch. There are a variety of factors as to why that is but I'm going to skip most of them and get to the big one. Most American sports fans already have three to four teams they are die hard fans of usually NFL, College, MLB, NBA, and NHL. In essence we already have so many established teams and sports that it would be very hard for any other team oriented sport to displace on of the older leagues, because people are already dividing their passion time and money between the well established teams that they grew up with.
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Post by ScottishProWrestling on Dec 30, 2010 11:51:30 GMT -5
This is what should happen, I actually keep an eye on the NY Red Bulls and before that I kept an eye on the Metro Stars, I wouldnt call myself a fan though . Though i lived the early years of my life over in NY. I feel the MLS and US Soccer has alot of potential, there are alot of very good young lads coming through the system in the USA, though as shown in the case of Freddy Adu, the media need to back off and let them develop before you go making him a star, too much pressure will lead to players cracking, which is the reason I think Adu has not even scraped the level that the media hyped him at, despite a mass of natural talent. The wage cap makes sense to stop teams going bust, but is holding the league back from bringing the best players in. Let teams go wild, if you offer a top player competitive contract and sponsorship and the chance to live in work in the likes of New York, LA, Chicago, Seattle, Washington etc. I guarantee you that that lifestyle would appeal more than the like of Bolton, Manchester, Newcastle, Birmingham, etc, in the UK. MLS also limits the amount of overseas players. Crazy move. I understand the need to develop talent from the USA but if the college and youth team systems are doing their job properly then the talent will come through anyway and make the grade alongside the pros from around the world. Plus, the overseas talent gives the young local talents someone to aspire too in their own teams. I am a huge fan of American football and i really feel it can make the grade, its growing every year. With one or two adjustments the league could really work and people would watch. The MLS will never be higher than a fifth tier league no matter what the quality of play is. Most Americans simply aren't interested in soccer if its not the world cup or our kid isn't playing. Much like the Olympics the only reason most get excited about the World Cup is because its and event. Take that away and give the average US viewer a regular season game between N.Y. and Columbus and it wouldn't matter who was playing on either side, because most people would not watch. There are a variety of factors as to why that is but I'm going to skip most of them and get to the big one. Most American sports fans already have three to four teams they are die hard fans of usually NFL, College, MLB, NBA, and NHL. In essence we already have so many established teams and sports that it would be very hard for any other team oriented sport to displace on of the older leagues, because people are already dividing their passion time and money between the well established teams that they grew up with. Would be nice to have a team you could support that could actually compete worldwide instead of within only the USA? Thats my biggest gripe with US sports, its all just self-serving. Get out and play the world!
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Post by Red Impact on Dec 30, 2010 11:53:58 GMT -5
The MLS will never be higher than a fifth tier league no matter what the quality of play is. Most Americans simply aren't interested in soccer if its not the world cup or our kid isn't playing. Much like the Olympics the only reason most get excited about the World Cup is because its and event. Take that away and give the average US viewer a regular season game between N.Y. and Columbus and it wouldn't matter who was playing on either side, because most people would not watch. There are a variety of factors as to why that is but I'm going to skip most of them and get to the big one. Most American sports fans already have three to four teams they are die hard fans of usually NFL, College, MLB, NBA, and NHL. In essence we already have so many established teams and sports that it would be very hard for any other team oriented sport to displace on of the older leagues, because people are already dividing their passion time and money between the well established teams that they grew up with. Would be nice to have a team you could support that could actually compete worldwide instead of within only the USA? Thats my biggest gripe with US sports, its all just self-serving. Get out and play the world! That's what the Olympics are for. We have more than enough people to play each other for time in between, and most American fans are perfectly content saving our flag waving for then.
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Post by FrankGotch on Dec 30, 2010 11:59:24 GMT -5
The MLS will never be higher than a fifth tier league no matter what the quality of play is. Most Americans simply aren't interested in soccer if its not the world cup or our kid isn't playing. Much like the Olympics the only reason most get excited about the World Cup is because its and event. Take that away and give the average US viewer a regular season game between N.Y. and Columbus and it wouldn't matter who was playing on either side, because most people would not watch. There are a variety of factors as to why that is but I'm going to skip most of them and get to the big one. Most American sports fans already have three to four teams they are die hard fans of usually NFL, College, MLB, NBA, and NHL. In essence we already have so many established teams and sports that it would be very hard for any other team oriented sport to displace on of the older leagues, because people are already dividing their passion time and money between the well established teams that they grew up with. Would be nice to have a team you could support that could actually compete worldwide instead of within only the USA? Thats my biggest gripe with US sports, its all just self-serving. Get out and play the world! Last I time I checked we did. The US has more Olympic golds then any other country. We also usually dominate international basketball tourneys to the point where its a big story if we don't win the whole thing. We have the world baseball classic, and the US always does very well in international ice hockey. In fact the only sport that we don't ever play other countries in is football and that is mainly because no other country on earth could build a team that could compete with a collection of NFL all stars, or even college all stars.
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Post by Biggtone23 on Dec 30, 2010 12:05:17 GMT -5
Go out and play the world? So all those Russians and Canadians in the NHL, Cubans, Dominicans, Japanese and Venezuelans in MLB, French, Spanish and Argentinian NBA guys dont count? Why wake up at 6am to watch a soccer match to get international flavor when I can watch a game in prime time with players from all over the world playing in my own backyard?
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Post by ScottishProWrestling on Dec 30, 2010 12:13:02 GMT -5
They are all in one league, that's not going to compete with the world, that the world coming to compete with you! Though they are all minority sport in a worldwide sense. Get out and compete in International competitions. The Olympics doesn't count, i mean, for "Soccer" they have an under 23 age rule!
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Post by Red Impact on Dec 30, 2010 12:18:54 GMT -5
So in other words "Go out and compete in our sport but only our sport."
The US has the third largest population in the world, we have plenty of people to compete with on an annual basis. The reason we don't have a world-class soccer league is that all our really great athletes go into other sports, which we had leagues built up for before the MLS came along.
We get a pretty hefty amount of competition year round without needing to try to build up yet another league. It's really exactly what Frank Gotch said.
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Post by hossfan on Dec 30, 2010 12:19:16 GMT -5
They are all in one league, that's not going to compete with the world, that the world coming to compete with you! Though they are all minority sport in a worldwide sense. Get out and compete in International competitions. The Olympics doesn't count, i mean, for "Soccer" they have an under 23 age rule! Why should we want to when the best competition for the sports we care about is here in the US?
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Post by Allie Kitsune on Dec 30, 2010 12:24:18 GMT -5
They are all in one league, that's not going to compete with the world, that the world coming to compete with you! Though they are all minority sport in a worldwide sense. Get out and compete in International competitions. The Olympics doesn't count, i mean, for "Soccer" they have an under 23 age rule! It's easier to do things like UEFA because most European countries are packed closer together there (and most are smaller in land size than the US or Canada), and while there IS a CONCACAF champions league, it gets zero coverage and I don't know if anybody other than diehard fans of a year's given MLS Champion even knows it exists. You really can't have MLS teams making regular visits to British, Spanish, Italian, etc... leagues and being in the same league as them, much like you can't have NHL teams going and having KHL and Elitserien teams in their league standings, as the logistics just aren't realistic enough.
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Post by Mattification on Dec 30, 2010 12:25:52 GMT -5
Yay , another 'Americans could care less about soccer' thread.
Anyway, as has been pointed in this thread, I am infact very grateful to any American who takes an interest in 'our sport' as it has such a big impact on my life. Seriously, why is there such animosity about what sports someone else enjoys?
*Not totally directed at the American posters
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Post by SamTastic thinks CM Punk sucks on Dec 30, 2010 12:36:18 GMT -5
Although I do like football, I prefer the NBA to be quite honest and I enjoy the fact that the NBA are starting to do a few regular season games over here!
But I don't expect the NBA to be on the sports headlines on BBC News 24. But that doesn't matter to me, I enjoy the NBA and Basketball in a whole to really care if it gets really popular over here.
I would like the British Basketball League to get bigger though.
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Post by FrankGotch on Dec 30, 2010 12:43:49 GMT -5
They are all in one league, that's not going to compete with the world, that the world coming to compete with you! Though they are all minority sport in a worldwide sense. Get out and compete in International competitions. The Olympics doesn't count, i mean, for "Soccer" they have an under 23 age rule! 1. Basketball, baseball, and hockey are hardly minority sports world wide. 2. There is a reason why other players around the world come to us. Its because the US, and Canada is where the elite players come to play in football, baseball, basketball, hockey. Because our leagues are made up of the best of the best. Same reason why the best American soccer stars usually go to Europe. 3. As I pointed out earlier besides soccer and cricket the US is already pretty much at the top or near the top in most international sports, and in soccer we aren't that bad and we only seem to be getting better. 4. Do you really want us to dominate soccer as well? That is a serious question, because if the US had an interest in soccer we would. The US has no problem turning out world class athletes by the barrel full. The thing is that virtually all of those guys end up in the NFL NBA NHL or MLB, because those are the sports that we all shoot for from a young age. If the US does develop a viable major soccer league then watch out world because as it is now we are fielding throw away athletes on our world cup team and they are still good enough to be in the lower tier of the best teams in the world.
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Post by Square on Dec 30, 2010 13:21:34 GMT -5
If you want to support a team, do the hat choice. All teams in the top 4 leagues in a hat pick one out and support them to death!
Thats how I'm stuck with Kansas City Royals as my baseball team
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Post by ScottishProWrestling on Dec 30, 2010 13:28:38 GMT -5
They are all in one league, that's not going to compete with the world, that the world coming to compete with you! Though they are all minority sport in a worldwide sense. Get out and compete in International competitions. The Olympics doesn't count, i mean, for "Soccer" they have an under 23 age rule! It's easier to do things like UEFA because most European countries are packed closer together there (and most are smaller in land size than the US or Canada), and while there IS a CONCACAF champions league, it gets zero coverage and I don't know if anybody other than diehard fans of a year's given MLS Champion even knows it exists. You really can't have MLS teams making regular visits to British, Spanish, Italian, etc... leagues and being in the same league as them, much like you can't have NHL teams going and having KHL and Elitserien teams in their league standings, as the logistics just aren't realistic enough. Russia begs to differ! Its not about size and the World Club Cup is an ever growing competition. I can't understand why Americans watch and play sports that the rest of the world laughs at while World sports are rejected in the US... weird.!
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Post by N E O G E O B O Y S on Dec 30, 2010 13:30:49 GMT -5
They are all in one league, that's not going to compete with the world, that the world coming to compete with you! Though they are all minority sport in a worldwide sense. Get out and compete in International competitions. The Olympics doesn't count, i mean, for "Soccer" they have an under 23 age rule! 1. Basketball, baseball, and hockey are hardly minority sports world wide. 2. There is a reason why other players around the world come to us. Its because the US, and Canada is where the elite players come to play in football, baseball, basketball, hockey. Because our leagues are made up of the best of the best. Same reason why the best American soccer stars usually go to Europe. 3. As I pointed out earlier besides soccer and cricket the US is already pretty much at the top or near the top in most international sports, and in soccer we aren't that bad and we only seem to be getting better. 4. Do you really want us to dominate soccer as well? That is a serious question, because if the US had an interest in soccer we would. The US has no problem turning out world class athletes by the barrel full. The thing is that virtually all of those guys end up in the NFL NBA NHL or MLB, because those are the sports that we all shoot for from a young age. If the US does develop a viable major soccer league then watch out world because as it is now we are fielding throw away athletes on our world cup team and they are still good enough to be in the lower tier of the best teams in the world. I will give you basketball, but hockey and baseball aren't sports that the entire world plays, the only countries that play hckey (ice hockey) are USA, Canada, Russia, and some others countries that i forget, with baseball you had USA, Cuba, Venezuela, Japan and some caribeans countries, I always saw the canadian league as a member of the MLB, but put those two sports on europe or south america and people will not give a crap In the rest of the points you are right, but the problem is that outside US, everybody saw the sports that you pointed as ''northamerican sports'' with some of them having an stronger presence compared with others in different countries, but in Africa, South America and Europe (and maybe Asia) Soccer is the main sport, so people outside the world will always saw northamericans as the guys who ''try to play the sports that they only play and created'' Now that last sentence I couldn't care less, I had the idea that everybody must be fan of whatever shit they want, but northamericans should also stop to think that they are at the top of the world with the 3 sports that vastly they only play (sure, there are other countries, but like you said, there is no competition, at least with soccer you don't only had the european leagues, brazil and Argentina had well respected leagues, who from time to time get the win over europe) Olyimpcs are an event that I don't think that should be put on the map, considering the vast majority of sports than there are, and tons of other factors) Now, if the USA wanted to grow up as a soccer league, they should stop hanging out with the CONCAF and move to the CONMEBOL to play La Libertadores, did wonders to Mexico
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Post by hossfan on Dec 30, 2010 13:34:40 GMT -5
It's easier to do things like UEFA because most European countries are packed closer together there (and most are smaller in land size than the US or Canada), and while there IS a CONCACAF champions league, it gets zero coverage and I don't know if anybody other than diehard fans of a year's given MLS Champion even knows it exists. You really can't have MLS teams making regular visits to British, Spanish, Italian, etc... leagues and being in the same league as them, much like you can't have NHL teams going and having KHL and Elitserien teams in their league standings, as the logistics just aren't realistic enough. Russia begs to differ! Its not about size and the World Club Cup is an ever growing competition. I can't understand why Americans watch and play sports that the rest of the world laughs at while World sports are rejected in the US... weird.! Not to turn this into a pissing contest or anything, but its because (generally) America doesn't care what the rest of the world thinks about anything, least of all sports.
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Post by Red Impact on Dec 30, 2010 13:36:30 GMT -5
It's easier to do things like UEFA because most European countries are packed closer together there (and most are smaller in land size than the US or Canada), and while there IS a CONCACAF champions league, it gets zero coverage and I don't know if anybody other than diehard fans of a year's given MLS Champion even knows it exists. You really can't have MLS teams making regular visits to British, Spanish, Italian, etc... leagues and being in the same league as them, much like you can't have NHL teams going and having KHL and Elitserien teams in their league standings, as the logistics just aren't realistic enough. Russia begs to differ! Its not about size and the World Club Cup is an ever growing competition. I can't understand why Americans watch and play sports that the rest of the world laughs at while World sports are rejected in the US... weird.! Because we had major leagues in those sports before we did in soccer. We subsequently got attached to those teams and games. It's not that hard to understand, our traditions built up different sports, so that's why we follow them instead of suddenly abandoning them all the second someone said "but football is the most popular sport in the world!!!!" That's why baseball is more popular in Japan than soccer. The professional baseball leagues have more tradition and had more time to get a foothold. And I seriously don't get why it's something so many people feel the need to gripe about. Europe beats us in the most popular sport in the world, shouldn't that be something that fans of the sport would, I don't know, celebrate instead of pissing on about us not taking it that seriously?
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