So, the Wyatts vs. Punk/Bryan/???

[thegame415]

Zomg Bryan is buried and din.!!!

[Deleted]

Oct 28, 2013 22:58:47 GMT -5 Friday Night SmackOwn said:

Oct 28, 2013 22:52:22 GMT -5 @akeem said:

Seems like they're building to a Survivor Series match of Kane and the Wyatt's vs Punk/Bryan/Miz/?

/Cue "GONG!" and the return of the Undertaker/

Would be cool, but I don't think he's healed yet.

[papagiorgio]

Oct 28, 2013 22:52:22 GMT -5 @akeem said:

Seems like they're building to a Survivor Series match of Kane and the Wyatt's vs Punk/Bryan/Miz/?

That's what I was thinking with Kofi in the fourth spot. I figure Cena vs. Del Rio and Show vs. Orton will be the top two matches of the card.

[Deleted]

Answer to the??? in the title - WADE BARRETT.

Now, hear me out. We've basically got a blank spot for a face Barrett to return to take on the Wyatt's in a mega-Nexus reunion.

Wyatt, Punk, Bryan all have that connective element having been a part of various incarnations of Nexus - the best way to elevate this feud is to bring in the original leader.

[saintpat]

Oct 28, 2013 22:12:36 GMT -5 CATCH_US IS the Conversation said:

Why does WWE insist on trying to make everyone a big deal fairly quick?

If they go more than three weeks with someone on the midcard or below NOT becoming a big deal fairly quickly, check the reaction on this forum.

"I'm tired of seeing Ryback squash people. Get it over with. Move on."

There were threads sayng the Wyatts were treading water after a couple of weeks.

WWE can't win -- if they make someone important quickly, "all those poor deserving Superstars who have been around longer are getting screwed" or "they're doing this too fast, give it time." And if they give it time, the guaranteed microwave society reaction is "This is getting old quick. I'm already bored with it. Move on."

Which do you prefer? How could they do the Wyatts more slowly and maintain your interest?

[CATCH_US IS the Conversation]

Oct 29, 2013 0:20:31 GMT -5 saintpat said:

Oct 28, 2013 22:12:36 GMT -5 CATCH_US IS the Conversation said:

Why does WWE insist on trying to make everyone a big deal fairly quick?

If they go more than three weeks with someone on the midcard or below NOT becoming a big deal fairly quickly, check the reaction on this forum.

"I'm tired of seeing Ryback squash people. Get it over with. Move on."

There were threads sayng the Wyatts were treading water after a couple of weeks.

WWE can't win -- if they make someone important quickly, "all those poor deserving Superstars who have been around longer are getting screwed" or "they're doing this too fast, give it time." And if they give it time, the guaranteed microwave society reaction is "This is getting old quick. I'm already bored with it. Move on."

Which do you prefer? How could they do the Wyatts more slowly and maintain your interest?

But new guys don't HAVE to do squash matches. Maybe they could actually feud with the people they're having squash matches with instead.

The Wyatts WERE treading water, because once Kane disappeared, there weren't any "top guys" left for them to work with because so many people were taking time off. Miz was pulled out of the Best For Business story SPECIFICALLY so that Wyatt could feud with a "top guy".

I understand why Punk may need to feud with the Wyatts because Punk has already cemented his "legacy" with the Pipebomb and 434 Days. He has already "peaked" and probably does need to take a step back, but Bryan does not and this is an unnecessary derailment of his momentum all for the sake of making some newbies into "big deals fairly quick".

Instead of squashing Tons of Funk every other week, Rowan and Harper could be feuding with them. The four of them are solid big man workers who could put on a better match if given time. Why not let them feud with the PTPs so that their face turn actually amounts to something? Why isn't Bray Wyatt cutting these same promos against Justin Gabriel or R-Truth? There are so many guys on the roster that the Wyatts could be working with but instead are just being wasted as jobbers or non entities.

I've said it before, but the roster is way too top heavy. There are too many people being presented as "main eventers". WWE should stop thinking in terms of making "stars", and think more about getting people over from top to bottom.

[saintpat]

Oct 29, 2013 0:32:20 GMT -5 CATCH_US IS the Conversation said:

Oct 29, 2013 0:20:31 GMT -5 saintpat said:

If they go more than three weeks with someone on the midcard or below NOT becoming a big deal fairly quickly, check the reaction on this forum.

"I'm tired of seeing Ryback squash people. Get it over with. Move on."

There were threads sayng the Wyatts were treading water after a couple of weeks.

WWE can't win -- if they make someone important quickly, "all those poor deserving Superstars who have been around longer are getting screwed" or "they're doing this too fast, give it time." And if they give it time, the guaranteed microwave society reaction is "This is getting old quick. I'm already bored with it. Move on."

Which do you prefer? How could they do the Wyatts more slowly and maintain your interest?

But new guys don't HAVE to do squash matches. Maybe they could actually feud with the people they're having squash matches with instead.

The Wyatts WERE treading water, because once Kane disappeared, there weren't any "top guys" left for them to work with because so many people were taking time off. Miz was pulled out of the Best For Business story SPECIFICALLY so that Wyatt could feud with a "top guy".

I understand why Punk may need to feud with the Wyatts because Punk has already cemented his "legacy" with the Pipebomb and 434 Days. He has already "peaked" and probably does need to take a step back, but Bryan does not and this is an unnecessary derailment of his momentum all for the sake of making some newbies into "big deals fairly quick".

Instead of squashing Tons of Funk every other week, Rowan and Harper could be feuding with them. The four of them are solid big man workers who could put on a better match if given time. Why not let them feud with the PTPs so that their face turn actually amounts to something? Why isn't Bray Wyatt cutting these same promos against Justin Gabriel or R-Truth? There are so many guys on the roster that the Wyatts could be working with but instead are just being wasted as jobbers or non entities.

I've said it before, but the roster is way too top heavy. There are too many people being presented as "main eventers". WWE should stop thinking in terms of making "stars", and think more about getting people over from top to bottom.

My reasoning on that is this: if they debut as some freaky, backwoods, mysterious cult and get into a feud with the jobber/enhancement portion of the roster, they will never be taken seriously. If they win four out of six against Tons of Funk -- a comedy jobber team -- who's going to consider them a threat to The Miz or Punk or anyone else later on?

I think they need to be established first. And I think that's what is happening.

I do like this, with the Shield and with the Wyatts -- we seem, for now, to be past the days when an uppercarder would go one-on-three in a free-for-all and win with seeming ease. The numbers game, really since the Nexus, has been portrayed much more realistically, where no matter what you thought of the gang of baddies they still have a numbers advantage and one guy (or even two often) cannot just kick their tails.

Compare that to the Spirit Squad, where it seemed Triple H (or Orton or Shawn or whoever) could read a newspaper while beating them all with one hand.

[CATCH_US IS the Conversation]

Oct 29, 2013 0:43:58 GMT -5 saintpat said:

Oct 29, 2013 0:32:20 GMT -5 CATCH_US IS the Conversation said:

But new guys don't HAVE to do squash matches. Maybe they could actually feud with the people they're having squash matches with instead.

The Wyatts WERE treading water, because once Kane disappeared, there weren't any "top guys" left for them to work with because so many people were taking time off. Miz was pulled out of the Best For Business story SPECIFICALLY so that Wyatt could feud with a "top guy".

I understand why Punk may need to feud with the Wyatts because Punk has already cemented his "legacy" with the Pipebomb and 434 Days. He has already "peaked" and probably does need to take a step back, but Bryan does not and this is an unnecessary derailment of his momentum all for the sake of making some newbies into "big deals fairly quick".

Instead of squashing Tons of Funk every other week, Rowan and Harper could be feuding with them. The four of them are solid big man workers who could put on a better match if given time. Why not let them feud with the PTPs so that their face turn actually amounts to something? Why isn't Bray Wyatt cutting these same promos against Justin Gabriel or R-Truth? There are so many guys on the roster that the Wyatts could be working with but instead are just being wasted as jobbers or non entities.

I've said it before, but the roster is way too top heavy. There are too many people being presented as "main eventers". WWE should stop thinking in terms of making "stars", and think more about getting people over from top to bottom.

My reasoning on that is this: if they debut as some freaky, backwoods, mysterious cult and get into a feud with the jobber/enhancement portion of the roster, they will never be taken seriously. If they win four out of six against Tons of Funk -- a comedy jobber team -- who's going to consider them a threat to The Miz or Punk or anyone else later on?

I think they need to be established first. And I think that's what is happening.

I do like this, with the Shield and with the Wyatts -- we seem, for now, to be past the days when an uppercarder would go one-on-three in a free-for-all and win with seeming ease. The numbers game, really since the Nexus, has been portrayed much more realistically, where no matter what you thought of the gang of baddies they still have a numbers advantage and one guy (or even two often) cannot just kick their tails.

Compare that to the Spirit Squad, where it seemed Triple H (or Orton or Shawn or whoever) could read a newspaper while beating them all with one hand.

Maybe if those guys were booked a little stronger and treated as if they mattered, maybe they won't be seen as "the jobber/enhancement portion of the roster". There are too many guys who aren't being used properly. No wrestler should be made to look useless

Sure the Wyatts need to be "established", That makes sense. But then if they go from feuding with Punk/Bryan to feuding with the Usos, people will just complain about "how hard they've fallen" and we'd get "Remember when the Wyatt Family Used To Be A Thing?" threads. It's just completely backwards to push guys at the top of the card and then send them DOWN once they've run through everyone. They should be working their way UP.

[saintpat]

Oct 29, 2013 0:55:30 GMT -5 CATCH_US IS the Conversation said:

Oct 29, 2013 0:43:58 GMT -5 saintpat said:

My reasoning on that is this: if they debut as some freaky, backwoods, mysterious cult and get into a feud with the jobber/enhancement portion of the roster, they will never be taken seriously. If they win four out of six against Tons of Funk -- a comedy jobber team -- who's going to consider them a threat to The Miz or Punk or anyone else later on?

I think they need to be established first. And I think that's what is happening.

I do like this, with the Shield and with the Wyatts -- we seem, for now, to be past the days when an uppercarder would go one-on-three in a free-for-all and win with seeming ease. The numbers game, really since the Nexus, has been portrayed much more realistically, where no matter what you thought of the gang of baddies they still have a numbers advantage and one guy (or even two often) cannot just kick their tails.

Compare that to the Spirit Squad, where it seemed Triple H (or Orton or Shawn or whoever) could read a newspaper while beating them all with one hand.

Maybe if those guys were booked a little stronger and treated as if they mattered, maybe they won't be seen as "the jobber/enhancement portion of the roster". There are too many guys who aren't being used properly. No wrestler should be made to look useless

Sure the Wyatts need to be "established", That makes sense. But then if they go from feuding with Punk/Bryan to feuding with the Usos, people will just complain about "how hard they've fallen" and we'd get "Remember when the Wyatt Family Used To Be A Thing?" threads. It's just completely backwards to push guys at the top of the card and then send them DOWN once they've run through everyone. They should be working their way UP.

But they did -- they didn't start with Punk and Bryan, they established themselves first.

If you want to start from scratch, that's a different matter in a vacuum. But the fact is there are tiers to the card -- the jobber/enhancement guys, the lower midcard, the midcard, the upper midcard/lower main event guys and the main event (or however you want to label them). A new talent comes in and does what you suggest, like Cesaro, generally gets some props and some pop (or heat) and if he stays there more than three weeks people lose interest (as they did in Cesaro as an evolving singles guy).

I think once a talent (or group) establishes that they can compete with the upper half of the roster, they can move up and down.

Yes, the IWC (or at least some people who discuss wrestling on message boards) are going to complain -- heck, the overwhelming opinion was that CM Punk needed to be a babyface and Orton needed to be a heel, and both happened ... and now people are complaining about it. But WWE can't book to some ideal that's going to make "the internet" happy because it is an impossible mission.

The Wyatts are new and fresh and their storyline has grown. I like it. I like the fact that no one seems safe and what they are doing (or who they are doing it to) seems random enough that I want to see where its going. I think it is an example of booking and character development done well.

[Hobby Drifter]

Building to Kane/Wyatts/Orton vs Punk/Miz/Bryan/Usos at Survivor Series?

[celticjobber]

Maybe AJ Lee is the "devil" who made Bray do it?

[Professor Chaos]

I really don't get it. I respect Bryan as a wrestler but he doesn't do it for me as the face of the company. I expected Punk to come out and interrupt Randy's coronation party tonight. Bryan and Punk will make for a hell of a tag team, but totally wasted on two stiffs like Rowan and Harper while for some reason in 2013 Big Show is in the Main Event.

[JCBaggee]

We'll find out the Wyatts were ordered by Triple H to attack Bryan after he hurt Trips' best friend, so it'll all still lead to the same thing. I'd expect the Bryan/Orton feud to be the background event at Survivor Series...maybe have Orton face Big Show and retain due to shenanigans...and then Bryan and Orton's blow-off at TLC, with whoever wins the title then position to run headfirst into the Royal Rumble and the Road to Wrestlemania.

I'm now saying whoever because as much as Bryan deserves an actual reign, I'm seriously starting to think WWE have no interest in doing it.

[Sparkybob]

Oct 29, 2013 0:32:20 GMT -5 CATCH_US IS the Conversation said:

Oct 29, 2013 0:20:31 GMT -5 saintpat said:

If they go more than three weeks with someone on the midcard or below NOT becoming a big deal fairly quickly, check the reaction on this forum.

"I'm tired of seeing Ryback squash people. Get it over with. Move on."

There were threads sayng the Wyatts were treading water after a couple of weeks.

WWE can't win -- if they make someone important quickly, "all those poor deserving Superstars who have been around longer are getting screwed" or "they're doing this too fast, give it time." And if they give it time, the guaranteed microwave society reaction is "This is getting old quick. I'm already bored with it. Move on."

Which do you prefer? How could they do the Wyatts more slowly and maintain your interest?

I understand why Punk may need to feud with the Wyatts because Punk has already cemented his "legacy" with the Pipebomb and 434 Days. He has already "peaked" and probably does need to take a step back, but Bryan does not and this is an unnecessary derailment of his momentum all for the sake of making some newbies into "big deals fairly quick".

Is D-bryan's overness so fragile that even a hint of him not being in the top top of the card will destroy his support? I highly doubt that.

["Magic" Mark Hurr]

Ya know, I'm cool with this. Bryan and Punks offense works extremely well in bigs who can take the punishment and them being outnumbered means that it should be wall to wall action.

I don't know what the big picture with this angle is so I'll give it a chance.
It makes the Wyatts look good if they can sharpen up their purpose for existing and Punk needs to be far away from Axel and Ryback.

I'm not fastening the chin-strap on my "Let's see how this on plays out" helmet, but I am a bit intrigued.

[angryfan]

I think working with D-Bry and Punk can do a world of good for the Wyatt Family. It will help the stable that, while Bray's promos are good, could use some work overall in terms of in ring stuff.

I can see the booking standpoint of "We know you guys both sell well, we're in a holding pattern for a few reasons, can you guys work with them, help make them look good and have some good back and forth mic work?".

However, looking purely at the D-Bry situation, is now the right time to pull back?

No.

You have someone who is white hot, as he was when he faced Cena. You strike and you make it matter. They did when Cena put him over clean and the crowd ate it up. We can all agree on that, I think.

Thing is, then you water it down, you bring in Trips and Steph, Orton, the Shield, and Big show. So you've got one guy who is just as hot as he's ever been so you start hooking other cars to the train?

That'd be like Cena beating Bradshaw for the title, and the very next night we get the reunited Facgime with the rest of Evolution, Orton back in the fold and all.

Does the "one guy establishing himself and proving himself" has as much meaning when the storyline is now 6 on 1 and the guy who was originaly involved gets replaced by, let's say, Edge in the 2005 example?

The point isn't about D-Bry, really, it's about establishing anyone without shoe horning in "past stars". The Shield are getting more of a rub out of this angle, and they have spent a year establishing themselves.

[Deleted]

Oct 29, 2013 1:05:21 GMT -5 saintpat said:

Oct 29, 2013 0:55:30 GMT -5 CATCH_US IS the Conversation said:

Maybe if those guys were booked a little stronger and treated as if they mattered, maybe they won't be seen as "the jobber/enhancement portion of the roster". There are too many guys who aren't being used properly. No wrestler should be made to look useless

Sure the Wyatts need to be "established", That makes sense. But then if they go from feuding with Punk/Bryan to feuding with the Usos, people will just complain about "how hard they've fallen" and we'd get "Remember when the Wyatt Family Used To Be A Thing?" threads. It's just completely backwards to push guys at the top of the card and then send them DOWN once they've run through everyone. They should be working their way UP.

But they did -- they didn't start with Punk and Bryan, they established themselves first.

If you want to start from scratch, that's a different matter in a vacuum. But the fact is there are tiers to the card -- the jobber/enhancement guys, the lower midcard, the midcard, the upper midcard/lower main event guys and the main event (or however you want to label them). A new talent comes in and does what you suggest, like Cesaro, generally gets some props and some pop (or heat) and if he stays there more than three weeks people lose interest (as they did in Cesaro as an evolving singles guy).

I think once a talent (or group) establishes that they can compete with the upper half of the roster, they can move up and down.

Yes, the IWC (or at least some people who discuss wrestling on message boards) are going to complain -- heck, the overwhelming opinion was that CM Punk needed to be a babyface and Orton needed to be a heel, and both happened ... and now people are complaining about it. But WWE can't book to some ideal that's going to make "the internet" happy because it is an impossible mission.

The Wyatts are new and fresh and their storyline has grown. I like it. I like the fact that no one seems safe and what they are doing (or who they are doing it to) seems random enough that I want to see where its going. I think it is an example of booking and character development done well.

I think the moral of the story of this:

No matter what, someone will complain. They're not going to make everyone happy. People aren't wrong for complaining either, people should be honest about their opinions and express them as they see fit.

So, whatever they're doing, they can't base it on "well but if we do this people will complain, but if we do that people will complain too!". Tell the story you want to tell, it'll all shake out in the end.

[Sephiroth]

Punk and Bryan need to back Mike Know as their partner and make this the ultimate battle of the beards.

[GuyOfOwnage]

Oct 29, 2013 15:18:14 GMT -5 Sephiroth said:

Punk and Bryan need to back Mike Know as their partner and make this the ultimate battle of the beards.

Mike Know - the bastard child of Mike Knox and Damien Sandow?

[Manute Bol]

Oct 28, 2013 22:52:22 GMT -5 @akeem said:

Seems like they're building to a Survivor Series match of Kane and the Wyatt's vs Punk/Bryan/Miz/?

Since Kane's going to be Stephanie's monster now I'm thinking the traditional Survivor Series match will be The Big Show, Cody Rhodes, Goldust & The Usos vs. Randy Orton, Kane & The Shield.

What's Bray Wyatt's injury status? Is it possible they just go with Punk & Bryan vs. Harper & Rowan?