Nikki Heyman
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Post by Nikki Heyman on Jan 16, 2013 22:06:45 GMT -5
see, I just fail to see how it would make her a Mary Sue. Princesses' "personal" student Babysitter is another alicorn when she has parents of her own. baby dragonPersonal Assistant Brother: Captain of the Royal Guard Everybody talking about how great she is Every two parter is focused around her Now becoming a rare deity being And that's NOT a Mary Sue!? Not to mention that while yes her talent IS magic, it's one of the broadest "abilities" in the entire series. I'm not hating on Twilight, either.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2013 22:07:44 GMT -5
see, I just fail to see how it would make her a Mary Sue. Princesses' "personal" student Babysitter is another alicorn when she has parents of her own. Personal Assistant Brother Captain of the Royal Guard Everybody talking about how great she is Every two parter is focused around her Now becoming a rare deity being And that's NOT a Mary Sue!? that is not what my understanding of what a Mary Sue is, but then again I'm probably just an idiot.
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Nikki Heyman
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Post by Nikki Heyman on Jan 16, 2013 22:11:17 GMT -5
Twilight isn't a fanfic character, of course, but she does seem to have quite a bit going for her. Turning her into an alicorn would be a little over the top if added to RC's list.
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Eunös ✈
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Post by Eunös ✈ on Jan 16, 2013 22:13:09 GMT -5
Sisterhooves Social Family Appreciation Day Putting Your Hoof Down Sleepless in Ponyville Apple Family Reunion ![:)](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/smiley.png)
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2013 22:15:21 GMT -5
![](http://i.imgur.com/uXYvT.jpg) Referring to ![](http://i.imgur.com/6JOMb.jpg)
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2013 22:15:45 GMT -5
Princesses' "personal" student Babysitter is another alicorn when she has parents of her own. Personal Assistant Brother Captain of the Royal Guard Everybody talking about how great she is Every two parter is focused around her Now becoming a rare deity being And that's NOT a Mary Sue!? that is not what my understanding of what a Mary Sue is, but then again I'm probably just an idiot. Then please tell me, what is?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2013 22:18:52 GMT -5
Here is a paragraph from TVTropes on Mary Sue: The prototypical Mary Sue is an original female character in a fanfic who obviously serves as an idealized version of the author mainly for the purpose of Wish Fulfillment. She's exotically beautiful, often having an unusual hair or eye color, and has a similarly cool and exotic name. She's exceptionally talented in an implausibly wide variety of areas, and may possess skills that are rare or nonexistent in the canon setting. She also lacks any realistic, or at least story-relevant, character flaws — either that or her "flaws" are obviously meant to be endearing.
She has an unusual and dramatic Back Story. The canon protagonists are all overwhelmed with admiration for her beauty, wit, courage and other virtues, and are quick to adopt her as one of their True Companions, even characters who are usually antisocial and untrusting; if any character doesn't love her, that character gets an extremely unsympathetic portrayal. She has some sort of especially close relationship to the author's favorite canon character — their love interest, illegitimate child, never-before-mentioned sister, etc. Other than that, the canon characters are quickly reduced to awestruck cheerleaders, watching from the sidelines as Mary Sue outstrips them in their areas of expertise and solves problems that have stymied them for the entire series. (See Common Mary Sue Traits for more detail on any of these cliches.)
In other words, the term "Mary Sue" is generally slapped on a character who is important in the story, possesses unusual physical traits, and has an irrelevantly over-skilled or over-idealized nature. You be the judge: Does this explain Twilight?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2013 22:19:26 GMT -5
that is not what my understanding of what a Mary Sue is, but then again I'm probably just an idiot. Then please tell me, what is? Everything I've ever read says a Mary Sue is a character largely based on the creator. Basically a self-insert.
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Nikki Heyman
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Post by Nikki Heyman on Jan 16, 2013 22:23:15 GMT -5
Sisterhooves Social Family Appreciation Day Putting Your Hoof Down Sleepless in Ponyville Apple Family Reunion ![:)](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/smiley.png) May the best Pet win! Wonderbolt Academy ![:)](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/smiley.png)
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Lupin the Third
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Post by Lupin the Third on Jan 16, 2013 22:39:10 GMT -5
Holy crap. Went to Team Four Star's page, and Kaiser said that Takahata 101 trained under Cathy Wesluck. That's right. Spike trained Nappa.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2013 22:42:40 GMT -5
Then please tell me, what is? Everything I've ever read says a Mary Sue is a character largely based on the creator. Basically a self-insert. That's only one definition. And if we are using TV Tropes: CANON SUE:
1.A Possession Sue. It's more frequently referred to as Canon Sue, but it has its own article. 2. A professional work in which a canonical character already has the attributes of a Mary Sue.Twilight possesses a lot of the above mentioned, and now becoming an alicorn is just the icing on the cake.
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Rumble McSkirmish
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Post by Rumble McSkirmish on Jan 16, 2013 22:45:10 GMT -5
Here is a paragraph from TVTropes on Mary Sue: The prototypical Mary Sue is an original female character in a fanfic who obviously serves as an idealized version of the author mainly for the purpose of Wish Fulfillment. She's exotically beautiful, often having an unusual hair or eye color, and has a similarly cool and exotic name. She's exceptionally talented in an implausibly wide variety of areas, and may possess skills that are rare or nonexistent in the canon setting. She also lacks any realistic, or at least story-relevant, character flaws — either that or her "flaws" are obviously meant to be endearing.
She has an unusual and dramatic Back Story. The canon protagonists are all overwhelmed with admiration for her beauty, wit, courage and other virtues, and are quick to adopt her as one of their True Companions, even characters who are usually antisocial and untrusting; if any character doesn't love her, that character gets an extremely unsympathetic portrayal. She has some sort of especially close relationship to the author's favorite canon character — their love interest, illegitimate child, never-before-mentioned sister, etc. Other than that, the canon characters are quickly reduced to awestruck cheerleaders, watching from the sidelines as Mary Sue outstrips them in their areas of expertise and solves problems that have stymied them for the entire series. (See Common Mary Sue Traits for more detail on any of these cliches.)
In other words, the term "Mary Sue" is generally slapped on a character who is important in the story, possesses unusual physical traits, and has an irrelevantly over-skilled or over-idealized nature. You be the judge: Does this explain Twilight? Not in the slightest, in fact there has been many times throughout the course of the series where Twilight has made several errors in judgement because she got overwhelmed by the situation at hand. Be it a comedic situation (IE Lesson Zero or Swarm of the Century) or a dramatic one (IE Return to Harmony Pt2 or Crystal Empire Pt2) just to name a few. And in some cases (The Pilot for example) it wasn't her friends that depended on her to get them through the danger, she had to depend on them. In fact there isn't anyone in the series that could be considered for Mary Sue hood, even Celestia a "demi god" found herself on the receiving end of a rump kicking at the hands of the Changeling Queen.
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Krazee
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Post by Krazee on Jan 16, 2013 22:46:24 GMT -5
but Twlight has flaws, "Mary Sues" are supposed to be flawless
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Post by Koda, Master Crunchyroller on Jan 16, 2013 22:49:52 GMT -5
Mary Sues/Canon Sues CAN have flaws, still doesn't stop them from being Sues.
Case in point Alice from the Resident Evil films has flaws but I'll be damned if you can tell me with a straight face that she isn't a Canon Sue.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2013 22:51:06 GMT -5
but Twlight has flaws, "Mary Sues" are supposed to be flawless This so much. That's why Nyx ruins Past Sins. She is flawless and is also a self-insert.
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Rumble McSkirmish
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Post by Rumble McSkirmish on Jan 16, 2013 22:53:53 GMT -5
Mary Sues/Canon Sues CAN have flaws, still doesn't stop them from being Sues. Case in point Alice from the Resident Evil films has flaws but I'll be damned if you can tell me with a straight face that she isn't a Canon Sue. But the actress also happens to be the wife of the director of the films so that pretty much explains that.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2013 23:03:22 GMT -5
but Twlight has flaws, "Mary Sues" are supposed to be flawless This so much. That's why Nyx ruins Past Sins. She is flawless and is also a self-insert. Self-Insert? Are you serious!?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2013 23:04:48 GMT -5
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Lupin the Third
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Post by Lupin the Third on Jan 16, 2013 23:04:54 GMT -5
Jesus, I made a Dragonball Z joke about Twilight going Alicorn/Super Saiyan 2, and I spawn a whole couple pages of discussion.
I didn't know I had this kind of power.
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Lupin the Third
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I'm sorry.....I love you. *boot to the head*--3rd most culpable in the jixing of NXT, D'oh!
Join the Dark Order....
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Post by Lupin the Third on Jan 16, 2013 23:05:29 GMT -5
Also, final show of WWE 13 before the Royal Rumble on the other forum.
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