Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Mar 23, 2021 14:24:30 GMT -5
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Johnny B. Decent
Patti Mayonnaise
Had one once
Everybody's Favorite Arizonian.
Posts: 31,077
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Post by Johnny B. Decent on Mar 23, 2021 14:34:09 GMT -5
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Post by A Platypus Rave on Mar 23, 2021 14:36:16 GMT -5
This is god damned exhausting.
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Post by Alice Syndrome on Mar 23, 2021 15:09:04 GMT -5
Dear internet personalities:
Stop having parasocial relationships with fans.
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Toates Madhackrviper
King Koopa
Is owed an Admin life-debt.
This avatar is so far out of date I might as well stick with it forever now.
Posts: 10,723
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Post by Toates Madhackrviper on Mar 23, 2021 16:44:49 GMT -5
Its as simple as this: If you have a creative platform of any kind, do not f*** your fans. There is an inherent power imbalance that is difficult to impossible to overcome. The only scenario where it might work is if you form a friendship with the person you initially meet as a fan and become peers through extended interactions over time. But meeting up with fans a decade younger than you (normally I don't give a f*** about age gaps between consenting adults, but in this scenario it adds to the power imbalance) just to f*** them and then ghost them, that's predatory behavior. Not technically illegal, and I'm not sure a law against it *should* exist because it would be sketchy as f*** to enforce, but definitely condemnable. The subreddit is already clearing him of all wrongdoing. But the fact is, he has *confessed* to f***ing this fan now: www.gamerevolution.com/news/677141-game-grumps-dan-avidan-responds-allegations-apologyThat is unethical behavior. That is condemnable. Even if the fan is of age, even if you're not technically doing anything illegal. It is a bad thing to do. My feeling right now is that this will end up blowing over and not even hurting the Grumps. It'll be written off as "two people had sex" because apparently the part about her being underage when they met isn't substantiated or something. Arin won't drop Dan unless things escalate from here or more accusers come forward.
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Bobeddy
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Made a Terrible Mistake
Posts: 15,155
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Post by Bobeddy on Mar 24, 2021 4:13:40 GMT -5
Dear internet personalities: Stop having parasocial relationships with fans. The definition of a parasocial relationship is that it's a one-sided feeling of friendship on the part of the viewer, where by viewing the creator's content over time the viewer falsely builds up the idea of being friends with the creator. The only way that a creator can stop people having parasocial relationships with them is to not release any work at all, or to put in a disclaimer at the start of every piece saying "I am not your friend, I am a stranger. You are my audience, that is it"....which probably wouldn't work anyway.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Mar 24, 2021 4:22:01 GMT -5
I just don't care that much that adults are having sex with each other that parties are regretting afterward. I don't think its inherently predatory to have sex with people and then not pursue relationships, or even to not want the same level of emotional commitment from them.
This is absolutely none of my business.
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Post by HMARK Center on Mar 24, 2021 16:17:52 GMT -5
Yeah, I'm sorry, as long as everyone involved is of-age and consenting then I just can't see anything "predatory" at play here.
It's a positive thing that we're at a place culturally where people are having more serious conversations about consent, power imbalances, and exploitation in sexual/romantic situations; MeToo was something that was years overdue, and there's still miles to go before we're at a socially healthy place on a lot of these matters.
But when we're talking about power dynamics I can't equate this with, say, a boss-employee situation or a teacher-student one: those are situations where the power dynamics at play involve not only the physical aspects of a potential coupling, but additional considerations like pay, grades, or work/study environments and the overall safety therein.
These aren't really factors in a situation where a fan wants to sleep with an artist/athlete/content creator/public figure they like. Yes, the public figure has greater notoriety, but they can't hold material advancement or the threat of withheld benefits (ranging, again, from money to literal safety) over the fan. It's not to say they could never manipulate fans: a public figure intentionally taking advantage of someone who's clearly built a parasocial mindset, or misleading a fan into thinking they'll be in a relationship while just using them for sex, is obviously wrong. It's wrong for anyone to do that, of course, but yes, a public figure likely has more access to people who could be in that kind of mindset, and should be aware of that.
Nevertheless, to me the idea that a public figure can't sleep with an adult fan comes too close to acting as if said adult fan lacks agency, or that sheer force of celebrity (however minor) causes people to give up their ability to say no or make an informed decision. If a consenting adult want to sleep with someone they're a fan of, it's their right; if the person they're sleeping with isn't looking for something serious and just wants to fool around, that's their right, as well. Again, as long as nobody's been abused or manipulated then it's really none of our business.
In the end, just about any potential sexual/romantic situation carries a power dynamic that has to be navigated: one partner can be physically stronger, wealthier, more socially well-connected than another, etc. Navigating such dynamics is part of navigating relationships, in general, and while "public figure and fan" is one where the gap can be seen as a bit bigger, there's nothing about it that's unnavigable if nobody's being an abuser.
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Spider2024
Patti Mayonnaise
Dedicated 6,666th post to Irontyger
I believe in Joe Hendry.
Posts: 39,289
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Post by Spider2024 on Mar 24, 2021 16:37:35 GMT -5
This whole thing is a very complicated issue.
Thing is, the term "grooming" is very ugly and would be very bad to label anyone with, so I wonder how much this can be considered "grooming". I don't thing Danny should be "cancelled" as a groomer, considering the first time he talked to her about a sexual relationship was when she was over 18.
But don't get me wrong, Danny is a skeez and an a-hole for deciding to 'hit it and quit it' with her. I don't blame her at all for feeling used and betrayed and feel like he only wanted her for sex.
I think something good will come out of this, in that after this revelation, fans of Danny will be far less likely to hook up with him. In the 80's, these kind of rock star hook ups wouldn't even bat an eye. It ain't like that anymore, and I hope Danny fully realizes that.
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Allie Kitsune
Crow T. Robot
Always Feelin' Foxy.
HaHa U FaLL 4 LaVa TriK
Posts: 46,168
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Post by Allie Kitsune on Mar 24, 2021 16:50:12 GMT -5
This whole thing is a very complicated issue. Thing is, the term "grooming" is very ugly and would be very bad to label anyone with, so I wonder how much this can be considered "grooming". I don't thing Danny should be "cancelled" as a groomer, considering the first time he talked to her about a sexual relationship was when she was over 18. But don't get me wrong, Danny is a skeez and an a-hole for deciding to 'hit it and quit it' with her. I don't blame her at all for feeling used and betrayed and feel like he only wanted her for sex. I think something good will come out of this, in that after this revelation, fans of Danny will be far less likely to hook up with him. In the 80's, these kind of rock star hook ups wouldn't even bat an eye. It ain't like that anymore, and I hope Danny fully realizes that. I'd say "or at the very least, make it absolutely clear what you're after when a fan wants to hook up with you." (to clarify : I mean tell them in no uncertain terms that you are NOT looking for a lasting relationship, AHEAD OF TIME), but honestly, I think it's really too much of a minefield for a public figure.
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