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Post by SirLucas on Mar 16, 2019 17:10:04 GMT -5
I can name a few gimmicks off hand. Elias : Acoustic guitar player Heavy Machinery : Country Boys Lacey Evans: 1940s Southern Woman
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 16, 2019 17:18:35 GMT -5
A big problem is that guys who do have nominal gimmicks don't learn to wrestle or work those gimmicks.
You're an old school bruiser? Then why are you doing flips?
You're the Brainbusters 2.0? Why are you working like cowardly southern heels?
Even a star like Finn does nothing to set his work as the demon aside from his normal work.
Elias at least uses his guitar as a weapon enough it kind of extends into his work, but for most guys now a gimmick is essentially a robe for your entrance and then bell to bell a complete non factor.
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Post by carp (SPC, Itoh Respect Army) on Mar 16, 2019 17:23:31 GMT -5
A big problem is that guys who do have nominal gimmicks don't learn to wrestle or work those gimmicks. You're an old school bruiser? Then why are you doing flips? You're the Brainbusters 2.0? Why are you working like cowardly southern heels? Even a star like Finn does nothing to set his work as the demon aside from his normal work. This right here is the problem. You also got evil monster killer Asuka... who really likes hitting people with her butt. The problem is, to do character-specific stuff like this, you gotta work out spots for it. Even better, you work out extended sequences. And I don't think anyone really has time for that on the main roster, because you got a billion matches a week.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 16, 2019 17:27:50 GMT -5
A big problem is that guys who do have nominal gimmicks don't learn to wrestle or work those gimmicks. You're an old school bruiser? Then why are you doing flips? You're the Brainbusters 2.0? Why are you working like cowardly southern heels? Even a star like Finn does nothing to set his work as the demon aside from his normal work. This right here is the problem. You also got evil monster killer Asuka... who really likes hitting people with her butt. The problem is, to do character-specific stuff like this, you gotta work out spots for it. Even better, you work out extended sequences. And I don't think anyone really has time for that on the main roster, because you got a billion matches a week. Over scripting becomes an issue then. The way matches are laid out now (which I believe to be necessary for television production) makes it harder to work that stuff in, but loads of guys seem to just not get it. The Dunne (who is much better than when he began)/Bate issue and the Revival issue are much easier to solve though. Just stop doing stupid stuff that doesn't fit your gimmick.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 16, 2019 18:19:36 GMT -5
I can name a few gimmicks off hand. Elias : Acoustic guitar player Heavy Machinery : Country Boys Lacey Evans: 1940s Southern Woman I suppose you can go further. Balor: Venom Bray Wyatt: Cult Leader/Horror Movie Villain Daniel Bryan: Eco-Friendly Enviornmental Vegan The Shield: SWAT team? That’s literally all I got. The rest of them are just guys. Nothing separates the personalities of Ricochet and Mustafa Ali. Nothing separates the personalities of Drew McIntyre and Bobby Lashley. Or Gallows and Anderson and The Revival. They all move and act the same and when they get a chance to talk, they all say the same generic robotic things because it’s all written by the same writer and they’re not allowed to improv or put their own spin on things. Back in the day, you had a few wrestlers who were just normal guys. Guys like Bret Hart for example... but even THEY had an interesting look. He was “The Hitman”, he wore pink and had a finisher called “The Sharpshooter”... cause he’s The Hitman. That cleverness doesn’t exist in wrestling anymore. If Bret Hart was around now, they would probably just have him wrestle in all black and have his finisher called a “Seated Scorpion Hold”
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Post by Ecks Ecks Ringout Ecks Ecks on Mar 16, 2019 18:57:55 GMT -5
I wouldn't want to go full New Generation where half the roster is defined by having a second job, but I do think bringing back more over-the-top personality traits and promos would do wonders for some of the talent. Matt Hardy got the Broken stuff over because that kind of thing is largely missing from modern wrestling, and fans ate it up.
Take Drew McIntyre. They push the "Scottish Psychopath" nickname on commentary, but he wears standard black gear and speaks in a very reserved, rehearsed and deliberate way. Why not give him a crazier outfit, maybe some face paint, and have him cut wild late-80s-style promos?
It'd also help if wrestlers got new music and attire with every gimmick change. Baron Corbin still has his theme from *before* he became GM, which made no sense at the time and makes even less sense now, since he's still wrestling in the same clothes despite not being GM anymore. Neither the music or the attire has anything to do with his current character.
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Post by xCompackx on Mar 16, 2019 19:47:44 GMT -5
Man, I’m just going back and watching Undertaker and Kane’s stuff and I’m like “Yeah, I wish we had this again.”
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Dub H
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Post by Dub H on Mar 16, 2019 19:53:58 GMT -5
Ok let me dispel that bullshit that Tyler Breeze "flopped"
He was given ONE WEEK and then became a jobber. That is not a flop,that is the office saying "we dont want you to have a shot"
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Post by Deleted on Mar 16, 2019 20:12:44 GMT -5
Ok let me dispel that bullshit that Tyler Breeze "flopped" He was given ONE WEEK and then became a jobber. That is not a flop,that is the office saying "we dont want you to have a shot" Breeze is one of my favourite wrestlers. Not only is he brilliant in the ring but he’s got that Zoolander gimmick down to a tee. In the early 90s, a guy called Shawn Michaels was doing a similar thing and he was taken seriously. Look what happened there. I know people liked The Fashion Police stuff but I much preferred Super Model Tyler and Fandango as a Ballet Dancer. And that’s not counting that stupid shit they did where Breeze was dressing up as Nikki Bella... I hate those segments that are designed to humiliate the performer.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 16, 2019 20:16:18 GMT -5
Take Drew McIntyre. They push the "Scottish Psychopath" nickname on commentary, but he wears standard black gear and speaks in a very reserved, rehearsed and deliberate way. Why not give him a crazier outfit, maybe some face paint, and have him cut wild late-80s-style promos? Right, I’m gonna say it. I know people hate stereotypes in wrestling but Drew McIntyre would be 100 times more interesting if he had a Braveheart gimmick. Right now he’s boring as shit. As for Corbin... before he cut the hair, he had a Sons of Anarchy type thing going on. So why not make him the leader of an actual biker gang? The Forgotten Sons are RIGHT THERE.
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mrbananagrabber
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Post by mrbananagrabber on Mar 16, 2019 21:29:35 GMT -5
Gimmicks don’t necessarily = over or even mildly entertaining. Remember the Shining Stars selling timeshares? That really put butts in seats.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 16, 2019 21:34:54 GMT -5
Gimmicks don’t necessarily = over or even mildly entertaining. Remember the Shining Stars selling timeshares? That really put butts in seats. That’s a poor example. The Shining Stars wasn’t a gimmick. They were just two guys who were from Puerto Rico... that’s it. Now remember when they were Los Matadores? That was the most over they’ve ever been. They were colorful, had El Torito who got a massive reaction in the Rumble. That was THE gimmick and they blew it by going back to the plain ol’ Colons. How they thought they would get them over I’ll never know. What catches the eye of the casual fan more... This. or this?
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Post by Deleted on Mar 16, 2019 21:55:46 GMT -5
It is a huge reason I was drawn to LU in the first place I knew nothing about the world being built from the start no one did around these characters and they aren't just characters for the sake of someone needing something to do all of them have depth and are integral in some way and is why I say alot of the time that someone like Pentagon can be wanted anywhere else but you will never get the best version of him because the best version of him is his LU version.
He is a gawd damn skeleton ninja that does the bidding of his master because he felt disrespected and unappreciated by Mexico
Marty the month is a trustfund baby that is pretty much a serial killer
Mil Muertes a boy killed during an earthquake in mexico that was ressurected by a woman to be deaths avatar
Killshot a former black ops soldier who escaped death by having to leave his brothers behind to die and is in LU to escape that guilt
Dragon Azteca Jr a man fighting for both the honor of his mentor who he wears the mask of and to find his killer
WWE is incapable of these types of characters partly because their writing is greased ass and partly because they have no world where such characters can exsist and it all ties back into a company understanding what it is and what it wants to do....and WWE is neither in the direction of a sport or a television show it is a variety show they wanna give you everything but end up giving you nothing worth anyones time.
King Cuernos video tells you more about him and gives u more depth to his character than just about anyone in the E and alot of other companies
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Post by Deleted on Mar 16, 2019 22:06:57 GMT -5
Part of the problem is that everyone looks the same and almost no one has anything to differentiate themselves. About 90% of the roster seems to be fit guy with a beard that does just about all of the same moves as everyone else. Whereas guys in the Hulkamania era all were distinctive and easily identifiable by their look, color scheme, gimmick, prop that they carried to the ring, or all of the above.
How many more Seth Rollins clones do we need!?
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Post by mrtuesday on Mar 17, 2019 5:12:10 GMT -5
Part of the problem is that everyone looks the same and almost no one has anything to differentiate themselves. About 90% of the roster seems to be fit guy with a beard that does just about all of the same moves as everyone else. Whereas guys in the Hulkamania era all were distinctive and easily identifiable by their look, color scheme, gimmick, prop that they carried to the ring, or all of the above. How many more Seth Rollins clones do we need!? If everyone is the same, then anyone can be put into any storyline they choose. Everyone is at the same level. And no one gets bigger then the WWE brand, which is the most important thing. No more going to WWF to see Hogan, or Austin, or The Rock. No more refunds because Cena wasn't on the show. You go to WWE to see WWE. The Brand is the the star now. If no one is bigger than The Brand, then no one can leave for better opportunities. And if they do, they are easily replaceable.
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Nr1Humanoid
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Post by Nr1Humanoid on Mar 17, 2019 6:59:38 GMT -5
Seems what's needed is a nice mix of both gimmicks and the more serious types we get now.
The right gimmick can work incredibly well in a grounded real life invironment, with the Undertaker the most obvious example. It's survived every single era. Except age.
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Dub H
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Post by Dub H on Mar 17, 2019 7:26:14 GMT -5
Ok let me dispel that bullshit that Tyler Breeze "flopped" He was given ONE WEEK and then became a jobber. That is not a flop,that is the office saying "we dont want you to have a shot" Breeze is one of my favourite wrestlers. Not only is he brilliant in the ring but he’s got that Zoolander gimmick down to a tee. In the early 90s, a guy called Shawn Michaels was doing a similar thing and he was taken seriously. Look what happened there. I know people liked The Fashion Police stuff but I much preferred Super Model Tyler and Fandango as a Ballet Dancer. And that’s not counting that stupid shit they did where Breeze was dressing up as Nikki Bella... I hate those segments that are designed to humiliate the performer. Tyler Breeze is THE most underrated talent in the whole roster.
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Post by 111111 on Mar 17, 2019 7:29:00 GMT -5
It's not even the lack of Gimmicks it's how half arsed they all are.
Alaister black walks to the ring like he's meant to be the reincarnation of Satan then he teams up with the fan favourite who does all the flipppy shit and then after the match cuts promos where he talks like anyone else on the roster.
Rowan is meant to be Daniel Bryan's environmentalist buddy but he walks to the ring in whatever metal bands t-shirt he wore to the arena that night.
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Post by booman on Mar 17, 2019 9:16:23 GMT -5
It is a huge reason I was drawn to LU in the first place I knew nothing about the world being built from the start no one did around these characters and they aren't just characters for the sake of someone needing something to do all of them have depth and are integral in some way and is why I say alot of the time that someone like Pentagon can be wanted anywhere else but you will never get the best version of him because the best version of him is his LU version. He is a gawd damn skeleton ninja that does the bidding of his master because he felt disrespected and unappreciated by Mexico Marty the month is a trustfund baby that is pretty much a serial killer Mil Muertes a boy killed during an earthquake in mexico that was ressurected by a woman to be deaths avatar Killshot a former black ops soldier who escaped death by having to leave his brothers behind to die and is in LU to escape that guilt Dragon Azteca Jr a man fighting for both the honor of his mentor who he wears the mask of and to find his killer WWE is incapable of these types of characters partly because their writing is greased ass and partly because they have no world where such characters can exsist and it all ties back into a company understanding what it is and what it wants to do....and WWE is neither in the direction of a sport or a television show it is a variety show they wanna give you everything but end up giving you nothing worth anyones time. King Cuernos video tells you more about him and gives u more depth to his character than just about anyone in the E and alot of other companies Holy crap, what have I been missing. This just took me back to watching WWF on Saturday mornings. Youtube here I come.
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Post by Feargus McReddit on Mar 17, 2019 10:19:40 GMT -5
Part of the problem is that everyone looks the same and almost no one has anything to differentiate themselves. About 90% of the roster seems to be fit guy with a beard that does just about all of the same moves as everyone else. Whereas guys in the Hulkamania era all were distinctive and easily identifiable by their look, color scheme, gimmick, prop that they carried to the ring, or all of the above. How many more Seth Rollins clones do we need!? If everyone is the same, then anyone can be put into any storyline they choose. Everyone is at the same level. And no one gets bigger then the WWE brand, which is the most important thing. No more going to WWF to see Hogan, or Austin, or The Rock. No more refunds because Cena wasn't on the show. You go to WWE to see WWE. The Brand is the the star now. If no one is bigger than The Brand, then no one can leave for better opportunities. And if they do, they are easily replaceable. It's not even the lack of Gimmicks it's how half arsed they all are. Alaister black walks to the ring like he's meant to be the reincarnation of Satan then he teams up with the fan favourite who does all the flipppy shit and then after the match cuts promos where he talks like anyone else on the roster. Rowan is meant to be Daniel Bryan's environmentalist buddy but he walks to the ring in whatever metal bands t-shirt he wore to the arena that night. Both of these posts are exactly the truth. Look, nobody is saying that gimmicks can’t work in 2019 because most of these guys were hired off of the stuff they did in the indies, including gimmicks. They just have no reason TO do it. Finn Balor got over not just because of his ability but because in NJPW he was the Real Rock N’ Rolla and across UK indies, he came out as a different intimidating character costume and was intimidating as hell. What WWE did was pick the Venom one, change it to “The Demon”, have him not use it that much and make him the smiley dude for the majority of his run. And HE gets called boring for that.
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