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Post by Stu on Jul 23, 2012 19:41:50 GMT -5
The contrast between Mike and Walt is very interesting. Mike actually is doing this for his family. While Walt is using his family has an excuse. I have no doubt, that in the beginning, Walt's only intention was providing for his family. But now it's about something much more sinister, for him. Revenge against his college buddies who upstarted a multi million dollar company with his formula? Did we ever find out why or how Walt went from brilliant scientist for a major company to high school teacher?
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Post by Deleted on Jul 23, 2012 19:49:18 GMT -5
Revenge against his college buddies who upstarted a multi million dollar company with his formula? Did we ever find out why or how Walt went from brilliant scientist for a major company to high school teacher? Nope. Plus didn't he date or they implied he was dating that guys wife at one point? I think the whole idea is looking back, Walt wasn't exactly innocent from the start. He just mellowed down. And his marriage with Skylar wasn't always a happy one from the start. Even before he decided to be a meth cook.
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Massive G
Hank Scorpio
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Post by Massive G on Jul 23, 2012 20:24:44 GMT -5
So does anyone else have the urge to buy some french dressing and ranch dressing and mix them together for some delicious Franch? I gave the idea far too much thought last night. Would it even taste good? What ratio of french to ranch? I would, however, like to try some cajun kick-ass sauce.
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The Line
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Post by The Line on Jul 23, 2012 20:35:24 GMT -5
Did we ever find out why or how Walt went from brilliant scientist for a major company to high school teacher? Nope. Plus didn't he date or they implied he was dating that guys wife at one point? I think the whole idea is looking back, Walt wasn't exactly innocent from the start. He just mellowed down. And his marriage with Skylar wasn't always a happy one from the start. Even before he decided to be a meth cook. Yeah, Walt and Gretchen totally were a thing. Remember in the episode where Gretchen drops in at the White residence and Walt takes her to dinner to beg of her not to tell Skylar about Gretchen and Elliot not paying for Walters treatment, at the restaurant, Gretchen made a comment about how Walter just up and left, and while I can't remember the exact way it was phrased, she made it clear that Walter left both her and their research behind suddenly, and it seemed that him leaving her was the more painful of the two (especially when you take into account the success of Grey Matter w/o Walt). It will be interesting to see if this plot point is ever re-addressed again. I assume the way that Elliot and Walt's professional relationship's end has had a major influence on how Walt treats Jesse(and how he treated Gale), and I also think that in at least some way, Walt "settled" for Skylar, and that has caused some resentment between the two of them on some level. I picture something along the lines of Walt, having had his ego hurt by his fallout with Elliot and Gretchen, may have even thought of Skylar as somewhat of a "slump-buster"* who Walt got involved with only to repair his bruised ego. However, with Skylar getting pregnant, Walter now not only had an obligation to Skylar, he had to find more regular, consistent employment to provide for his he and his pregnant wife. We all know from watching the show that Walt looks like a real pain in the ass to work with/for, and depending on the breakup between him and The Schwartz's went, he may have found it difficult to find work in a lab, especially if he had no research to put his name on(as Walt made it clear multiple times, Gray Matter took the credit for Walt and Gretchen's research). However, someone with his credentials, as Elliot points out at his birthday party, is more than qualified to teach high school science(hell, for a while at my school, the chem teacher was a doctor of Chemistry, some people just like teaching younger students). If my theory is anywhere close to what actually happened, I can see how Walt (in his twisted, self-serving, ego-driven sense of logic) could hold a grudge against Elliot and Gretchen and blame them for much of his shortcomings. Had they not gone their separate ways, Walt would have most likely never married Skylar, may have never had a child with CP(not that Walt, Jr. isn't a great kid, but obviously this added a lot of [extra] stress the Walt/Skylar union), would actually have a healthy friendship with somebody(Elliot) and on top of that would have more than enough money to pay for any cancer treatments needed. Of course, that's using Walt's logic, where none of his actions seem to involve free will, yet everyone else acts only in ways to deliberately screw Walter White. *a term used by Major League Baseball player Mark Grace(and probably countless others, he's just the one most closely associated with the phrase). It essentially is a woman, one who may not be so....physically attractive to put it nicely, that a struggling baseball player will have sex with, which, according to Grace's superstition, would get the player thinking straight again. Obviously, Skylar deviates from this somewhat, as she was/is an attractive woman who Walt has/had a an actual emotional connection with(ex: The "Crossword story" before Skylar & Walt first tell Hank and Marie about Walt's cancer).
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The Line
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Post by The Line on Jul 23, 2012 20:45:40 GMT -5
also, I'm glad others seem to like Mike as much as I do. He really is an awesome character. A complete and total badass who has a clear-cut moral code that he won't break. He does bad things, but for the most part he can justify that he's doing bad things to bad people, not good people.
I, too, like how the Mike character was made increasingly more major of a character as Walt got more and more "bad", almost as if the character's entire purpose is to be a reminder of, like how others in this tread have said, how Walt used to be(or at least how he imagined himself). Hell, that actually may be his sole purpose, but he's still an excellently written(and acted) character.
I really liked how the relationship between Mike and Jesse progressed in Season 4. I see Jesse as kind of a mixture between guys like Mike and guys like Walt. While he,too has clear-cut morals(especially concerning kids), he also has a bad streak like Walt's(without being as egocentrically driven, though) and uses the same logic as Walt to justify it(that he's just a supplier, despite the fact that he specifically targeted recovering addicts and such).
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Rican
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
July 17, 2011 - HHHe called it
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Post by Rican on Jul 24, 2012 13:05:24 GMT -5
I actually have a different idea of how things will play out if (when) Hank finds out about Walt.
Basically, he won't bust him. Think about it. We saw a tease of it in this past episode. Hank's boss got the boot for having Gus right under his nose and not acting. Can you imagine what the DEA's reaction will be when they realize Hank had this huge meth manufacturer in his own damn family? Even if there isn't any formal discipline, there's going to be an investigation on Hank, too. At BEST, he'll be a laughingstock, which Hank still won't be able to take.
Hank may be the most morally upright character on the show, but he has a flaw: pride. It's not as bad as Walt certainly, but we saw it when he didn't want anyone to know how badly he was traumatized by the incident in El Paso, or how he didn't want help with his physical therapy. He won't want to be seen as a joke.
Further than that, how long before someone realizes Hank's therapy was paid for with Walt's drug money? How long before someone asks why the lead investigator on the Heisenberg case missed so many clues, made false arrests (season 2) and asks what if Hank was in on it and helped? Hell, Walt GOT the idea to start making meth in the first damn place from going on a ride-along drug bust with Hank!
When Hank realizes who Walt is, he'll also realize his ass is on the line, be it on his own or by Walt or Saul or someone pointing it out. His moral code won't let him kill Walt and cover it up, so he'll force him to leave town and hope the blue stuff dries up and the whole thing gets swept under the rug. This is what we saw with Walt on the run at the start of the season.
However, Hank will be unsuccessful. The theme of the show, I believe, is that EVERYONE will break bad. Hank's breaking bad moment will be letting Walt go, and it will cost him, too.
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Post by Stu on Jul 24, 2012 13:16:17 GMT -5
Interesting theory. But as much as everyone believes the final face-off (pun intended) will involve Hank and Walter, we need to figure out how to get there. And I can't help but think that the wildcard in all this will be Ted. I really think there's more to him than being the guy who hooked up with Walt's wife and was cause for him losing a lot of money.
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Massive G
Hank Scorpio
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Post by Massive G on Jul 24, 2012 13:38:39 GMT -5
it has been brought to my attention that as awesome as Mike is, he finished that episode on a very half measure-y note. And we know Mike is not a fan of those.
I am also intrigued by how vociferously I wanted the gruesome demise of Lydia, a character with maybe 3 minutes of total screen time. I mean, she was practically begging to be shot in the face, I was just sitting on my couch going DO IT DO IT MIKE SHOOT HER FACE
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Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2012 18:58:26 GMT -5
I actually have a different idea of how things will play out if (when) Hank finds out about Walt. Basically, he won't bust him. Think about it. We saw a tease of it in this past episode. Hank's boss got the boot for having Gus right under his nose and not acting. Can you imagine what the DEA's reaction will be when they realize Hank had this huge meth manufacturer in his own damn family? Even if there isn't any formal discipline, there's going to be an investigation on Hank, too. At BEST, he'll be a laughingstock, which Hank still won't be able to take. Hank may be the most morally upright character on the show, but he has a flaw: pride. It's not as bad as Walt certainly, but we saw it when he didn't want anyone to know how badly he was traumatized by the incident in El Paso, or how he didn't want help with his physical therapy. He won't want to be seen as a joke. Further than that, how long before someone realizes Hank's therapy was paid for with Walt's drug money? How long before someone asks why the lead investigator on the Heisenberg case missed so many clues, made false arrests (season 2) and asks what if Hank was in on it and helped? Hell, Walt GOT the idea to start making meth in the first damn place from going on a ride-along drug bust with Hank! When Hank realizes who Walt is, he'll also realize his ass is on the line, be it on his own or by Walt or Saul or someone pointing it out. His moral code won't let him kill Walt and cover it up, so he'll force him to leave town and hope the blue stuff dries up and the whole thing gets swept under the rug. This is what we saw with Walt on the run at the start of the season. However, Hank will be unsuccessful. The theme of the show, I believe, is that EVERYONE will break bad. Hank's breaking bad moment will be letting Walt go, and it will cost him, too. Very good observations. I'm not sure I see it going that way though, but when he inevitably figures Walt out, it's gonna be a tug of war between his pride and his reputation. I wouldn't even be surprised if Hank brings Walt in for an interrogation and Walt lays out exactly what you explained to him and it becomes a real conflict for Hank. I think that Hank's downfall will ultimately be his commitment to the force. Once Hank has Walt figured out, he's got quite a backlog of interactions that will make a lot more sense now that he knows. The drives to Los Pollos, the time they spent mulling over Gale's notebook, the drunken dinner conversation where Walt laughs at the idea that Gale is Heisenberg. I think Hank's pride will win over whatever anyone else might think of his relationship with Walt. He's just gonna wanna beat Heisenberg. Because really, it's not a happy ending for Hank either way, he lets Walt go and it will definitely affect his psyche that this was all happening in front of him and that he's unwilling to do anything about it. He'll be bed ridden and miserable and likely lose everything over it. He locks up Walt, then there's no way he doesn't learn of Skyler's involvement, and I could only imagine Marie would leave Hank if he pursues that. In the end I just think the probability of Hank getting killed is too high for us to even see either story really develop.
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The Line
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Post by The Line on Jul 24, 2012 19:07:55 GMT -5
Walt Jr barely ate his breakfast in this episode...something is clearly wrong. Walt, Jr. has broken bad!
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Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2012 2:18:18 GMT -5
I've been a bit reluctant to post here, since I don't have any in-depth analysis to make (not sarcasm; I genuinely enjoy most of these posts). I just want to say that scene where Mike killed Chris was so sick. Loved the dialogue.
"You ready?"
I wonder what will cause Mike to finally snap. He's so good at keeping his cool that when he can't do it anymore s*** will hit the fan. Also makes me wonder what happened to him in Philly...
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Post by Stu on Jul 25, 2012 2:59:30 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2012 12:50:43 GMT -5
I actually have a different idea of how things will play out if (when) Hank finds out about Walt. Basically, he won't bust him. Think about it. We saw a tease of it in this past episode. Hank's boss got the boot for having Gus right under his nose and not acting. Can you imagine what the DEA's reaction will be when they realize Hank had this huge meth manufacturer in his own damn family? Even if there isn't any formal discipline, there's going to be an investigation on Hank, too. At BEST, he'll be a laughingstock, which Hank still won't be able to take. Hank may be the most morally upright character on the show, but he has a flaw: pride. It's not as bad as Walt certainly, but we saw it when he didn't want anyone to know how badly he was traumatized by the incident in El Paso, or how he didn't want help with his physical therapy. He won't want to be seen as a joke. Further than that, how long before someone realizes Hank's therapy was paid for with Walt's drug money? How long before someone asks why the lead investigator on the Heisenberg case missed so many clues, made false arrests (season 2) and asks what if Hank was in on it and helped? Hell, Walt GOT the idea to start making meth in the first damn place from going on a ride-along drug bust with Hank! When Hank realizes who Walt is, he'll also realize his ass is on the line, be it on his own or by Walt or Saul or someone pointing it out. His moral code won't let him kill Walt and cover it up, so he'll force him to leave town and hope the blue stuff dries up and the whole thing gets swept under the rug. This is what we saw with Walt on the run at the start of the season. However, Hank will be unsuccessful. The theme of the show, I believe, is that EVERYONE will break bad. Hank's breaking bad moment will be letting Walt go, and it will cost him, too. Amazing theory.
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Post by salsashark on Jul 25, 2012 12:56:44 GMT -5
I actually have a different idea of how things will play out if (when) Hank finds out about Walt. Basically, he won't bust him. Think about it. We saw a tease of it in this past episode. Hank's boss got the boot for having Gus right under his nose and not acting. Can you imagine what the DEA's reaction will be when they realize Hank had this huge meth manufacturer in his own damn family? Even if there isn't any formal discipline, there's going to be an investigation on Hank, too. At BEST, he'll be a laughingstock, which Hank still won't be able to take. Hank may be the most morally upright character on the show, but he has a flaw: pride. It's not as bad as Walt certainly, but we saw it when he didn't want anyone to know how badly he was traumatized by the incident in El Paso, or how he didn't want help with his physical therapy. He won't want to be seen as a joke. Further than that, how long before someone realizes Hank's therapy was paid for with Walt's drug money? How long before someone asks why the lead investigator on the Heisenberg case missed so many clues, made false arrests (season 2) and asks what if Hank was in on it and helped? Hell, Walt GOT the idea to start making meth in the first damn place from going on a ride-along drug bust with Hank! When Hank realizes who Walt is, he'll also realize his ass is on the line, be it on his own or by Walt or Saul or someone pointing it out. His moral code won't let him kill Walt and cover it up, so he'll force him to leave town and hope the blue stuff dries up and the whole thing gets swept under the rug. This is what we saw with Walt on the run at the start of the season. However, Hank will be unsuccessful. The theme of the show, I believe, is that EVERYONE will break bad. Hank's breaking bad moment will be letting Walt go, and it will cost him, too. This is legit one of the best Breaking Bad theories/ideas I've ever read, and I have read many. Excellent work.
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Rican
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
July 17, 2011 - HHHe called it
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Post by Rican on Jul 25, 2012 21:18:32 GMT -5
Thanks for the feedback, guys. I just feel like Breaking Bad is too subtle of a show to do "Hank finds out and goes guns a-blazin'."
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Post by Stu on Jul 28, 2012 15:35:58 GMT -5
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Post by Citizen Snips on Jul 28, 2012 15:42:43 GMT -5
I noticed not too long ago that Anna Gunn has some big boobs...seems I'm not the only one to notice this...
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The Line
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Post by The Line on Jul 28, 2012 15:55:00 GMT -5
Thanks for the feedback, guys. I just feel like Breaking Bad is too subtle of a show to do "Hank finds out and goes guns a-blazin'." yeah, and there's another reason(2 actually) that I don't think would that: Holly and Walt, Jr. Granted we haven't seen Hank and Holly interact, since she's just a baby, but obviously there is a pretty major Father/Son dynamic between Hank & Walt, Jr. Being a DEA agent, Hank's got to know, at least on some level, that getting Walt arrested(which in turn would lead to Skylar's arrest, most likely, or at the very least, she'd lose the kids) would uproot the kids, and given what would the controversial nature of a potential Walt arrest(him being Hank's brother-in-law, etc) and the fact that it wouldn't take people too long to start questioning things about Hank's medical treatment, I doubt Hank & Marie would be able to get custody of the kids, either. Hank loves Walter, Jr.(hell, I think it's pretty safe to say that Walt, Jr. is Hank's favorite character, and probably vice-versa), and as his uncle, is able to protect him, look after him, offer advice, etc while Walt, Sr. often times remains emotionally distant and cold towards his family , and by blowing up the White family, he'd most likely lose the ability to continue to do so.
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Post by Stu on Jul 28, 2012 16:27:24 GMT -5
Another thing I'm curious about. How did Walt convince Hector to sacrifice himself to kill Gus? Did Hector hate Gus so much (and figure he was in poor health anyway) that he was fine with it? Or did Walt need to push him to do it? I can picture Walt convincing Hector in evil fashion.
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The Line
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Post by The Line on Jul 28, 2012 16:37:31 GMT -5
Another thing I'm curious about. How did Walt convince Hector to sacrifice himself to kill Gus? Did Hector hate Gus so much (and figure he was in poor health anyway) that he was fine with it? Or did Walt need to push him to do it? I can picture Walt convincing Hector in evil fashion. I thought it was pretty clear. I mean, Walt straight up said "want revenge on a guy you hate even more than me?", just a couple episodes after Gustavo came to Tio's nursing home to tell him how he's now killed every person Tio's ever cared for/about, and rather than kill Tio, he's going to let him live out the rest of his (pretty shitty) life knowing that. Just based off of body language alone, you could tell that Tio wanted to kill Gustavo right then and there, only if he were physically able to. Jesse talked to Walt about going and visiting Tio with Gustavo and the dynamic between those two. So Walt's presented with someone who wants Gustavo dead even more than he does and now has nothing to live for since his family is all dead. Walt was able to present Tio with a means of getting his revenge, which Tio definitely wouldn't have been able accomplish on his own. Walt can be pretty manipulative, but I don't think he needed to be in this case at all. Tio and Walt were eachother's ends to a means(killing Gus) and I doubt that it really took Walt too long to point out that fact.
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