Bully Ray: No one will ever be as big as Austin/Rock again

[héad.casé]

"You know damn well that you don't go to the top of the mountain and stay at the top of the mountain unless you are chosen to be at the top of the mountain - and that's not the way it was. One of Jim Ross's best friends in the wrestling business and in real life is 'Stone Cold' Steve Austin. He was told to never talk. What would've happened if he never grabbed that microphone and never would have said, 'Austin 3:16 means I just whooped your ass'? Now, back then, it worked. Now, if you're not told to say something like that, how can you ever get to the top of the mountain?"

"Seth Rollins has done it all and can do it all. But how come Seth Rollins is not at Cena level? How come he's not at Rock level? How come he's not at Austin level? It's because I don't think they will ever allow anyone to get to that level again. If you take the three biggest stars over the last 20-some-odd years, would you say that Cena, Austin, and The Rock are the three biggest ones? Okay, so those three guys in their own way do what they wanted to do without Vince's approval. Listen, Steve was able to walk out and still come back and have a job. Not a lot of people walk out and come back in the next day. Rocky was able to walk away and become the biggest star in Hollywood. And John, my God! He just won the Muhammad Ali Award. He has granted more wishes than anybody on the planet. I mean, he walks on water when it comes to the WWE. And he was able to tell Vince, 'I'm not going to Saudi Arabia.' I don't think they're ever going to let anybody get to that level again where they have control or say."

"I learned a very important lesson from Vince McMahon one day that he taught me one-on-one. I don't remember the arena we were in, but we were in a hallway and he said, 'Bubba, it's very rare that the boys have leverage on me, but when they do have leverage on me and they don't use it, shame on them.' What a lesson to learn from Vince McMahon and I apply that lesson to what's going on in the WWE today. They're creating their stars, they're letting their stars get as big as they possibly want them to be, but then there's a ceiling. And I think Roman Reigns is at the top of that ceiling. I think Ronda Rousey is at the top of that ceiling. I think Charlotte is at the top of that ceiling. I'm not sure who will ever get passed that."

Source: The Ross Report Podcast

[BrodietheSlayer]

He's not wrong, and that's the problem with the current system as it stands.

[Captain Stud Muffin (BLM)]

WWE won't let them be

The brand is the selling name, not a specific wrestler

[The Zombie Mod The]

he's right, vince doesn't want to create another megastar only for them to bugger off elsewhere to make money for themselves.


yes it's selfish on his part incredibly so, but it makes sense business-wise... why make someone a household name only to lose them before you can get as much money from them as possible.


also does explain why wwe cuts people off at the knees just as they start to hit a certain peak so often, you can get big in wwe but cant get bigger than wwe. how many names can be listed in the last 15 years where nonsensical booking decisions just squashed momentum.

[Fade is a CodyCryBaby]

Yeah..I’d say it’s more the system. The way the company has expanded and developed. I would agree. Less it’s “Vince holding dudes down” and more..the shape of the business these days.

But I’d say it’s possible. For someone to do it. Seth Rollins isn’t on the level of Austin or Rock because Seth Rollins isn’t on the level of Austin or Rock. Whether or not promos are scripted. But I’d say it’s possible someone comes along one day and becomes a huge star in the vein of Austin or Rock.

[Deleted]

I really don't see anyone getting to that Austin or Rock level ever again. The two closest since I started watching again have been Punk (which they f***ed up quickly), and Bryan in 2014 (at least in terms of reactions). Becky's my favorite wrestler and all, but I don't really see it happening for her either.

[The Ichi]

Stop with this grab the brass ring nonsense. You know damn well what happens now when a wrestler puts their foot down, and it isn't good for them.

[Big Chungus]

Dec 17, 2018 18:26:24 GMT -5 Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) said:

WWE won't let them be

The brand is the selling name, not a specific wrestler

Business wise, it's kind of a smarr thing to do. Look at ROH right now, The Elite are leaving and they have no one hot enough to immediately tske their spot, they're gonna have to build new signees up and god knows how long that will take, and it's doubtful they get to Elite's stature. Although that's kinds on ROH for not bothering to build anyone else up to their level.

[fw91]

I dont think it’s fair to say that wwe wont let anyone be as big. It was a diffferent time that fit Austin and Rock to a T

[Perd]

It’s only a small aspect of a greater problem, but lately, the ordinary names have been bothering me. Seth Rollins and Dean Ambrose sound like insurance salesman. Not larger than life SUPERSTARS.

[Deleted]

And it's not the wrestlers' fault either, it's the company's.

[This Player Hating Mothman]

Dec 17, 2018 18:43:47 GMT -5 Big Chungus said:

Dec 17, 2018 18:26:24 GMT -5 Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) said:

WWE won't let them be

The brand is the selling name, not a specific wrestler

Business wise, it's kind of a smarr thing to do. Look at ROH right now, The Elite are leaving and they have no one hot enough to immediately tske their spot, they're gonna have to build new signees up and god knows how long that will take, and it's doubtful they get to Elite's stature. Although that's kinds on ROH for not bothering to build anyone else up to their level.

ROH is run on the kind of budget where they can't give the world to people who want to go bigger. WWE is the biggest there is, they don't have that same problem and the ways they lose people are much spottier than that. For contrast, look at New Japan; WWE would surely love to sign away Okada, who is the biggest star in the company by an incredible margin, but he's loyal and devoted to the company. It's not a smart thing to do if your show in a star-driven business is left with no real stars because you f*** with and undercut your whole roster, and it's the fault of WWE and ROH for putting all their eggs in one basket with zero backup plans or ideas for what to do when someone bails.

[romanstylesiii]

Dec 17, 2018 18:23:02 GMT -5 BrodietheSlayer said:

He's not wrong, and that's the problem with the current system as it stands.

Yeah. Instead of anyone being over on at a level 10 like those 3 guys, nearly the entire roster sits at a 6/7.

[Push R Truth]

Dec 17, 2018 18:26:24 GMT -5 Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) said:

WWE won't let them be

The brand is the selling name, not a specific wrestler

I agree with everything you said... but I'll take it 1 step farther.

They talk out both sides of their mouth. The Brand is the Selling Name but then they latch on to 1 dude and hell-or-high-water push the shit outta them as "The Guy".

So I'd argue the company cuts itself off at the knees because it won't commit to either and ends up with two opposing lines of thought. And it damn well shows on the product. You get stuck with a "Come see the WWE where nobody matters except that one guy".

[Captain Stud Muffin (BLM)]

Dec 17, 2018 18:43:47 GMT -5 Big Chungus said:

Dec 17, 2018 18:26:24 GMT -5 Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) said:

WWE won't let them be

The brand is the selling name, not a specific wrestler

Business wise, it's kind of a smarr thing to do. Look at ROH right now, The Elite are leaving and they have no one hot enough to immediately tske their spot, they're gonna have to build new signees up and god knows how long that will take, and it's doubtful they get to Elite's stature. Although that's kinds on ROH for not bothering to build anyone else up to their level.

ROH were backed in a corner and didn't really have a choice but they deserve blame as well for not trying to find a solution

Once you get to a certain point it should be about the brand though. Like in the NFL, NBA etc... players will most certainly come and go and you will have a face to your brand who will help carry you but once that player or players retire or have to leave due to injury, the clock keeps turning and doesn't stop a beat because they are gone

The big problem with WWE is that, Vince doesn't want the person becoming so big that Hollywood can poach them off or they bored like Lesnar and decide to use their name to get them elsewhere. Brock left during his prime after Vince gave him the world and was willing to give him more. Batista and Cena have been able to pursue careers after spending many years in WWE

[Captain Stud Muffin (BLM)]

Dec 17, 2018 19:06:01 GMT -5 Push R Truth said:

Dec 17, 2018 18:26:24 GMT -5 Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) said:

WWE won't let them be

The brand is the selling name, not a specific wrestler

I agree with everything you said... but I'll take it 1 step farther.

They talk out both sides of their mouth. The Brand is the Selling Name but then they latch on to 1 dude and hell-or-high-water push the shit outta them as "The Guy".

So I'd argue the company cuts itself off at the knees because it won't commit to either and ends up with two opposing lines of thought. And it damn well shows on the product.

As I just posted about that's sports in general that does that in terms of having a person be the face of the sport BUT they can always be replaced by the next hot person (See the NBA with LeBron as the guy but people like Curry have come along to get close to popularity like him)

However, with Vince he doesn't compromise and it has to be built around this one guy come hell or high water. He's done that both with Cena and Reigns

[evilone]

Just wait until WWE get themselves into real existential problem due general wrestling market decline. It will happen rather sooner than later. Then WWE will be making larger than life superstars all over again just to save their own ass.

[King Devitt: Scrum Guzzler]

Everything wrong with WWE is 1000% Vince's fault.

The writing sucks because of him.
The characters suck because of him.
He books the same heels and faces, no one is allowed to be different, everyone is homogenized.
His humour is horrible, his understanding of wresting is horrible.

He's cut the legs out of everyone that gets over that's not his chosen ones.
Then when they ultimately fail it's manifest destiny.
Hell, the dude booked Balor to be a loser, then said he wasn't credible enough to face Lesnar at the Rumble last year b/c he was too much of a loser.
Seriously, how can people actually believe it's the "state of the business" and not realize that the state of the business is what it is because of Vince?
I'm not trying to attack anyone, it just kinda baffles me.

Look at NXT, stars Vince didn't create. Think of every change he's made to every single person so he can put his own "personal stamp" on them instead of letting them be the people that got over in the first place. What happens every time? He ruins them. Even when he's trying not to he ruins them.

Bully Ray is saying what I've been saying for a long time now. If Austin came up today there'd be no "Austin 3:16 promo" because Vince wouldn't let him speak as himself.
We should be in a new boom period right now in WWE, with the most talented and stacked roster ever, but we're not, and that's all Vince's fault.
Imagine where we'd be if people were allowed to cut promos as themselves with just bullet points, if every heel wasn't "you people" and every face wasn't made to look like a doofus in some way.

The only change that can come in this company is when he steps down.
When brass rings are actually there for the taking, not handed out to favorites by someone who lacks all self-awareness to know he's very obviously full of shit.

*uses both hands to put up invisible shield*

[TWERKIN' MAGGLE]

Vince is so salty that The Rock became one of the biggest stars in Hollywood.

So salty that he's willing to bring him back for WrestleMania main events and use The Rock to get more casual eyes on his product.

Wait, why doesn't he want his talent to become bigger stars again?

Good lord, this man needs therapy.

[kidkamikaze10]

Not with how the company currently is.

The only reason why there is no megastar is because of RAW and everyone who runs it.