fw91
Patti Mayonnaise
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Post by fw91 on Aug 31, 2014 12:06:25 GMT -5
HBK in 05 was only heel for the Hogan feud, hell the night after Summerslam they pretty much dismissed the whole thing, from ever happening
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A damn road sign
Samurai Cop
"What the hell am I? A school crossing?"
Posts: 2,424
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Post by A damn road sign on Aug 31, 2014 12:08:04 GMT -5
Edge's WWE Title rematch from the Royal Rumble against Cena on RAW in early 2006. Cena has Edge in the F-U and Lita runs in and clocks Edge with the title belt, getting Cena disqualified and costing Edge the chance to win his championship back. Edge is confused, Cena's confused, the audience is confused, the commentators are confused, and Lita leaves up the ramp with kind of a, "Yep, I'm not sorry" look on her face. Nothing was really made of it the following week, psycho crazy Edge at his peak wasn't even mad that his girlfriend had cost him a title match, and normal service was resumed. Yep, not sure what the deal was there.
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CH Punk
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Post by CH Punk on Aug 31, 2014 12:22:51 GMT -5
Can we stop pretending Face Del Rio was never over? Alberto Del Rio vs. Casually racist, asshole Big Show in a cartoon feud that involved fighting in a hotel? Awesome and over with pretty much everyone. Alberto Del Rio vs. Aggressively racist, xenophobic Jack Swagger (who had only just returned) in a serious feud about current political situations (yet the attacked face responds to his opponent by base level mocking via impersonations) while Dolph Ziggler's popularity is only growing as he's spinning his wheels? Apathy inducing and a bad sign on things to come. Alberto Del Rio vs. Returning from a concussion Dolph Ziggler in a smark hotbed? Face Del Rio died a death. Ultimately, Del Rio could have been over as a face, but a bad feud that lasted WAY too long and then having to face a guy people loved was horrible a completely killed any chance of Del Rio having long term success as a face. Kaitlyn's heel turn was cut from the episode of SmackDown it was meant to air on. Supposedly Vince want too high on the idea. A pity, because Kaitlyn would have fit right in with Beth and Natalya. At the same time, Beth and Natalya pretty much evaporated as a team weeks later and adding Kaitlyn to the mix wasn't going to change things.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Aug 31, 2014 12:35:45 GMT -5
Sometimes, turns are given up on before they even really start. Writers realize almost immediately that an upcoming storyline is going to go over with the crowd like a fart in church and the chute is pulled before the plane even takes off. Some that come to mind right away: - Alberto Del Rio, super babyface: Was there a person less suited for a main event face push than Alberto Del Rio? What else am I missing? I have to disagree with this one. Del Rio had Ricardo for sympathy and help with promos, his ring style was possibly the most adapted for this current crowd climate when it comes to heavyweight wrestling (dude can fly like a cruiser, is a legit heavyweight and looks smooth as silk) and wrestled as a face his whole career prior to WWE. His feuds and booking - familiar story - are what made him fail as a face, not his lack of preparation and ability.
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Post by sunnytaker on Aug 31, 2014 13:50:39 GMT -5
Can we stop pretending Face Del Rio was never over? i actually liked the one or two week period when recently turned heel champ del rio was going around thanking everyone for their support and that he was going to be a champion for the people like them while they kept booing him- kinda pre Bo Dallas thing except without the snapping when things didn;t go his way. also eve turned heel for like a week when she lost a match and started yelling at Nattie and i forget who was with her because they were tyring to console her. then the next week she was back to being a smiley face again and was never heel againe til her executive assistant days. also kelly kelly starts screaming at the top her of lungs for a week or so when she attacked beth phoenix outside the ring, but beth was a heel at this time (divas of destruction timeframe i think) so dunno if this counts.
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Post by simplydurhamcalling on Aug 31, 2014 13:59:49 GMT -5
It'd probably have to be with someone who isn't as crazy over as Bryan is, and then build up sympathy for that guy for the eventual rebellion against Wyatt. Hardly anyone was giving Bryan in The Wyatt Family a chance to play out because they were accusing WWE of trying to kill his overness with the angle. Honestly I can't think of anyone on the roster that would've actually fit in the Wyatt Family. Bray, Harper, and Rowan have a specific "look" so any other members would just stick out like a sore thumb and look out of place. Daniel Bryan didn't really look like a convert so much as just "Daniel Bryan cosplaying as a member of the Wyatt Family". I think the negative reactions were justified. It really did seem like they were trying to side track Bryan from the main storyline and transfer his heat onto Bray. If he grew his beard a little I think Sami Zayn would fit quite well in a similar vein as Kidman in The Flock (sans the implied heroin addiction).
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Post by Vice honcho room temperature on Aug 31, 2014 14:00:43 GMT -5
Eddie Guerrero in 2003. Turned heel on Tajiri after Tajiri got knocked into Eddie's car, played heel the next week on SmackDown but had to have boos piped in because the crowd still cheered him, then the following week came out and made jokes about his Latino temper and went back to being a babyface. Did they pipe in boos? Maybe its my memory betraying me but I thought they kept in the cheers and chants for Eddie. That would be a quick aborted turn because they didn't even bother editing it from Tuesday to Thursday. Alberto Del Rio vs. Returning from a concussion Dolph Ziggler in a smark hotbed? Face Del Rio died a death. That was an intentional double turn in that match so idk if turning is "died a death"
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CH Punk
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
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Post by CH Punk on Aug 31, 2014 14:38:36 GMT -5
Alberto Del Rio vs. Returning from a concussion Dolph Ziggler in a smark hotbed? Face Del Rio died a death. That was an intentional double turn in that match so idk if turning is "died a death" I should have phrased it better, but the actual feud going in still had Del Rio painted as a face going in with Ziggler as a cocky heel (They were even teasing Ricardo becoming more than just his announcer/buddy like on the Smackdown go home show). On a different note, didn't they try to have Cena become a Austin-type face in 2004 (or early 2005) on an episode of Smackdown when, after a tag match, he hit his partner with an FU. The crowd thought he turned heel so they booed and, as a result, they never aired it? While not a turn, per se, they did abort it to make sure it didn't become one.
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Post by Vice honcho room temperature on Aug 31, 2014 14:41:49 GMT -5
That was an intentional double turn in that match so idk if turning is "died a death" I should have phrased it better, but the actual feud going in still had Del Rio painted as a face going in with Ziggler as a cocky heel (They were even teasing Ricardo becoming more than just his announcer/buddy like on the Smackdown go home show). On a different note, didn't they try to have Cena become a Austin-type face in 2004 (or early 2005) on an episode of Smackdown when, after a tag match, he hit his partner with an FU. The crowd thought he turned heel so they booed and, as a result, they never aired it? While not a turn, per se, they did abort it to make sure it didn't become one. Yeah Cena hit an FU on Benoit in an attempt to make him like a Stone Cold anti hero. Didn't take well or they changed their minds as they edited it out. I think I remember Michael Hayes' name attatched to the idea for some reason
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MrBRulzOK
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Post by MrBRulzOK on Aug 31, 2014 14:47:11 GMT -5
If I recall correctly, back in... 2005, I think, Chris Masters was supposed to go baby face and Carlito was supposed to stay heel. However, when Carlito turned on him and laid him out everybody cheered.
So for whatever reason Masters became the heel while Carlito was a weird cheating face for a few weeks.
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Post by "Gentleman" AJ Powell on Aug 31, 2014 15:21:37 GMT -5
Honestly I can't think of anyone on the roster that would've actually fit in the Wyatt Family. Bray, Harper, and Rowan have a specific "look" so any other members would just stick out like a sore thumb and look out of place. Daniel Bryan didn't really look like a convert so much as just "Daniel Bryan cosplaying as a member of the Wyatt Family". I think the negative reactions were justified. It really did seem like they were trying to side track Bryan from the main storyline and transfer his heat onto Bray. If he grew his beard a little I think Sami Zayn would fit quite well in a similar vein as Kidman in The Flock (sans the implied heroin addiction). I dunno if his in-ring style would gel as well though. Plus, first time he appears in front of a smarky crowd, he's become face by proxy.
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Post by -Lithium- on Aug 31, 2014 19:54:40 GMT -5
Edge's WWE Title rematch from the Royal Rumble against Cena on RAW in early 2006. Cena has Edge in the F-U and Lita runs in and clocks Edge with the title belt, getting Cena disqualified and costing Edge the chance to win his championship back. Edge is confused, Cena's confused, the audience is confused, the commentators are confused, and Lita leaves up the ramp with kind of a, "Yep, I'm not sorry" look on her face. Nothing was really made of it the following week, psycho crazy Edge at his peak wasn't even mad that his girlfriend had cost him a title match, and normal service was resumed. Yep, not sure what the deal was there. She did it because she knew Edge was about to lose. Cena lost by DQ so Edge got another title shot...
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A damn road sign
Samurai Cop
"What the hell am I? A school crossing?"
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Post by A damn road sign on Aug 31, 2014 20:04:56 GMT -5
Edge's WWE Title rematch from the Royal Rumble against Cena on RAW in early 2006. Cena has Edge in the F-U and Lita runs in and clocks Edge with the title belt, getting Cena disqualified and costing Edge the chance to win his championship back. Edge is confused, Cena's confused, the audience is confused, the commentators are confused, and Lita leaves up the ramp with kind of a, "Yep, I'm not sorry" look on her face. Nothing was really made of it the following week, psycho crazy Edge at his peak wasn't even mad that his girlfriend had cost him a title match, and normal service was resumed. Yep, not sure what the deal was there. She did it because she knew Edge was about to lose. Cena lost by DQ so Edge got another title shot... Meh, seemed like a cop out to me. Why bother with the dramatic lingering shot of Lita leaving up the ramp looking remorseless if it were as simple as that?
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Allie Kitsune
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Always Feelin' Foxy.
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Post by Allie Kitsune on Aug 31, 2014 20:37:41 GMT -5
Eugene's heel turn didn't last long if I remember right. I wish it would have. The character is it was would have actually worked. Everyone wanted "Guy who faked it to manipulate Eric Bischoff into giving him a job", but I liked the idea of "Spoiled brat who is used to getting special treatment all his life getting mad when everybody stops giving it to him".
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Allie Kitsune
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Always Feelin' Foxy.
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Post by Allie Kitsune on Aug 31, 2014 20:39:48 GMT -5
Also, I know this doesn't count, but there are also guys who turn just for the duration of a house show, and then immediately turn when it's over.
I was at a house show where US Champ MVP delivered an open challenge to anyone, and Carlito (who was a heel at the time) came out and played face for the whole match. As soon as he lost the match, he ran down the crowd and flipped them off.
This is probably a fairly common occurrence.
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Malcolm
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Post by Malcolm on Aug 31, 2014 20:40:44 GMT -5
Chavo Guerrero after he came back from an injury. And then he was heel again teaming with the very guy who injured him(I can't remember who).
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Post by Larryhausen on Aug 31, 2014 21:35:49 GMT -5
Also, I know this doesn't count, but there are also guys who turn just for the duration of a house show, and then immediately turn when it's over. I was at a house show where US Champ MVP delivered an open challenge to anyone, and Carlito (who was a heel at the time) came out and played face for the whole match. As soon as he lost the match, he ran down the crowd and flipped them off. This is probably a fairly common occurrence. It is, solely because of the way a wrestling match works. There's really no way to have a match between two heels without one guy playing de facto face. The same goes for a face vs face match. Heel vs heel, one will take the heat, while also playing up their actual wrestling skills, while the other is business as usual. Face vs face, one gets more aggressive than usual. Really great workers make this change as subtle as possible, or play it up and make it part of the story of the match. Michaels, for example, was amazing at playing the conflicted, de facto heel in his last few WM matches.
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Allie Kitsune
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Post by Allie Kitsune on Aug 31, 2014 21:47:55 GMT -5
Also, I know this doesn't count, but there are also guys who turn just for the duration of a house show, and then immediately turn when it's over. I was at a house show where US Champ MVP delivered an open challenge to anyone, and Carlito (who was a heel at the time) came out and played face for the whole match. As soon as he lost the match, he ran down the crowd and flipped them off. This is probably a fairly common occurrence. It is, solely because of the way a wrestling match works. There's really no way to have a match between two heels without one guy playing de facto face. The same goes for a face vs face match. Heel vs heel, one will take the heat, while also playing up their actual wrestling skills, while the other is business as usual. Face vs face, one gets more aggressive than usual. Really great workers make this change as subtle as possible, or play it up and make it part of the story of the match. Michaels, for example, was amazing at playing the conflicted, de facto heel in his last few WM matches. Well, I meant more people who do it specifically at house shows with no subtlety at all.
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Post by tekkenguy on Aug 31, 2014 21:56:44 GMT -5
The Miz's heel turn in 2013. It got canceled due to Christmas Bounty.
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Post by Main Eventer on Aug 31, 2014 22:06:10 GMT -5
Jeff Hardy's heel turn in 2003, turns by getting kicked in the face by Shawn Michaels. Turns face by saving Trish Stratus from Y2J and Christian and starts teaming with Shawn Michaels.
May not count but I thought Slater turned face in his match with Seth Rollins, but went right back to being a heel on Main Event.
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