BHB
Hank Scorpio
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Post by BHB on Dec 18, 2011 7:31:20 GMT -5
The Joker, no. But the lowly guy the Joker was before he became the Joker could be driven to that level of desperation. That's how most of his origins place him in the chemical plant in the first place after all. Seems as if that might undermine part of Batman's origin. It wasn't one of his enemies or a maniac doing that deed, it was simple, random crime that could have happened to anyone. A sudden twist of fate that could effect anyone from the lowest to highest. Having it be a foe just seems as if it would be a fate thing and not the random twist of fate that shows that the crime took away everything from Bruce. Exactly. Batman's mission is to stop what happened to him from happening to anyone else. Joe Chill was a product of the corruption, poverty and increasing criminality in Gotham, he was the example of what was wrong in Gotham - using him as a symbol makes Batman's mission much broader and grander in scale. If it were the Joker who killed Bruce's parents, he would become Batman simply to stop the Joker and once he'd done that, why be Batman anymore?
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Post by walsh7637 on Dec 18, 2011 8:41:09 GMT -5
I remember seeing Batman on my birthday.
In November.
It lasted that long in regular theatres.
Nowadays, you're lucky if a movie's out a month.
Always loved this movie. I notice little things now and then, but I always view it fondly and with more enjoyment than criticisms.
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Jiren
Patti Mayonnaise
Hearts Bayformers
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Post by Jiren on Dec 18, 2011 10:00:02 GMT -5
It's flawed but I still find it the best Batman movie.
I also love "Returns" but obviously i'm in the minority on that one
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Post by Bob Schlapowitz on Dec 18, 2011 10:19:32 GMT -5
If you had asked 12 year old Schlapowitz in 1989 I would have told you that this is the best movie ever made and nothing will ever top it! I was totally caught up in Bat-Mania during that summer. I used my paper route money to go watch it at the recently torn down local cinema at least 10 times.
I recently bought the Blu-Ray set of the Burton/Schumacher movies, and I'm sad to say that, in my opinion, it hasn't really stood the test of time very well. The atmosphere of the film is still unmatched, and the designs of Gotham City are still amazing, but some of the special effects are horrid by modern standards. Another issue I have with it is that there's really not very much of a story.....more like a series of loosely connected events.
But, I have, and will always have, a tremendous soft spot for Batman '89.
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The Ichi
Patti Mayonnaise
AGGRESSIVE Executive Janitor of the Third Floor Manager's Bathroom
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Post by The Ichi on Dec 18, 2011 10:21:34 GMT -5
If anything, it taught me never to rub another man's rhubarb.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Dec 18, 2011 10:39:03 GMT -5
Also who could forget this commercial. I remember it was on the VHS I was pissed when I recently bought the blu ray and this wasn't an extra.
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Burst
El Dandy
*inarticulate squawking*
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Post by Burst on Dec 18, 2011 11:04:11 GMT -5
My only gripe about the Joker being the one to kill Bruce's parents is that I always imagined Batman and the Joker being around the same age, and having Joker be the one to kill 'em really messes that up.
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Post by Cyno on Dec 18, 2011 11:18:35 GMT -5
I think giving the Joker a definitive origin hurts the character. Which is why I love that the comics and The Dark Knight have kept it intentionally ambiguous. Even the origin story given by The Killing Joke could be complete BS. I also HATE the idea of the Joker being the one to kill the Waynes for the reasons stated above. Joe Chill was a very powerful symbol of the corruption and crime of Gotham City and what ultimately made Batman.
The Joker is a being of pure chaos, and I wouldn't have it any other way.
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The Ichi
Patti Mayonnaise
AGGRESSIVE Executive Janitor of the Third Floor Manager's Bathroom
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Post by The Ichi on Dec 18, 2011 12:15:44 GMT -5
My only gripe about the Joker being the one to kill Bruce's parents is that I always imagined Batman and the Joker being around the same age, and having Joker be the one to kill 'em really messes that up. Yeah, the idea of Joker being old enough to be Bruce's Dad is pretty weird.
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Post by Michael Coello on Dec 18, 2011 12:26:29 GMT -5
My only gripe about the Joker being the one to kill Bruce's parents is that I always imagined Batman and the Joker being around the same age, and having Joker be the one to kill 'em really messes that up. Yeah, the idea of Joker being old enough to be Bruce's Dad is pretty weird. I never took them as being that apart in age. i always figured that Bruce was like 9 or 8 when his parents died, and Jack himself was around army age, about 17-18. So, I always thought it was Bruce entering his playboy life, Jack was at the end of it.
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dav
Hank Scorpio
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Post by dav on Dec 18, 2011 13:37:22 GMT -5
Yeah, the idea of Joker being old enough to be Bruce's Dad is pretty weird. I never took them as being that apart in age. i always figured that Bruce was like 9 or 8 when his parents died, and Jack himself was around army age, about 17-18. So, I always thought it was Bruce entering his playboy life, Jack was at the end of it. He looked in his mid-20's during the flashback at least. Age difference was quite noticeable throughout even then. Wasn't Jack in his 50's when the movie was made?
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Lupin the Third
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Post by Lupin the Third on Dec 18, 2011 13:53:07 GMT -5
If anything, it taught me never to rub another man's rhubarb. Let me ask you something, my friend. You ever danced with the Devil in the pale moonlight?
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Post by Michael Coello on Dec 18, 2011 13:55:22 GMT -5
I never took them as being that apart in age. i always figured that Bruce was like 9 or 8 when his parents died, and Jack himself was around army age, about 17-18. So, I always thought it was Bruce entering his playboy life, Jack was at the end of it. He looked in his mid-20's during the flashback at least. Age difference was quite noticeable throughout even then. Wasn't Jack in his 50's when the movie was made? I thought he was teen since they were talking about him getting in trouble wiht the law since his teens, and it could be seen as the start of his crimes. Anyway, I never thought Batman and Joker well all that different in age, and never really noticed it overall.
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Post by Hassan bin Sober on Dec 18, 2011 14:35:29 GMT -5
The idea that Heath Ledger's Joker is more comic accurate is the biggest piece of revisionism in history. Somebody sat down and said, "What would somebody like the Joker be like if he existed in real life instead of being a comic book character?" and that's what we got. Don't get me wrong, he was great and all but the idea that the Joker doesn't laugh, make jokes or use gags/weapons in nonsense.
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Post by Michael Coello on Dec 18, 2011 14:37:38 GMT -5
The idea that Heath Ledger's Joker is more comic accurate is the biggest piece of revisionism in history. Somebody sat down and said, "What would somebody like the Joker be like if he existed in real life instead of being a comic book character?" and that's what we got. Don't get me wrong, he was great and all but the idea that the Joker doesn't laugh, make jokes or use gags/weapons in nonsense. That is why 1966 Batman movie is the greatest movie ever, cause Cesar Romero IS the Joker.
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Lupin the Third
Patti Mayonnaise
I'm sorry.....I love you. *boot to the head*--3rd most culpable in the jixing of NXT, D'oh!
Join the Dark Order....
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Post by Lupin the Third on Dec 18, 2011 14:48:50 GMT -5
Also, Kim Bassinger was HAWT as Vicki Vale.
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The Ichi
Patti Mayonnaise
AGGRESSIVE Executive Janitor of the Third Floor Manager's Bathroom
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Post by The Ichi on Dec 18, 2011 15:06:21 GMT -5
Also, Kim Bassinger was HAWT as Vicki Vale. It's the late 80s. Kim Bassinger was hot, period.
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Post by Clash, Never a Meter Maid on Dec 18, 2011 15:21:46 GMT -5
I'd call it the fourth best Batman movie- behind Dark Night, Mask of the Phantasm and Returns.
Nicholson's Joker was closer to the comic, and he did a good job, but as far as the live action Jokers I just prefered Ledger's. The 1989 Joker was an entertaining villain, but the 2008 Joker worked legit heel heat from me and I actually wanted to see him die. He was that creepy.
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dav
Hank Scorpio
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Post by dav on Dec 18, 2011 15:45:07 GMT -5
He looked in his mid-20's during the flashback at least. Age difference was quite noticeable throughout even then. Wasn't Jack in his 50's when the movie was made? I thought he was teen since they were talking about him getting in trouble wiht the law since his teens, and it could be seen as the start of his crimes. Anyway, I never thought Batman and Joker well all that different in age, and never really noticed it overall. Never noticed the age difference between Michael Keaton and Jack Nicholson. Also, they can't really have put that down as the start of his crimes since he was never caught for it in the first place. The actor himself was pretty clearly in his twenties regardless. He laughed quite a lot throughout the movie. Particuarly impressive was at the end when he was doing so after having been thrown off a building.
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Magician under the moonlight
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
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Post by Magician under the moonlight on Dec 18, 2011 15:57:35 GMT -5
Partyman! Partyman!
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