mizerable
Fry's dog Seymour
You're the lowest on the totem pole here, Alva. The lowest.
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Post by mizerable on Dec 29, 2012 17:52:46 GMT -5
He also IMO has never been nearly as over as either Orton or Edge as a solo act. More upside to pushing them. I have been amazed the last few years when people come on here and talk about how over Christian is at any given time when I see the same matches and the crowd isn't popping at all for him and looks completely dead. Here's the thing...Edge and Orton were golden boys from day 1. They put them over on commentary and were always made to look good. So more times than not, someone is going to get over, based on sheer motivation from the booking. It doesn't always happen, but if they're determined enough, you'll get pushed. And while I'll agree that Christian has never been super over (he's had some fairly big moments), a lot of it has to tie into what I just said. He's always been looked at as Edge's shadow, but I've always felt the crowds have treated Christian with a lot of respect. The "peep" thing took off without warning, they never bought into the "CLB" thing despite pushing that for a year, and no one wanted to see him turn heel last summer. As far as crowds being dead, they're usually dead for anyone not named Punk, Cena, Orton or strangely enough...Ziggler. I don't put that on the crowd itself. I don't want to compare Christian to any of those guys, but if he was given even half the push that Del Rio or Miz have received, he would make it work. I trust his determination that much.
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Post by BiloxiParish on Dec 29, 2012 17:56:53 GMT -5
I've never understood the love the IWC has for Christian I'm not going to sell you on a guy who does it all for me when it comes to wrestling, but while I'll agree that he isn't a marquee WWE guy, he's still insanely good at his craft. I've always felt he's the kind of dependable defunct champion, whenever they need to build someone up quickly. I think when someone says he's "overrated", it's just a generalized way of saying that they just don't personally like him, and that's fine. But it's going to be hard to find 5 better workers in the WWE. And while he isn't a major promo guy (I still think he's better than Edge), he can get his point across, and I always found his sleazy cheesy attitude amusing. Even recently, he had moments of goodness, just by the way he sold something. When he was given a match against Cena, he had this big smirk shoot across his face, he followed it up with "is it for the title?", which is something Christian would totally be asking, then the follow up tantrum worked as well. Maybe it's not your thing, but whatever...he amuses me more than 80% of the roster. I loved Christian with Edge. He just doesnt do anything for me anymore. It's almost the same way I felt about MVP.. There is nothing about him that would make me want to support him, he is just average to me. I wouldn't by his merchandise or buy a ticket just to see him. I wouldn't even ask for a picture with him if I saw him in public. He is decent on the mic. I will give you that. Ring wise though, there is nothing I see that would separate him from a Jamie Noble or a Shane Helms. The fact that he is getting injury prone as well doesn't sell me on him either. His spot on the main roster could go to Bray Wyatt or Tyson Kidd or Justin Gabriel
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mizerable
Fry's dog Seymour
You're the lowest on the totem pole here, Alva. The lowest.
Posts: 23,475
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Post by mizerable on Dec 29, 2012 18:11:44 GMT -5
I loved Christian with Edge. He just doesnt do anything for me anymore. It's almost the same way I felt about MVP.. There is nothing about him that would make me want to support him, he is just average to me. I wouldn't by his merchandise or buy a ticket just to see him. I wouldn't even ask for a picture with him if I saw him in public. He is decent on the mic. I will give you that. Ring wise though, there is nothing I see that would separate him from a Jamie Noble or a Shane Helms. The fact that he is getting injury prone as well doesn't sell me on him either. His spot on the main roster could go to Bray Wyatt or Tyson Kidd or Justin Gabriel I do believe that repetition can be lead you to finding someone boring. Whenever someone spins their wheels, it's frustrating to see them just be there. Or, if someone has overstayed their welcome and offer nothing important anymore. And you could make that argument for Christian, the same applies to MVP, both guys I thought had what it takes. However, I think much of that has to the inconsistent booking of anyone on the undercard. I see stellar workrate from him, which I would rank highly above Noble and a few shades above Helms (who also had ability, but I felt his twang voice held him back). Both Kidd and Gabriel are spot junkies, both of whom don't have anything remarkable as far as character goes. They're talented, no doubt, but I can't even come up with 2 adjectives per guy to describe what I'm seeing from them...and if I see no character, then I see no future. I like both guys, but they are unfortunately as vanilla as it comes. I'll agree that Christian is stagnant, but that's mostly WWE's fault for not doing anything with him. I mean if I'm working at a job where I'm not given much to do and then I have a job evaluation where they tell me I'm not doing enough, why is that my problem? This notion applies to a ton of guys they have. The fact that no one takes any time off unless for an injury only further complicates the situation when building new stars or having someone get a program. I wouldn't mind if Christian left WWE again. If TNA was still high on him, he would be a great asset as far as building title programs with other guys.
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Marvelously Mediocre
Fry's dog Seymour
Beggin' for a little SWAGGAH!
Haha. What a story Mark.
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Post by Marvelously Mediocre on Dec 29, 2012 18:22:39 GMT -5
I loved Christian with Edge. He just doesnt do anything for me anymore. It's almost the same way I felt about MVP.. There is nothing about him that would make me want to support him, he is just average to me. I wouldn't by his merchandise or buy a ticket just to see him. I wouldn't even ask for a picture with him if I saw him in public. He is decent on the mic. I will give you that. Ring wise though, there is nothing I see that would separate him from a Jamie Noble or a Shane Helms. The fact that he is getting injury prone as well doesn't sell me on him either. His spot on the main roster could go to Bray Wyatt or Tyson Kidd or Justin Gabriel I do believe that repetition can be lead you to finding someone boring. Whenever someone spins their wheels, it's frustrating to see them just be there. Or, if someone has overstayed their welcome and offer nothing important anymore. And you could make that argument for Christian, the same applies to MVP, both guys I thought had what it takes. However, I think much of that has to the inconsistent booking of anyone on the undercard. I see stellar workrate from him, which I would rank highly above Noble and a few shades above Helms (who also had ability, but I felt his twang voice held him back). Both Kidd and Gabriel are spot junkies, both of whom don't have anything remarkable as far as character goes. They're talented, no doubt, but I can't even come up with 2 adjectives per guy to describe what I'm seeing from them...and if I see no character, then I see no future. I like both guys, but they are unfortunately as vanilla as it comes. I'll agree that Christian is stagnant, but that's mostly WWE's fault for not doing anything with him. I mean if I'm working at a job where I'm not given much to do and then I have a job evaluation where they tell me I'm not doing enough, why is that my problem? This notion applies to a ton of guys they have. The fact that no one takes any time off unless for an injury only further complicates the situation when building new stars or having someone get a program. I wouldn't mind if Christian left WWE again. If TNA was still high on him, he would be a great asset as far as building title programs with other guys. Thing is he's been in a prominent position for how many years? 15? I enjoyed him in E&C which was purely down to Edge for me but then he left that, became a fairly prominent midcarder, had that semi-main event feud with Cena, spent years in TNA, came back, was on ECW every week and won the World Heavyweight title and at no point in that time did I find him unique, impressive, attention-grabbing or main event worthy. Now that's just me but it continues to totally confuse me that so many on the internet see him as this diamond that's been unfairly treated. He's frankly been given a much higher position than I think he deserves and has been found out as not much more than a midcarder. I really don't get him at all. Your argument is that because WWE isn't showing him off or doing anything with him. Surely in the ten years since he left E&C they did something with him for people to see how good he was? I've been watching for all ten of those years and have never found him special.
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Legion
Fry's dog Seymour
Amy Pond's #1 fan
Hail Hydra!
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Post by Legion on Dec 29, 2012 18:29:09 GMT -5
Yeah, what Marvelously Mediocre said.
He's had his chance, he was found wanting. Surely it's better to give someone younger and less injury prone a chance now?
Christian had his time, he made it as a midcarder and tag team specialist. That's it though really.
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Post by BiloxiParish on Dec 29, 2012 18:33:03 GMT -5
I loved Christian with Edge. He just doesnt do anything for me anymore. It's almost the same way I felt about MVP.. There is nothing about him that would make me want to support him, he is just average to me. I wouldn't by his merchandise or buy a ticket just to see him. I wouldn't even ask for a picture with him if I saw him in public. He is decent on the mic. I will give you that. Ring wise though, there is nothing I see that would separate him from a Jamie Noble or a Shane Helms. The fact that he is getting injury prone as well doesn't sell me on him either. His spot on the main roster could go to Bray Wyatt or Tyson Kidd or Justin Gabriel I do believe that repetition can be lead you to finding someone boring. Whenever someone spins their wheels, it's frustrating to see them just be there. Or, if someone has overstayed their welcome and offer nothing important anymore. And you could make that argument for Christian, the same applies to MVP, both guys I thought had what it takes. However, I think much of that has to the inconsistent booking of anyone on the undercard. I see stellar workrate from him, which I would rank highly above Noble and a few shades above Helms (who also had ability, but I felt his twang voice held him back). Both Kidd and Gabriel are spot junkies, both of whom don't have anything remarkable as far as character goes. They're talented, no doubt, but I can't even come up with 2 adjectives per guy to describe what I'm seeing from them...and if I see no character, then I see no future. I like both guys, but they are unfortunately as vanilla as it comes. I'll agree that Christian is stagnant, but that's mostly WWE's fault for not doing anything with him. I mean if I'm working at a job where I'm not given much to do and then I have a job evaluation where they tell me I'm not doing enough, why is that my problem? This notion applies to a ton of guys they have. The fact that no one takes any time off unless for an injury only further complicates the situation when building new stars or having someone get a program. I wouldn't mind if Christian left WWE again. If TNA was still high on him, he would be a great asset as far as building title programs with other guys. I've been watching wrestling for about 25 years now. A lot of the guys that I have been watching for more than 10 years now are channel changers for me with the exception of Mark Henry. Big Show bores me, Christian, Rey, Teddy Long, when the DX reunion happened I wasn't amused at all. Kane bores me most of the time. In TNA it's Chavo, AJ Styles, Bully Ray, Hogan. I see those guys that have been there forever problems. Although they can be entertaining and they can still put on a decent match.It is a a reason like Christian continuing to have a nice spot on the roster that hinders people like Tyson Kidd from excelling and getting to be decent and to develop his character.. Christian has accomplished so much in the business, it's time for him to be a trainer now. I enjoy seeing fresh faces on my TV, yes I love nostalgia as much as anybody.. Three of my favorite wrestlers of all time are Ric Flair, Roddy Piper, and Mick Foley but if they were wrestling all the freaking time right now I wouldn't support it at all..
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Post by BiloxiParish on Dec 29, 2012 18:33:54 GMT -5
I do believe that repetition can be lead you to finding someone boring. Whenever someone spins their wheels, it's frustrating to see them just be there. Or, if someone has overstayed their welcome and offer nothing important anymore. And you could make that argument for Christian, the same applies to MVP, both guys I thought had what it takes. However, I think much of that has to the inconsistent booking of anyone on the undercard. I see stellar workrate from him, which I would rank highly above Noble and a few shades above Helms (who also had ability, but I felt his twang voice held him back). Both Kidd and Gabriel are spot junkies, both of whom don't have anything remarkable as far as character goes. They're talented, no doubt, but I can't even come up with 2 adjectives per guy to describe what I'm seeing from them...and if I see no character, then I see no future. I like both guys, but they are unfortunately as vanilla as it comes. I'll agree that Christian is stagnant, but that's mostly WWE's fault for not doing anything with him. I mean if I'm working at a job where I'm not given much to do and then I have a job evaluation where they tell me I'm not doing enough, why is that my problem? This notion applies to a ton of guys they have. The fact that no one takes any time off unless for an injury only further complicates the situation when building new stars or having someone get a program. I wouldn't mind if Christian left WWE again. If TNA was still high on him, he would be a great asset as far as building title programs with other guys. Thing is he's been in a prominent position for how many years? 15? I enjoyed him in E&C which was purely down to Edge for me but then he left that, became a fairly prominent midcarder, had that semi-main event feud with Cena, spent years in TNA, came back, was on ECW every week and won the World Heavyweight title and at no point in that time did I find him unique, impressive, attention-grabbing or main event worthy. Now that's just me but it continues to totally confuse me that so many on the internet see him as this diamond that's been unfairly treated. He's frankly been given a much higher position than I think he deserves and has been found out as not much more than a midcarder. I really don't get him at all. Your argument is that because WWE isn't showing him off or doing anything with him. Surely in the ten years since he left E&C they did something with him for people to see how good he was? I've been watching for all ten of those years and have never found him special. I would like to buy you a beer and we can sit and talk about our mutual feelings about Christian..
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Post by joebob27 on Dec 29, 2012 18:39:10 GMT -5
Christian post TNA is kinda meh, but they really missed the boat with him in 2005. I think some people want to see him pushed to the moon as repayment for that, but it's kinda late now.
He's older, his look isn't very good anymore and his persona is just... different. I dunno.
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Marvelously Mediocre
Fry's dog Seymour
Beggin' for a little SWAGGAH!
Haha. What a story Mark.
Posts: 21,224
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Post by Marvelously Mediocre on Dec 29, 2012 18:41:38 GMT -5
Thing is he's been in a prominent position for how many years? 15? I enjoyed him in E&C which was purely down to Edge for me but then he left that, became a fairly prominent midcarder, had that semi-main event feud with Cena, spent years in TNA, came back, was on ECW every week and won the World Heavyweight title and at no point in that time did I find him unique, impressive, attention-grabbing or main event worthy. Now that's just me but it continues to totally confuse me that so many on the internet see him as this diamond that's been unfairly treated. He's frankly been given a much higher position than I think he deserves and has been found out as not much more than a midcarder. I really don't get him at all. Your argument is that because WWE isn't showing him off or doing anything with him. Surely in the ten years since he left E&C they did something with him for people to see how good he was? I've been watching for all ten of those years and have never found him special. I would like to buy you a beer and we can sit and talk about our mutual feelings about Christian.. Now that's a conversation I'd be happy to have!
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Above Average
Wade Wilson
Being Held Down by the Man and Several "Women"
Old School Tope Con Fiveo!!!
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Post by Above Average on Dec 29, 2012 18:45:33 GMT -5
I for one will be very happy to see Christian back on my TV screen. I accepted a long time ago that he was never going to be the main guy in WWE - I'm not sure he's really cut out to be, and that's okay.
It was fantastic for me as a fan to see him become World champion, but I do not expect him to or believe he should be champion again.
I am perfectly content for him to come back, get involved with the up and comers and have good feuds in and out of the ring with them. He's perfect for that - he has the ability on the mic and in the ring to help get someone over.
I really enjoyed his feud with Cody Rhodes this year and would hope to see similar feuds again in the future.
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Legion
Fry's dog Seymour
Amy Pond's #1 fan
Hail Hydra!
Posts: 22,700
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Post by Legion on Dec 29, 2012 18:47:20 GMT -5
I for one will be very happy to see Christian back on my TV screen. I accepted a long time ago that he was never going to be the main guy in WWE - I'm not sure he's really cut out to be, and that's okay. It was fantastic for me as a fan to see him become World champion, but I do not expect him to or believe he should be champion again. I am perfectly content for him to come back, get involved with the up and comers and have good feuds in and out of the ring with them. He's perfect for that - he has the ability on the mic and in the ring to help get someone over. I really enjoyed his feud with Cody Rhodes this year and would hope to see similar feuds again in the future. See, this is fine, JTTS. Perfect role for the guy going forward.
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Post by joebob27 on Dec 29, 2012 19:01:04 GMT -5
Yeah, what Marvelously Mediocre said. He's had his chance, he was found wanting. Surely it's better to give someone younger and less injury prone a chance now? Christian had his time, he made it as a midcarder and tag team specialist. That's it though really. Well, he never really actually got his chance. That's the problem. Would be like saying if they crap out on Dolph next year, that he got his chance.
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Post by lewis1711 on Dec 29, 2012 19:03:48 GMT -5
I wasn't even watching during the Edge and Christian days. Hell by the time I first saw Christian ECWWE had closed down and he was on smackdown. To anyone that says he doesn't have charisma - well I don't know what charisma is then. I'll say it once and I'll say it again, he is the only person that made me give a damn about a world title win in the 3 years I've been watching WWE again. www.youtube.com/watch?v=_MGPajz9By4
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mizerable
Fry's dog Seymour
You're the lowest on the totem pole here, Alva. The lowest.
Posts: 23,475
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Post by mizerable on Dec 29, 2012 19:04:18 GMT -5
It is a a reason like Christian continuing to have a nice spot on the roster that hinders people like Tyson Kidd from excelling and getting to be decent and to develop his character.. Christian has accomplished so much in the business, it's time for him to be a trainer now. If anything, I would say guys like Kane and Khali put more of a hindrance on things. Those are guys who are never going to get a longterm program and usually just go out there and beat smaller guys in a matter of minutes. Move them out of the way and you can open up more possibilities when filling your midcard. I would value someone like Christian over people such as Del Rio, Miz, Swagger, Henry Jericho (if he comes back for a short time) and so forth. The problem is, the main event is going to be heavy even if they dropped 2 or 3 guys...it's been a problem they've had for the last 3 or 4 years. Thing is he's been in a prominent position for how many years? 15? I enjoyed him in E&C which was purely down to Edge for me but then he left that, became a fairly prominent midcarder, had that semi-main event feud with Cena, spent years in TNA, came back, was on ECW every week and won the World Heavyweight title and at no point in that time did I find him unique, impressive, attention-grabbing or main event worthy. Now that's just me but it continues to totally confuse me that so many on the internet see him as this diamond that's been unfairly treated. He's frankly been given a much higher position than I think he deserves and has been found out as not much more than a midcarder. I really don't get him at all. Your argument is that because WWE isn't showing him off or doing anything with him. Surely in the ten years since he left E&C they did something with him for people to see how good he was? I've been watching for all ten of those years and have never found him special. I wouldn't say he's been in a prominent position for that long. He's looked at as a skilled hand...a quality janitor, if you will. I'd say they didn't give much of a damn until around 2003, and even then...it was only because he could bring back the IC title and not overshadow it. Again, what you find interesting and not interesting is up to personal taste...and again...it comes down to how someone is booked. You can't deny he wasn't tearing it up in the ring last year. He hasn't been unfairly treated, but it's baffling to me at least to see someone who could be a bigger player, while so many other jokes get steady pushes for no reason, other than the front office has a boner for them. He HAS done things that have gotten over, and they usually just ignore it or change fronts. They do that with a lot of guys, if it goes against the agenda they have planned, then they'll ax it.
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Marvelously Mediocre
Fry's dog Seymour
Beggin' for a little SWAGGAH!
Haha. What a story Mark.
Posts: 21,224
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Post by Marvelously Mediocre on Dec 29, 2012 19:26:53 GMT -5
It is a a reason like Christian continuing to have a nice spot on the roster that hinders people like Tyson Kidd from excelling and getting to be decent and to develop his character.. Christian has accomplished so much in the business, it's time for him to be a trainer now. If anything, I would say guys like Kane and Khali put more of a hindrance on things. Those are guys who are never going to get a longterm program and usually just go out there and beat smaller guys in a matter of minutes. Move them out of the way and you can open up more possibilities when filling your midcard. I would value someone like Christian over people such as Del Rio, Miz, Swagger, Henry Jericho (if he comes back for a short time) and so forth. The problem is, the main event is going to be heavy even if they dropped 2 or 3 guys...it's been a problem they've had for the last 3 or 4 years. Thing is he's been in a prominent position for how many years? 15? I enjoyed him in E&C which was purely down to Edge for me but then he left that, became a fairly prominent midcarder, had that semi-main event feud with Cena, spent years in TNA, came back, was on ECW every week and won the World Heavyweight title and at no point in that time did I find him unique, impressive, attention-grabbing or main event worthy. Now that's just me but it continues to totally confuse me that so many on the internet see him as this diamond that's been unfairly treated. He's frankly been given a much higher position than I think he deserves and has been found out as not much more than a midcarder. I really don't get him at all. Your argument is that because WWE isn't showing him off or doing anything with him. Surely in the ten years since he left E&C they did something with him for people to see how good he was? I've been watching for all ten of those years and have never found him special. I wouldn't say he's been in a prominent position for that long. He's looked at as a skilled hand...a quality janitor, if you will. I'd say they didn't give much of a damn until around 2003, and even then...it was only because he could bring back the IC title and not overshadow it. Again, what you find interesting and not interesting is up to personal taste...and again...it comes down to how someone is booked. You can't deny he wasn't tearing it up in the ring last year. He hasn't been unfairly treated, but it's baffling to me at least to see someone who could be a bigger player, while so many other jokes get steady pushes for no reason, other than the front office has a boner for them. He HAS done things that have gotten over, and they usually just ignore it or change fronts. They do that with a lot of guys, if it goes against the agenda they have planned, then they'll ax it. His matches with Orton were great I will concede to that. I would at least attribute half the credit to Orton for that though who was on fire during that period. He has some entertaining matches but it depends on the strength of his opponents and it's usually only ladder matches featuring him that I find entertaining. From 2003-2004 he was treated as a big deal with his IC title reign, affair with Trish and feud with Cena so he was given opportunities and to me, he just wasn't that impressive. Then he leaves for 5 years, goes off to TNA and cuts the same promo every week in his dull monotonous voice starting with 'It's like this' and ending with his dreadful catchphrase 'If you don't know....now you know.' and he just came off as a cheap indy attempt to be a main eventer and looked out of place in the main event scene even at TNA. Another point, and I've brought this up before and been flamed for it, he's never been very over. He gets light pops you'd expect a midcard face like a Kofi Kingston or Sin Cara to get and he recieves the bare minimum heat when he's a heel and that can be attributed to WWE not giving a reason to care about him, or the fans for not being loud generally, but some of the blame has to go to Christian not being interesting or talented enough to sustain a reaction. Finally, that video posted of his title winning promo. Again there's nothing truly special about it to me. It just feels like everything he says is forced and feels like he's reading off a script and not believing any of what he's saying, even if it does mean a lot to him which I'm sure it does in this case. It's just something about the way he cuts promos has always really rubbed me, especially when compared with Edge who's just so natural on the mic.
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Post by maximilian on Dec 29, 2012 19:29:49 GMT -5
The shoulder injury sounded like something he could/would have worked through if he were at all important, so I'm not sure he's injury-prone. I know he's in his late 30s now, but until the torn pec a couple years back, he'd sustained only one major injury that required any time off in the previous 12 years of his career (his back in '04).
Anyway, I no longer care enough to argue with his detractors about the guy's worth (and I suspect many would change their tune if he weren't so underutilized), but age/injuries never stopped WWE from pushing Edge, Orton, Batista, Hunter, Michaels, et al. His problem will be what it's always been: a lack of support from the right people backstage. Simple as that.
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Legion
Fry's dog Seymour
Amy Pond's #1 fan
Hail Hydra!
Posts: 22,700
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Post by Legion on Dec 29, 2012 19:47:50 GMT -5
The shoulder injury sounded like something he could/would have worked through if he were at all important, so I'm not sure he's injury-prone. I know he's in his late 30s now, but until the torn pec a couple years back, he'd sustained only one major injury that required any time off in the previous 12 years of his career (his back in '04). Anyway, I no longer care enough to argue with his detractors about the guy's worth (and I suspect many would change their tune if he weren't so underutilized), but age/injuries never stopped WWE from pushing Edge, Orton, Batista, Hunter, Michaels, et al. His problem will be what it's always been: a lack of support from the right people backstage. Simple as that. A lack of support from people who have given him a chance and seen that he didnt have the same appeal as his tag team partners. WWE brain trust dont always get things right, but in this case, they do appear to have
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Post by joebob27 on Dec 29, 2012 19:49:26 GMT -5
What opportunity on 2004-05? LOL.
The feud with Jericho was probably booked by Jericho himself. Then his big ME spot they inserted Jericho and ignored that the crowds were starting to side with Christian. He was in the same spot that Ziggler is in now, where if they want to make him, they can. If they don't, the window will close.
It's moot now and he shouldn't be booked based on how he should have been booked 7 years ago with a different persona, but they dropped the ball with him badly. They were actually creating main event guys back then, so it wasn't a big deal, but still...
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Post by maximilian on Dec 29, 2012 20:17:42 GMT -5
A lack of support from people who have given him a chance and seen that he didnt have the same appeal as his tag team partners. Edge was the more protected and pushed of the two because he had the better look, especially early on. He pretty much always had the WWE machine behind him, while his former partner was jobbed out whenever he started gaining too much momentum ('05, '10, '11) because he hadn't been chosen to be a star. Christian was the better of the two at every aspect of pro wrestling, but the company's booking and masterful marketing and presentation have convinced many otherwise.
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Post by lewis1711 on Dec 29, 2012 20:21:52 GMT -5
Anyway, I no longer care enough to argue with his detractors about the guy's worth (and I suspect many would change their tune if he weren't so underutilized) 100% this. Like how batshit crazy the board went over Mark Henry after his push. Or David Otunga. Or even Jinder Mahal. I think we all forget how much of a mark we are deep down inside and how the WWE machine has a huge role in deciding who we like or not.
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