Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 27, 2012 6:25:08 GMT -5
Team "I Will Take Anybody On the Planet Over Rock, Punk, or Cena," personally, but if I had to choose, easily rather have Rock with the title than Punk.
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FinalGwen
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Particularly fond of muffins.
Posts: 16,410
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Post by FinalGwen on Dec 27, 2012 6:36:47 GMT -5
I'm on Team Anyone-but-Rock, but Punk will work nicely in that role.
And what's with all the David Arquette comparisons in this thread? Give me Arquette over Rock any day. He's a class act, which can't be said for Rocky. And he's put over more guys in the last 5 years than Rock has.
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Post by wrestling4ever on Dec 27, 2012 7:28:59 GMT -5
I'm on Team Anyone-but-Rock, but Punk will work nicely in that role. And what's with all the David Arquette comparisons in this thread? Give me Arquette over Rock any day. He's a class act, which can't be said for Rocky. And he's put over more guys in the last 5 years than Rock has. How comes Rock doesn't have any class? And your last sentence doesn't even make sense.
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FinalGwen
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Particularly fond of muffins.
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Post by FinalGwen on Dec 27, 2012 7:36:50 GMT -5
The amount of homophobic jibes he made last year don't indicate a great deal of class, nor does the absence of any apology for them. (For an example of how best to do this, see Punk himself after calling a fan a 'homo'. He apologised, said that what he did was wrong and that he'd lost his temper, and called out the fans who were saying he was in the right.)
And Arquette returned, promptly lost a match to a modern star, and got powerbombed through a table. Rock came back, won his match with a modern star, and took up tons of TV time with inane babble.
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Arrow
Hank Scorpio
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Post by Arrow on Dec 27, 2012 7:44:11 GMT -5
So, Rock (the real person) has no class because of a popular character he's paid to play on TV? Or is it the character itself that has no class? I can get not liking the latter, but being angry with the former is just laughable.
And Rock needed to win that match so that WWE could continue to use his name on pay-per-view cards to make money in the future. What applied to Arquette doesn't apply to Rock.
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Post by wrestling4ever on Dec 27, 2012 7:47:05 GMT -5
The amount of homophobic jibes he made last year don't indicate a great deal of class, nor does the absence of any apology for them. (For an example of how best to do this, see Punk himself after calling a fan a 'homo'. He apologised, said that what he did was wrong and that he'd lost his temper, and called out the fans who were saying he was in the right.) And Arquette returned, promptly lost a match to a modern star, and got powerbombed through a table. Rock came back, won his match with a modern star, and took up tons of TV time with inane babble. Punk also made fun of a man nearly dying. Very classy right? Come on dude its just entertainment, a tv show. If he was going around in real life saying these things I could see your point. You seem a bit too sensitive to what is coming out of wrestling guys mouths. There's a long list of things that these guys have said in the past that were crazy and edgy. I dont see how that makes any of them classless. Rock's run also is not over. Not like losing to someone is the only way to put someone over anyway. Seems like you are grasping at things to try and make your point.
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Post by PTBartman on Dec 27, 2012 7:52:32 GMT -5
Yeah, and there is a person the fans picked. His name is Ryback and he's over as hell. They could have Punk/Ryback be a huge storyline booked up to Wrestlemania where Ryback FINALLY get's his win over Punk and becomes the WWE Champion. He's came up short time after time again because of shenanigans and interference. This time, interference is banned and Paul Heyman is barred from ringside. It's CM Punk vs. Ryback, one on one. Ryback will finally show the world why's he is a force to be reckoned with. Nope, let's scratch all that. Yeah, Ryback's over, in his early 30's, and has a ton of potential. But, nah. Let's have the longest WWE Champion reign in the modern era be ended by a guy who won't be in WWE 2 day's after Wrestlemania 29. Now THAT makes no sense at all. I like Ryback too, but the last 3 pay-per-view crowds haven't been too kind to him. Unfortunately, I have no doubt that the NY/NJ crowd is gonna give him nothing but "GOLLLLLLLDBERG" chants the whole night, ESPECIALLY if he faces Punk. Maybe you New Yorkers will but us Jerseyans are the model of politeness and decoru...nah, your right. We're pretty much butthead smarkers too.
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FinalGwen
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Particularly fond of muffins.
Posts: 16,410
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Post by FinalGwen on Dec 27, 2012 7:54:58 GMT -5
If you're willing to spout homophobic insults when there's no actual reason to? Yes, you are classless.
This is (supposedly) one of the best promo guys in the company's history, and he can't build a feud without calling somebody every tired and hackneyed gay insult in the book? Come on. If he's that useless at cutting promos, we don't need him back.
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Arrow
Hank Scorpio
Posts: 5,122
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Post by Arrow on Dec 27, 2012 8:01:58 GMT -5
If you're willing to spout homophobic insults when there's no actual reason to? Yes, you are classless. This is (supposedly) one of the best promo guys in the company's history, and he can't build a feud without calling somebody every tired and hackneyed gay insult in the book? Come on. If he's that useless at cutting promos, we don't need him back. There is a reason, it's the character he portrays. "The Rock" is a bully, reminiscent of the jock character you'd see in those old High School movies who makes fun of people with a variety of insults, many of them juvenile. Rock's brand of humor is what made him popular in the first place, it's not that he can't cut a promo without them (and he has, several times), it's that he won't because his fans expect it from him.
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Ben Wyatt
Crow T. Robot
Are You Gonna Go My Way?
I don't get it. At all. It's kind of a small horse, I mean what am I missing? Am I crazy?
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Post by Ben Wyatt on Dec 27, 2012 8:03:04 GMT -5
I am so freaking sick of the "make a new star" talk it's not even funny. WWE doesn't make stars, the fans do. You can't assume that someone beating Punk is going to immediately launch them into stardom. Rock beating him at least makes the reign feel like a big deal, where as him losing to a new guy may prove that he was a coward champion. Yeah, and there is a person the fans picked. His name is Ryback and he's over as hell. They could have Punk/Ryback be a huge storyline booked up to Wrestlemania where Ryback FINALLY get's his win over Punk and becomes the WWE Champion. He's came up short time after time again because of shenanigans and interference. This time, interference is banned and Paul Heyman is barred from ringside. It's CM Punk vs. Ryback, one on one. Ryback will finally show the world why's he is a force to be reckoned with. Nope, let's scratch all that. Yeah, Ryback's over, in his early 30's, and has a ton of potential. But, nah. Let's have the longest WWE Champion reign in the modern era be ended by a guy who won't be in WWE 2 day's after Wrestlemania 29. Now THAT makes no sense at all.
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Post by Starshine on Dec 27, 2012 8:04:29 GMT -5
If you're willing to spout homophobic insults when there's no actual reason to? Yes, you are classless. This is (supposedly) one of the best promo guys in the company's history, and he can't build a feud without calling somebody every tired and hackneyed gay insult in the book? Come on. If he's that useless at cutting promos, we don't need him back. Hmm, I don't remember The Rock ever calling someone a f*****. Anyway it would be a bad idea to have the Rock change up his routine when that's the stuff that made him so popular in the first place. It has nothing to do with class, but more to do with smart booking. No one who likes The Rock wants him to be all chummy chummy, they want to see the braggart with the silver tongue they know and love doing the routine he's known for. It'd be like seeing your favourite comedian, you want to see them do their usual and popular routine. Doing it any other way would be moronic.
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Post by wrestling4ever on Dec 27, 2012 8:19:14 GMT -5
If you're willing to spout homophobic insults when there's no actual reason to? Yes, you are classless. This is (supposedly) one of the best promo guys in the company's history, and he can't build a feud without calling somebody every tired and hackneyed gay insult in the book? Come on. If he's that useless at cutting promos, we don't need him back. Except that he has build without it and he did. You seem way to sensitive about what a freaking tv show character is saying. Sorry but thats just how I see it at this point. It is not that serious and it doesnt make them classless at all. Just screams you trying to justify your hate.
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Post by Snaptastic on Dec 27, 2012 8:21:23 GMT -5
If you're willing to spout homophobic insults when there's no actual reason to? Yes, you are classless. This is (supposedly) one of the best promo guys in the company's history, and he can't build a feud without calling somebody every tired and hackneyed gay insult in the book? Come on. If he's that useless at cutting promos, we don't need him back. You're confusing the real person with the character. But when he can hold the crowd in the palm of his hand which no single other man currently in the WWE can do (no not even Punk)...he will still be the best promo guy on the roster for the time he's there.
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FinalGwen
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Particularly fond of muffins.
Posts: 16,410
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Post by FinalGwen on Dec 27, 2012 8:47:15 GMT -5
If you're willing to spout homophobic insults when there's no actual reason to? Yes, you are classless. This is (supposedly) one of the best promo guys in the company's history, and he can't build a feud without calling somebody every tired and hackneyed gay insult in the book? Come on. If he's that useless at cutting promos, we don't need him back. Except that he has build without it and he did. You seem way to sensitive about what a freaking tv show character is saying. Sorry but thats just how I see it at this point. It is not that serious and it doesnt make them classless at all. Just screams you trying to justify your hate. You seem completely incapable of understanding that a culture where homophobia is not only used casually, but actively cheered, is not helpful for people around the world who have to live with the consequences. It's this kind of attitude that made "gay" the shorthand insult for the better part of a decade, that pushed LGBT people further into the closet, knowing that if they ever saw their identities in the media, it would be as the subject of mockery and nothing more. We moved on as a culture, or so I thought. But Rock's still stuck there. And for all the "oh, it's just a TV character", NOTHING would be lost if he used a better line of insults. I sincerely doubt that WWE said "Now, we'd really like it if you could use some homophobic insults and attract the attention of GLAAD here." He chose those words. He chose that attitude. Not a TV character. Him. Dwayne Johnson. I don't have to justify my hate. The reasons are plain, even if I don't expect you to understand them. But until he apologises or quits using it as part of his shtick, f*** the Rock and f*** anyone who tries to justify his stupidity.
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Post by Ryback on a Pole! on Dec 27, 2012 8:50:33 GMT -5
I never saw how Rock is a good promo guy. Shouting fast and hurling the world's worst insults at people is cutting a good promo?
There's no substance to anything he says... just lame insults and the sort of jokes a 5 year old would make yet for some reason people lap it up. "Hahahahaha Rock hinted that Cena has got a fanny! How funny is that!"
He sucks. I'll call him a good promo guy once he says has something interesting to say beyond "Cena's looks like fruity pebbles". I'm not even a fan of his delivery, it's just shouting and talking fast, no emotion, drama or feeling in his words beyond him wanting to use whichever juvenile insults he's got from Saturday morning cartoons this week..
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Post by Snaptastic on Dec 27, 2012 8:51:42 GMT -5
I never saw how Rock is a good promo guy. Shouting fast and hurling the world's worst insults at people is cutting a good promo? There's no substance to anything he says... just lame insults and the sort of jokes a 5 year old would make yet for some reason people lap it up. "Hahahahaha Rock hinted that Cena has got a fanny! How funny is that!" He sucks. I'll call him a good promo guy once he says has something interesting to say beyond "Cena's looks like fruity pebbles". I'm not even a fan of his delivery, it's just shouting and talking fast, no emotion, drama or feeling in his words beyond him wanting to use whichever juvenile insults he's got from Saturday morning cartoons this week.. Okay well who is a good promo guy then? If it's Punk then you'll need to supply me with some caffeine as his promos tend to bore me to sleep.
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Arrow
Hank Scorpio
Posts: 5,122
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Post by Arrow on Dec 27, 2012 8:55:30 GMT -5
I never saw how Rock is a good promo guy. Shouting fast and hurling the world's worst insults at people is cutting a good promo? Holding an audience in the palm of your hand, playing to your character, and convincing fans through the power of your words to cheer (or boo) you and pay to see you wrestle is what makes a good promo. And Rock does all those things. No one says you have to like him or what he says, but he's clearly very good at what he does. Half the time I roll my eyes at what CM Punk says, but the same would apply to him as well.
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Post by Ryback on a Pole! on Dec 27, 2012 8:59:15 GMT -5
I never saw how Rock is a good promo guy. Shouting fast and hurling the world's worst insults at people is cutting a good promo? There's no substance to anything he says... just lame insults and the sort of jokes a 5 year old would make yet for some reason people lap it up. "Hahahahaha Rock hinted that Cena has got a fanny! How funny is that!" He sucks. I'll call him a good promo guy once he says has something interesting to say beyond "Cena's looks like fruity pebbles". I'm not even a fan of his delivery, it's just shouting and talking fast, no emotion, drama or feeling in his words beyond him wanting to use whichever juvenile insults he's got from Saturday morning cartoons this week.. Okay well who is a good promo guy then? If it's Punk then you'll need to supply me with some caffeine as his promos tend to bore me to sleep. My personal favourites? Austin, HBK, Foley (Until recent years, current Foley has lost his edge) and to a lesser degree, JBL and Jericho. 9 times out of 10, whenever they cut a promo I found myself hanging onto every word. They managed to do a variety of promos; emotional ones, passionate ones, angry ones, comedy ones etc. They were all much better than Rock. Better delivery, better content and much more believable.
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Post by wrestling4ever on Dec 27, 2012 9:02:15 GMT -5
Except that he has build without it and he did. You seem way to sensitive about what a freaking tv show character is saying. Sorry but thats just how I see it at this point. It is not that serious and it doesnt make them classless at all. Just screams you trying to justify your hate. You seem completely incapable of understanding that a culture where homophobia is not only used casually, but actively cheered, is not helpful for people around the world who have to live with the consequences. It's this kind of attitude that made "gay" the shorthand insult for the better part of a decade, that pushed LGBT people further into the closet, knowing that if they ever saw their identities in the media, it would be as the subject of mockery and nothing more. We moved on as a culture, or so I thought. But Rock's still stuck there. And for all the "oh, it's just a TV character", NOTHING would be lost if he used a better line of insults. I sincerely doubt that WWE said "Now, we'd really like it if you could use some homophobic insults and attract the attention of GLAAD here." He chose those words. He chose that attitude. Not a TV character. Him. Dwayne Johnson. I don't have to justify my hate. The reasons are plain, even if I don't expect you to understand them. But until he apologises or quits using it as part of his shtick, f*** the Rock and f*** anyone who tries to justify his stupidity. I know what its all about but you are still taking a tv character's words way too seriously. You want Dwayne Johnson's thoughts on gays. Here is pretty nice quote about im actually supporting the whole thing. "I know a lot of gay actors in Hollywood who don't want to come out, and whatever the reasons are I respect that. "But I think if people love you now, and if you came out, they would love you more, and if they didn't, then they weren't real people to begin with." Thats great, and he makes 100% sense there. I understand this must be a tough subject with you but The Rock shouldn't have to apologize for words that he said portraying a character. From wrestling, to movies, to tv shows. Its just how it is. It doesn't reflect their actual thoughts and thats where you get lost at it seems. Yes Its Dwayne Johnson but he is still portraying a guy on a TV show. Its all an act. Just like his words. Come on.
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Post by wrestling4ever on Dec 27, 2012 9:12:16 GMT -5
I never saw how Rock is a good promo guy. Shouting fast and hurling the world's worst insults at people is cutting a good promo? There's no substance to anything he says... just lame insults and the sort of jokes a 5 year old would make yet for some reason people lap it up. "Hahahahaha Rock hinted that Cena has got a fanny! How funny is that!" He sucks. I'll call him a good promo guy once he says has something interesting to say beyond "Cena's looks like fruity pebbles". I'm not even a fan of his delivery, it's just shouting and talking fast, no emotion, drama or feeling in his words beyond him wanting to use whichever juvenile insults he's got from Saturday morning cartoons this week.. If all you got from Rock in regards to the Cena feud was Fruity Pebbles then I feel for you. Rock wasn't at his best last time around but he had moments where he was serious and wasn't going overboard on the jokes. Like the last promo before the match where he and Cena had the back and forth in what was arguably the best back and forth promo between the two. And def the best current Rock promo in terms of seriousness and substance. Also, I can understand no one liking Rock's usual schtick but he has had his share of promos that didn't involve juvenile insults, that didn't involve a ton of shouting, and had good substance. Such as his promo before facing Austin at Manina XIX. He could change it up and do things differently when the time came. Just that he didn't do it week after week and thus people got lost into what he usually did. You either loved it or you hate it but the guy is far from someone who sucks. Some of the all time greats on the stick would tend to agree with this as well.
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