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Post by Wolf Hurricane on Dec 24, 2011 16:10:26 GMT -5
Okay, I'm kinda confused. You say shoot, but then you say "pro wrestling moves in a pro wrestling match." If we're talking about catch, then I have to give it to Austin, 'cause I think he has better handles. On the other hand, if you mean pure shoot, maybe Austin, but it's a little closer; Austin strikes me as the kind of guy who could handle himself in a bar fight, but Goldberg doesn't exactly look like a punk himself.
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Post by moneyman20 on Dec 24, 2011 16:13:48 GMT -5
Austin simply because he looks like he has a much better grasp of the shoot aspects of wrestling than Goldberg would. Goldberg could probably win a striking contest though.
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saintpat
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Post by saintpat on Dec 24, 2011 16:57:56 GMT -5
Okay, I'm kinda confused. You say shoot, but then you say "pro wrestling moves in a pro wrestling match." If we're talking about catch, then I have to give it to Austin, 'cause I think he has better handles. On the other hand, if you mean pure shoot, maybe Austin, but it's a little closer; Austin strikes me as the kind of guy who could handle himself in a bar fight, but Goldberg doesn't exactly look like a punk himself. I mean shoot like back in the day, when Lou Thesz would occasionally show up in some town where the local top dog might decide he was going to take the title and Thesz would have to actually really wrestle him and beat him (usually by suffocating him for a long time with the leg scissors to break his resolve). By wrestling rules, I'm just saying neither guy can take a tire iron, or it isn't a MMA or boxing match -- you get to the ropes and there's a break, etc.
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Post by repomanfan on Dec 24, 2011 17:24:07 GMT -5
Austin simply because he looks like he has a much better grasp of the shoot aspects of wrestling than Goldberg would. Goldberg could probably win a striking contest though. I don't care who has a better amateur pedigree or what not. I wanna know who's bigger, tougher and more crazy. There's a reason why Meng, Orndorff and guys like that are known as badassess, and it's not because they have a good grasp of the catch as catch can style it's because they are crazy SOB's that won't back down until someone is badly hurt or in the hospital.
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Post by molson5 on Dec 24, 2011 20:44:34 GMT -5
Bar fight, I'm going with Goldberg, formal MMA shoot-fight with rules, I'm going with Austin.
Goldberg was bigger, I believe he was stronger, and he was probably a better overall athlete than Austin as well. But Austin did have more wrestling knowledge - which would be pretty much useless in a bar fight, but might serve him well in an MMA shoot fight.
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Post by FUNK_US/BRODUS on Dec 25, 2011 10:41:56 GMT -5
Goldberg doesnt look like an MMA guy at all. Care to explain why you think otherwise? He just didn't. He didn't move like a fighter does now, he didn't have the build of an Anderson Silva/GSP/Jon Jones/ any of them, and there was nothing about him besides wearing Shooto style gloves that suggested MMA. Plus his striking is pretty sloppy. Mule kicks etc. It looks nice in pro wrestling, but for MMA, not so much.
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Post by ________ has left the building on Dec 25, 2011 11:31:30 GMT -5
I think some don't realize in a real fight, there are no rules. You can punch someone in the balls, stick a thumb into their eye, or kick them in the knee. Austin strikes me as a person who would fight dirty. You can try MMA moves in a fight all you want but a punch to the throat will end it quick.
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Post by molson5 on Dec 25, 2011 13:49:05 GMT -5
I think some don't realize in a real fight, there are no rules. You can punch someone in the balls, stick a thumb into their eye, or kick them in the knee. Austin strikes me as a person who would fight dirty. You can try MMA moves in a fight all you want but a punch to the throat will end it quick. Goldberg grew up in Oklahoma and was a bouncer. We don't know the extent of his real-life fight history, but I don't think we can assume Austin is the better, and dirtier fighter just based on their adult personalities (which are probably worked to some degree). With that kind of uncertainty, I would think the bigger guy that was an elite athlete would be the safer bet.
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Post by jadison on Dec 25, 2011 16:17:39 GMT -5
Perhaps, but if Goldberg couldn't break it, how tough is he really? Realistically if you catch most anyone in a good solid front facelock/guillotine choke that's it. There are probably a fair chunk of solid MMA fighters that can't get out of one applied well. Hah, so what's the point of being a good fighter if a simple front facelock is easy to apply on you, and you can't escape it? Apparently, Larry Zybysko and Daniel Bryan could dominate the entire world right now.
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Post by nWoElite on Dec 25, 2011 17:00:21 GMT -5
Goldberg grew up in Oklahoma and was a bouncer. After seeing this line and remembering the tussle between him and Jericho, my money is definitely on Austin.
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Post by Cela on Dec 25, 2011 20:13:21 GMT -5
Believe it or not, Austin would probably have difficulty escaping a simple front facelock. It's a very effective move.
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saintpat
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Post by saintpat on Dec 25, 2011 20:30:45 GMT -5
I think some don't realize in a real fight, there are no rules. Reminds me of a story a buddy of mine told me years ago: He told his father about getting into a fight in a bar and beating the guy up. His father said, "Let me guess, when you left you ran into a bunch of his buddies in the parking lot and they beat the sh!t out of you." My friend: "How did you know?" His dad: "Because that's the way we used to do it."
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Post by FUNK_US/BRODUS on Dec 25, 2011 21:37:25 GMT -5
Realistically if you catch most anyone in a good solid front facelock/guillotine choke that's it. There are probably a fair chunk of solid MMA fighters that can't get out of one applied well. Hah, so what's the point of being a good fighter if a simple front facelock is easy to apply on you, and you can't escape it? Apparently, Larry Zybysko and Daniel Bryan could dominate the entire world right now. If you catch someone solid in a guillotine, its game over. Watch Jon Jones vs Lyoto Machida from earlier this month. Jones caught him standing in a guillotine, and then dropped an unconscious Machida to the floor without a care in the world. And both of those guys would turn Goldberg sideways and shove him up Austin's ass.
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Post by repomanfan on Dec 25, 2011 21:43:39 GMT -5
Hah, so what's the point of being a good fighter if a simple front facelock is easy to apply on you, and you can't escape it? Apparently, Larry Zybysko and Daniel Bryan could dominate the entire world right now. If you catch someone solid in a guillotine, its game over. Watch Jon Jones vs Lyoto Machida from earlier this month. Jones caught him standing in a guillotine, and then dropped an unconscious Machida to the floor without a care in the world. And both of those guys would turn Goldberg sideways and shove him up Austin's ass. What about the big that big right hand that Machida took before that. I'm sure that had a little do with it.
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Post by flatsdomino on Dec 25, 2011 21:51:22 GMT -5
Austin has no hair to pull, so Goldberg wouldn't know what to do.
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Post by celtics543 on Dec 25, 2011 23:57:00 GMT -5
I'll go with Austin. When he broke in the business you had to be able to defend yourself against everyone. I think if you take both in their physical primes, then Goldberg is clearly a better athlete but I think Austin would be the better fighter.
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Post by FUNK_US/BRODUS on Dec 26, 2011 8:36:47 GMT -5
If you catch someone solid in a guillotine, its game over. Watch Jon Jones vs Lyoto Machida from earlier this month. Jones caught him standing in a guillotine, and then dropped an unconscious Machida to the floor without a care in the world. And both of those guys would turn Goldberg sideways and shove him up Austin's ass. What about the big that big right hand that Machida took before that. I'm sure that had a little do with it. Considering that a guillotine is a blood choke intended to stop blood flowing to the brain, Id say no. Watch this. Yes, guillotines can do that to a person.
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Post by Futureraven: Beelzebruv on Dec 26, 2011 15:43:37 GMT -5
While there may be no rules, someone with even limited training is usually a better bet in a fight unless the other guy gets a lucky shot, the trained guy will know more ways to hurt someone, how to dodge and grab an arm, a leg etc. and have had some experience of the mentality of handling yourself in situations you're going to get hurt, and trying to avoid it.
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Post by repomanfan on Dec 26, 2011 17:07:52 GMT -5
What about the big that big right hand that Machida took before that. I'm sure that had a little do with it. Considering that a guillotine is a blood choke intended to stop blood flowing to the brain, Id say no. Watch this. Yes, guillotines can do that to a person. The right hand BEFORE. BEFORE.
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Post by Cela on Dec 26, 2011 19:31:00 GMT -5
Considering that a guillotine is a blood choke intended to stop blood flowing to the brain, Id say no. Watch this. Yes, guillotines can do that to a person. The right hand BEFORE. BEFORE. Yes, that guillotine was helped by a punch, but- Ever since the first Guillotine in the UFC was hit by Ken Shamrock on Dan Severn, it has become one of the more effective submissions. The reason most likely has to do with wrestlers learning to shoot with their heads down, which sets the move up very well. So a front facelock would work really well on anyone who had wrestled in high school and had never seen the move before.
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