Fade
Patti Mayonnaise
Posts: 38,294
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Post by Fade on Oct 9, 2018 17:59:56 GMT -5
This is literally an origin flick. By all accounts it's heavily influenced by Killing Joke. Joaquin is an actor all about character and character development. I somehow doubt this is going to be "I'm Joker, I'm Crazy 100%" for the full duration of its run time. But for that, there's always Suicide Squad. I just got the feeling he’s gonna be Crazy all the time, it’s just the vibe I get from the pictures and news that have come out. Everything about Joaquin as an actor betrays that. It's also general as hell to say "crazy". As others have pointed out, most of the Jokers have been nuanced. Hamils, Ledgers, Nicholsons. It's like saying "play an emotion. Play sad". "Sad" could look like a million different things depending on the person. Same with "playing crazy". What does that mean? The only one I could argue played at being "crazy" was Leto. Which is why it was so one dimensional. And sucked. Characters, like people, need to have nuances and realistic goals and circumstances.
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Post by Kevin Hamilton on Oct 9, 2018 22:22:29 GMT -5
Just lookin at his Arthur pictures, it's clear this is a story of an average shlub who breaks. If you look at the phone booth footage, my bet is on it bein heavily influenced by Killin Joke flashback sequences in terms of hapless guy cracks after tragedy
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Post by "Gizzark" Mike Wronglevenay on Oct 10, 2018 5:18:35 GMT -5
You haven’t seen the movie yet. Maybe he does? I’ve been watching and reading joker since 91, other than the killing joke I’ve never seen him have a redeeming quality, he’s always been pure evil. I’ve also never seen a movie or cartoon that he’s the main character and he’s a sympathetic figure, maybe they’ll manage to do it here. In fairness in main continuity, he at least isn't a Nazi...
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Post by OVO 40 hunched over like he 80 on Oct 10, 2018 12:06:47 GMT -5
In goodfellas, Henry Hill provides for his family. In Clockwork Orange, Alex changes thanks to therapy and in the book he starts finding violence boring and wants to start a family. In American Psycho, Patrick Bateman comes clean to his lawyer that he’s a serial killer and wants to stop, he shows remorse. In The Sopranos, Tony loves his family. In Scarface, Montana refuses to kill a mother and her kids and that brings his downfall, he also cares about his mother and sister. Joker has zero redeeming qualities. So if he loves someone in this movie, all the crazy evil shit he does is redeemed? From your perspective, is that all it takes? All those dudes were pieces of shit. If you really cared for your family, you wouldn't murder so many people and put the lives of your family in danger. But that's just my opinion. My point is that all those films and shows have had unlikable, villain main characters and have been highly successful, and critically praised. They were evil, but at least you could root for them because deep down they were sympathetic. Not so much with Joker.
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Post by Zaq "That Guy" Buzzkill on Oct 10, 2018 12:27:11 GMT -5
So if he loves someone in this movie, all the crazy evil shit he does is redeemed? From your perspective, is that all it takes? All those dudes were pieces of shit. If you really cared for your family, you wouldn't murder so many people and put the lives of your family in danger. But that's just my opinion. My point is that all those films and shows have had unlikable, villain main characters and have been highly successful, and critically praised. They were evil, but at least you could root for them because deep down they were sympathetic. Not so much with Joker. Also, with those examples it's worth noting that for all the horrible things they did, the people who they went up against were far more evil and ruthless than they could ever hope to be. There is nobody the Joker could go up against that would make him look good in comparison.
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chazraps
Wade Wilson
Better have my money when I come-a collect!
Posts: 27,989
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Post by chazraps on Oct 10, 2018 13:23:22 GMT -5
Exactly. Godfather is viewed as one of the best films of all time. Goodfellas (as you mentioned) Breaking Bad Sopranos American Psycho A Clockwork Orange Scarface Natural Born Killers All those movies you listed, the main characters have redeeming qualities, Joker don’t, unless they do a “Killing Joke” type of story. What are their redeeming qualities?
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Oct 10, 2018 16:00:50 GMT -5
Patrick Bateman has reedming qualities ?
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Post by Hit Girl on Oct 10, 2018 16:08:04 GMT -5
Patrick Bateman has reedming qualities ? I do like his love of a well designed business card.
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Post by A Platypus Rave on Oct 10, 2018 16:51:00 GMT -5
Patrick Bateman has reedming qualities ? I do like his love of a well designed business card. he also enjoys Huey Lewis and the News.
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Oct 10, 2018 17:29:46 GMT -5
Patrick Bateman has reedming qualities ? I do like his love of a well designed business card. Oh my god it’s laminated
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Post by Mighty Attack Tribble on Mar 22, 2019 21:24:22 GMT -5
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Post by DSR on Mar 22, 2019 21:28:20 GMT -5
Patrick Bateman has reedming qualities ? He's always conscious of his need to return video tapes.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 22, 2019 21:30:19 GMT -5
I can't decide if I like Joker's design in this movie or not. On one hand I do like how it leans a lot more conventional than his last couple of movie appearances but on the other it looks rather cheap. And yet I can see where in-universe that would make sense.
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Post by James Fabiano on Mar 22, 2019 22:24:49 GMT -5
I’ve been watching and reading joker since 91, other than the killing joke I’ve never seen him have a redeeming quality, he’s always been pure evil. I’ve also never seen a movie or cartoon that he’s the main character and he’s a sympathetic figure, maybe they’ll manage to do it here. In fairness in main continuity, he at least isn't a Nazi... I get that reference.
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Shai
Hank Scorpio
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Post by Shai on Mar 22, 2019 23:19:23 GMT -5
If this is enough like Killing Joke to wipe that animated monstrosity from my mind ill take it
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Post by arrogantmodel on Mar 22, 2019 23:36:40 GMT -5
I do like his love of a well designed business card. he also enjoys Huey Lewis and the News. Huey's a little too black sounding for me.
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Nr1Humanoid
Hank Scorpio
Is the #3 humanoid at best.
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Post by Nr1Humanoid on Mar 23, 2019 7:05:08 GMT -5
Never given a Shit about Joker's origins, he's much more fascinating without one.
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Post by Hit Girl on Mar 23, 2019 10:27:44 GMT -5
His 1989 movie origin in the best one. I hate the failed comedian/Red Hood one.
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Bub (BLM)
Patti Mayonnaise
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Fed. Up.
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Post by Bub (BLM) on Mar 23, 2019 11:53:36 GMT -5
His 1989 movie origin in the best one. I hate the failed comedian/Red Hood one. Nah, The Dark Knight did it best by not revealing his origin while having him tell multiple conflicting backstories throughout 5he film. He's so much scarier when you don't know who he used to be.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 23, 2019 16:05:29 GMT -5
In terms of a Joker backstory I'm partial to, "He was the Red Hood, took an acid bath, and beyond that.... I dunno." I do like having that level of connection with Bruce from that one run-in, but I really don't think there's any need at all to know WHY he was in that position.
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