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Post by eJm on Jan 2, 2011 0:13:52 GMT -5
Bake, Gotch, both of you cool it down.
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The Line
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Post by The Line on Jan 2, 2011 0:22:27 GMT -5
I will say, the UConn women's team is a lot sexier than the UCLA team was. BILL WALTON IS A GOLDEN GOD!
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Post by i.Sarita.com on Jan 2, 2011 0:25:35 GMT -5
I will say, the UConn women's team is a lot sexier than the UCLA team was. BILL WALTON IS A GOLDEN GOD! His short shorts were pretty hot. I'll give him that.
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Post by FrankGotch on Jan 2, 2011 0:31:18 GMT -5
OK I'm skeptical, but I'll be more then happy to hear the reasoning behind your position. I gave you the reason why I believe the way I do, and I offered solid evidence and mensurable stats to back up my argument. Now I must request that you do the same, because at this point unless you can at least give me some reason for your statement I'll be inclined to believe that you are trolling. Trolling? No. I'm just not going to bother arguing with a group of people who won't really listen to my opinion anyway because regardless of what I say men of course are better then women in sports because it's a proven fact that they are. I'll let you have your opinion & I'll keep mine but I'll be damned if anyone tells me I'm not allowed to have an opinion on the subject. As I pointed out earlier Athletics are clearly defined. Athletics: Activities, such as sports, exercises, and games, that require physical skill and stamina. People who are able to participate in serious competitive athletics at the highest levels ex. the Olympics, pro sports are widely acknowledged as the best athletes in the world. One of the great things about competitive athletics is that almost all of them have records and accomplishments that record the very best mark ever by an individual in that event. Comparison Track and field records. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_world_records_in_athleticsThe mens records trump the womens in every category. Weight Lifting en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Olympic_records_in_weightliftingOnce again same result Swimming en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Olympic_records_in_swimmingThe mens records are better again. Not to mention the fact that a woman has never been able to break through and seriously compete on a men professional team as anything but a novelty.Anyway I could literally spend a week throwing numbers out at you to prove my point, but why bother. Like I said before this subject isn't something you can have a personal opinion about because there is solid evidence that definitively proves men are better at athletics. Like the example the poster above used, you can't say Mercury is bigger than Saturn, and that its your opinion so we just have to accept it, because in that case there is solid evidence that you are wrong. Athletics deal in mensurables, stats, and facts opinion's don't matter not yours not mine, and the facts are what they are.
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Post by FrankGotch on Jan 2, 2011 0:32:45 GMT -5
Bake, Gotch, both of you cool it down. Didn't see this before me last post. Anyway I suppose I'm done if you're afraid this is gong to get ugly.
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Post by Bake Or Die on Jan 2, 2011 1:26:48 GMT -5
Trolling? No. I'm just not going to bother arguing with a group of people who won't really listen to my opinion anyway because regardless of what I say men of course are better then women in sports because it's a proven fact that they are. I'll let you have your opinion & I'll keep mine but I'll be damned if anyone tells me I'm not allowed to have an opinion on the subject. As I pointed out earlier Athletics are clearly defined. Athletics: Activities, such as sports, exercises, and games, that require physical skill and stamina. People who are able to participate in serious competitive athletics at the highest levels ex. the Olympics, pro sports are widely acknowledged as the best athletes in the world. One of the great things about competitive athletics is that almost all of them have records and accomplishments that record the very best mark ever by an individual in that event. Comparison Track and field records. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_world_records_in_athleticsThe mens records trump the womens in every category. Weight Lifting en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Olympic_records_in_weightliftingOnce again same result Swimming en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Olympic_records_in_swimmingThe mens records are better again. Not to mention the fact that a woman has never been able to break through and seriously compete on a men professional team as anything but a novelty.Anyway I could literally spend a week throwing numbers out at you to prove my point, but why bother. Like I said before this subject isn't something you can have a personal opinion about because there is solid evidence that definitively proves men are better at athletics. Like the example the poster above used, you can't say Mercury is bigger than Saturn, and that its your opinion so we just have to accept it, because in that case there is solid evidence that you are wrong. Athletics deal in mensurables, stats, and facts opinion's don't matter not yours not mine, and the facts are what they are. I will end it at this but if men simply have better genetics for sports then women then how did Billie Jean King ever beat Bobby Riggs?
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The Line
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Post by The Line on Jan 2, 2011 1:34:56 GMT -5
As I pointed out earlier Athletics are clearly defined. Athletics: Activities, such as sports, exercises, and games, that require physical skill and stamina. People who are able to participate in serious competitive athletics at the highest levels ex. the Olympics, pro sports are widely acknowledged as the best athletes in the world. One of the great things about competitive athletics is that almost all of them have records and accomplishments that record the very best mark ever by an individual in that event. Comparison Track and field records. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_world_records_in_athleticsThe mens records trump the womens in every category. Weight Lifting en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Olympic_records_in_weightliftingOnce again same result Swimming en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Olympic_records_in_swimmingThe mens records are better again. Not to mention the fact that a woman has never been able to break through and seriously compete on a men professional team as anything but a novelty.Anyway I could literally spend a week throwing numbers out at you to prove my point, but why bother. Like I said before this subject isn't something you can have a personal opinion about because there is solid evidence that definitively proves men are better at athletics. Like the example the poster above used, you can't say Mercury is bigger than Saturn, and that its your opinion so we just have to accept it, because in that case there is solid evidence that you are wrong. Athletics deal in mensurables, stats, and facts opinion's don't matter not yours not mine, and the facts are what they are. I will end it at this but if men simply have better genetics for sports then women then how did Billie Jean King ever beat Bobby Riggs? Sorry to but in, but poor example. Billie Jean King was 29 during that game. Riggs was 55. His prime was during the 1940's.
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Post by Bake Or Die on Jan 2, 2011 1:40:57 GMT -5
I will end it at this but if men simply have better genetics for sports then women then how did Billie Jean King ever beat Bobby Riggs? Sorry to but in, but poor example. Billie Jean King was 29 during that game. Riggs was 55. His prime was during the 1940's. Yes but if we're to use Gotch's point Riggs is a man so he should have beaten her no matter what.
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The Line
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Post by The Line on Jan 2, 2011 1:42:35 GMT -5
Sorry to but in, but poor example. Billie Jean King was 29 during that game. Riggs was 55. His prime was during the 1940's. Yes but if we're to use Gotch's point Riggs is a man so he should have beaten her no matter what. I didn't anywhere read him say that any man can beat every woman, but rather more that the best men could beat the best women, in their respective physical sports.
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Post by Bake Or Die on Jan 2, 2011 1:47:22 GMT -5
Yes but if we're to use Gotch's point Riggs is a man so he should have beaten her no matter what. I didn't anywhere read him say that any man can beat every woman, but rather more that the best men could beat the best women, in their respective physical sports. Maybe but what I've been talking about in this thread didn't only refer to Gotch. If you look over a few posts quite a few people have said that any average men's team could beat the best women's team. And I strongly disagree with that.
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Post by FrankGotch on Jan 2, 2011 3:19:03 GMT -5
I didn't anywhere read him say that any man can beat every woman, but rather more that the best men could beat the best women, in their respective physical sports. Maybe but what I've been talking about in this thread didn't only refer to Gotch. If you look over a few posts quite a few people have said that any average men's team could beat the best women's team. And I strongly disagree with that. I know I said I was done but I think the mods won't mind if we can keep this low key and totally civil. Now I think its fine that you strongly disagree however you have yet to provide any evidence to back up your claims. So far you have offered nothing other than your opinion, and a tennis match that was more a show than an actual competition between the number one ranked woman in the world, and a retired out of shape Bobby Riggs. Funny thing though is that nobody remembers that old man Riggs actually destroyed Margaret Court who at the time of their match was 30 years old, and the top ranked female player in the world. Then of course you have Martina Navatilova who played a match against retired Jimmy Conors and lost badly even though she was given a set up on a best of three match. Finally there is Karsten Braasch who competed in a 'Battle of the Sexes' contest against Venus Williams and Serena Williams at the 1998 Australian Open when he was ranked 203. A decade and a half older than the sisters, Braasch "was a man whose training regime centred around a pack of cigarettes and more than a couple bottles of ice cold lager." He nonetheless handily defeated the sisters in an individual set, 6–1 on Serena, 6–2 on Venus, while rubbing it in by smoking cigarettes during the changeover. Tennis aside though I'm honestly curious why you seem to hold your belief that women are better athletes then men even though virtually every piece of evidence says that men have the edge athletically.
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Post by FrankGotch on Jan 2, 2011 4:19:05 GMT -5
So are you confirming in that your opinion any man at any level of experience could beat a fully trained woman at her peak in any sport? As far as my evidence/opinion goes I tend to go long when it comes to debating with whomever I am debating with.Providing reasons why I feel the way I do on the subject and providing evidence if there is any.Provided that the person or people I'm debating with are open to hearing my side of things & have a open mind about what I have to say. This is not directed at you directly but from what I've read in this thread that's not the case.Except for a minor few who agree with me on liking/supporting women sports & thinking that the UConn streak is impressive this thread is filled with people who regardless of what I say will still keep their it's women sports so it doesn't mean anything attitude. I never ever implied anywhere in this thread that man at any level of experience could beat a fully trained woman at her peak in any sport. To make such a statement would be silly. What I did do was provide evidence to contradict your claims that women are better athletes than men. How did I do that? I did it by posting the world records of prime athletes of both sexes. And without fail across the board the mens record was always more impressive than the womens record. As for debating. I don't mind long winded post look at the ones I've made in this thread. Also read back through my previous post and you will see time and again that I have been more than eager to hear your side, but so far you haven't even attempted to offer anything tangible to back up your claim. As I said when we started. I could understand if when you said "I personally think women make better athletes then men." You really just meant that you enjoy watching womens athletics more than mens. However you came back and made it clear that you honestly believed that women were better athletes, at which point I pulled out the record books, and some other solid evidence that say otherwise. For the record I have no problem with womens athletics, and I think what the Uconn women did was great. However given the nature of basketball and the skills involved I don't find it at all unreasonable to assume that a high school boys team would beat the lady Huskies. Does that diminish their accomplishments? Hell no. No more than Usain Bolt's 100 meter record destroys the legacy of Flo Jo.
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biafra
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Post by biafra on Jan 2, 2011 6:42:40 GMT -5
I guess it depends on what makes a person a better athlete; raw genetic physical attributes of the skill in which they use them.
I don't have the answer or know that there is a universal one but if we did accept the concept that what a person does with their genetic athletic gifts in the sense of how skillful they are at their chosen sport is more important than simple physical prowess in determining athleticism then it is "possible" to say women could perhaps be better athletes. Not saying it would be true even then but at least there would be room for argument.
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