The Metal Gear Solid Thread!

[rogers67]

i came here to post this.

[wcw]

Jan 3, 2011 21:20:10 GMT -5 Threadkiller [Classic] said:

No game in the history of gaming has ever tied up a series so immaculately as MGS4.

In fact, when researching on the Metal Gear Wiki (I love reading about the series and all of its rich plot and history), no series in the history of gaming is as internally consistent as MGS.

Is it perfect? Well, no. Some birth dates are inconsistent, as are some plot details as it relates to the connection between the Playstation and NES entries. But no series has done as good a job tying it all together, having every detail check out, and having every story thread and plot element appear to be planned out to the very last scene (even though Kojima has gone on record saying that he didn't even plan on making MGS4 until Snake Eater made fans crave a conclusion to the story after the Philosophers were introduced).

Just amazing. I can go back to each entry of the series, even the NES games, and find something I can appreciate even more given all the facts I learned in later games. It's all just so rich.

Oh there are many retcons in MGS. Its a far from perfect story. Kojima didn't have a 4 game plot when he did MGS1. Kojima had some general direction he wanted to take a sequel to MGS1 but in MGS2 he changed directions (Also the fact that Meryl wasn't mentioned at all in MGS2) somewhat.

In MGS3 it was pretty much all retcons as there was no planned backstory to the series. In MGS4 he changed directions yet again (Meryl coming back out of nowhere things like that). Also the fact that the NES games didn't really fit in with the story.

Kojima himself has stated the shift from game to game that pretty much he changed his mind about what he was doing story wise from MGS1 to MGS4. Its a lot of reconnecting to make sure all the facts add up.

I love Metal Gear Solid and its nice that Kojima has attention to detail but MGS story is a little convoluted. I love the story but the series needs a reboot badly. MGS4 was such an epic ending to the series I don't think that there is really any good way to follow up MGS4.

[Threadkiller [Classic]]

Jan 3, 2011 21:41:53 GMT -5 Matt Rogers said:

This is weird timing, because I just started MGS4 again, the day before yesterday. After just beating Laughing Octopus, I noticed something that's kind of a minor detail, but it's something that just makes Solid Snake all the more great. In fact, one of my favourite things about MGS4 is how it took great characters, but relatively two dimensional ones, and turned them into real people (Meryl and Snake are probably the best examples of this; their body language and eye movements are so perfect in both of their meetings in Act 1 and 3. Snake's distant, Meryl's a bitch. It's perfect.)

Anyway, the bosses in MGS4 got a lot of criticism from some fans but I think they really work. The BB Corps are so unbelievably excessive, and Vamp is so fantastically sinister (I honestly think part of the reason he came back was just so he could be properly captured on the PS3), and Ocelot is so badass. The problem is, they're dealing with Solid Snake. Despite all their technology and insanity, despite their nanomachines and the way he's repeatedly brutalised, Solid Snake is completely unstoppable. Drebin says it best when he says he thinks Snake might be war itself.

Snake's just such a perfect character in MGS4. He's not his father in MGS3, he's the same driven killer he always was. He kills anyone he needs to, he doesn't show the BB Corps any sympathy, he uses whatever he has to hand (such as REX) and he crawls through Hell to complete his mission. He's so determined to complete a mission that won't benefit him in any way, and it's never really clear if it's personal to him. He becomes a hero at the end, but only really by way of doing the job he was hired to do and nothing was ever going to stop him.

Basically, I'm rambling. Also, Snake rules.

And the greatest thing about all of it is the fact that SNAKE is the inferior clone of Big Boss.

Solidus was the perfect genetic clone of Big Boss, receiving both his dominant and recessive genes, while Liquid received all of Big Boss's dominant genes (with the intention that the perfect soldier would be created). Meanwhile, Solid Snake was given all of the recessive genes, creating an inferior soldier.

Ultimately, of the three Snakes, Solid Snake was the inferior, but wound up being the greatest of all - arguably becoming the greatest soldier that ever lived (kayfabe).

[wcw]

Jan 4, 2011 0:18:15 GMT -5 Threadkiller [Classic] said:

Jan 3, 2011 21:41:53 GMT -5 Matt Rogers said:

This is weird timing, because I just started MGS4 again, the day before yesterday. After just beating Laughing Octopus, I noticed something that's kind of a minor detail, but it's something that just makes Solid Snake all the more great. In fact, one of my favourite things about MGS4 is how it took great characters, but relatively two dimensional ones, and turned them into real people (Meryl and Snake are probably the best examples of this; their body language and eye movements are so perfect in both of their meetings in Act 1 and 3. Snake's distant, Meryl's a bitch. It's perfect.)

Anyway, the bosses in MGS4 got a lot of criticism from some fans but I think they really work. The BB Corps are so unbelievably excessive, and Vamp is so fantastically sinister (I honestly think part of the reason he came back was just so he could be properly captured on the PS3), and Ocelot is so badass. The problem is, they're dealing with Solid Snake. Despite all their technology and insanity, despite their nanomachines and the way he's repeatedly brutalised, Solid Snake is completely unstoppable. Drebin says it best when he says he thinks Snake might be war itself.

Snake's just such a perfect character in MGS4. He's not his father in MGS3, he's the same driven killer he always was. He kills anyone he needs to, he doesn't show the BB Corps any sympathy, he uses whatever he has to hand (such as REX) and he crawls through Hell to complete his mission. He's so determined to complete a mission that won't benefit him in any way, and it's never really clear if it's personal to him. He becomes a hero at the end, but only really by way of doing the job he was hired to do and nothing was ever going to stop him.

Basically, I'm rambling. Also, Snake rules.

And the greatest thing about all of it is the fact that SNAKE is the inferior clone of Big Boss.

Solidus was the perfect genetic clone of Big Boss, receiving both his dominant and recessive genes, while Liquid received all of Big Boss's dominant genes (with the intention that the perfect soldier would be created). Meanwhile, Solid Snake was given all of the recessive genes, creating an inferior soldier.

Ultimately, of the three Snakes, Solid Snake was the inferior, but wound up being the greatest of all - arguably becoming the greatest soldier that ever lived (kayfabe).

I actually never got the scientific sense of why dominant genes were better then recessive ones. Some recessive genes are better scientifically then dominant ones. Like Green Eyes (Which lend to a 33% less chance of cataracts) are recessive and are better then brown eyes (Because of the cataracts thing). Recessive isn't always better.

But the whole thing with Snake is really cool because it showed that while Liquid and Solidus were on paper better it was Snakes heart that made him the better solider. Also the fact that in Metal Gear for NES Snake was a rookie sent into Outer Heaven and he completed the mission despite being designed for him to fail.

[the5thhorseman]

Jan 3, 2011 23:16:54 GMT -5 rogers67 said:

i came here to post this.

[Red Lion]

Fun fact: SIGINT and the DARPA chief are one and the same

Also, fun question

SPOILER: Click to show

{Spoiler}Young Snake is voiced by David Hayter, Old Snake is voiced by David Hayter, young Big Boss is voiced by David Hayter...so logically he should also voice Old Big Boss! Why the hell doesn't he?

[Fundertaker]

SPOILER: Click to show

{Spoiler}Wasn't Old Big Boss "reconstructed" from Solidus's body? Solidus definetevely wasn't voiced by DAVID HAYTER~! so that's quite an explanation there. But then there's Ocelot getting like 4 voices and it alljust goes down the drain

[Ginger Beer Man]

My favourite series of games ever, just brilliant. Totally captivating.

[Drink Up Me Cider]

Metal Gear Solid 2 killed all my enthusiasm for the series.

[AFN: Judge Shred]

I have probably beaten Snake Eater more times than any other game. I cannot wait for it on 3DS, it will be my third freaking version of the game, and I don't care.

I will say, I freaking loved the fixed camera and hated Subsistence changing it. I loved being able to pan it then lock it in place, but to add the free camera, they got rid of the camera lock option.

Guns was an emotional roller coaster, and my only problem with it was that the game engine was so damned good, that we needed more. Even just random time attack levels or something. The shooting and stealth is just so satisfying that there needed to be more. I still wish they would add trophies as well, just because they could make some super fun ones.

Peacewalker is also a great game, but man, I want it on a dualshock.

[riseofsetian1981]

I remember how pissed I used to get whenever I would get so tired of trying to find The End that I would intentionally let him sneak up on me.

Although MGS1 is one of the greatest games and storylines ever in my opinion. I rank it up there with FF7 in terms of storylines, character development, and emotional moments. I know I wasn't the only one that got a lump in his throat when

SPOILER: Click to show

{Spoiler}if you submit to the torture, Meryl dies.

Fighting The Boss at the end of Snake Eater could be a pain too.

[Wolfaga]

Jan 4, 2011 21:01:05 GMT -5 Drink Up Me Cider said:

Metal Gear Solid 2 killed all my enthusiasm for the series.

You could of said the same about Devil May Cry but look how it ended up.

No matter how much people slagged off MGS2, I loved it, I must of played the demo with Snake on the ship thousands of times, the aftermath was fun as well.

The main draw I enjoy is the amount of speedruns people do on European Extreme as well, absolutely epic.

[BRAINFADE]

Jan 5, 2011 3:46:01 GMT -5 Wolfaga said:

Jan 4, 2011 21:01:05 GMT -5 Drink Up Me Cider said:

Metal Gear Solid 2 killed all my enthusiasm for the series.

You could of said the same about Devil May Cry but look how it ended up.

No matter how much people slagged off MGS2, I loved it, I must of played the demo with Snake on the ship thousands of times, the aftermath was fun as well.

The main draw I enjoy is the amount of speedruns people do on European Extreme as well, absolutely epic.

I also don't get the critism of MGS2. It's probably my favourite game of the series- although that might be because it was the first one i played, so it has the nostalgia factor for me.

[agent817]

I just thought about this and remembered how much I liked to use the dirty magazine as trap to lure enemies onto a claymore mine. Talk about a BOOBY trap, huh?

[wcw]

Jan 5, 2011 11:45:09 GMT -5 BRAINFADE said:

Jan 5, 2011 3:46:01 GMT -5 Wolfaga said:

You could of said the same about Devil May Cry but look how it ended up.

No matter how much people slagged off MGS2, I loved it, I must of played the demo with Snake on the ship thousands of times, the aftermath was fun as well.

The main draw I enjoy is the amount of speedruns people do on European Extreme as well, absolutely epic.

I also don't get the critism of MGS2. It's probably my favourite game of the series- although that might be because it was the first one i played, so it has the nostalgia factor for me.

For starters the fact that for a huge portion of the game you didn't get to play as Snake. Raiden was kind of a lame character in MGS2. Snake was a bad ass who fit the motif of war and espionage and well Raiden just seemed out of place very underwhelming.

The story was a little up its own ass with messages and while I loved the game it was a weaker installment of the series. MGS1 was such a perfect game and while MGS2 was a great game it never could fulfill peoples expectations as a follow up.

The only 2 major complaints I had about Metal Gear Solid 2 was 1- I hated Raiden the guy seemed like such a pansy for a member of Foxhound. 2- There were a few codec conversations towards the end that were way too long (15+ minute conversations in short order is just too much). The rest of the game was just pure awesomeness.

[riseofsetian1981]

I wonder if Hideo is still interested in having MGS developed into an actual film?