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Post by Cyno on May 26, 2019 21:05:52 GMT -5
I wonder... what do you guys think the final straw for Ambrose was? I’d guess how they handled the heel turn. But that time they used Roman’s real life cancer to get heat wouldn’t surprise me. Rollins said in an interview that the heel turn upset him soooooo yeah lol. Was it the actual turn? Or the whole stupid gas mask and "YOU PEOPLE" crap? Because I thought the turn itself was brilliant. Everything else after... hoo boy.
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Post by Deleted on May 26, 2019 21:12:23 GMT -5
Rollins said in an interview that the heel turn upset him soooooo yeah lol. Was it the actual turn? Or the whole stupid gas mask and "YOU PEOPLE" crap? Because I thought the turn itself was brilliant. Everything else after... hoo boy. Here's exactly what he said in the interview.
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Post by xxshoyuweeniexx on May 26, 2019 21:27:36 GMT -5
Was it the actual turn? Or the whole stupid gas mask and "YOU PEOPLE" crap? Because I thought the turn itself was brilliant. Everything else after... hoo boy. Here's exactly what he said in the interview. So basically using your best friend’s deadly cancer for cheap heat was the last straw. Totally understandable.
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Venti
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Post by Venti on May 26, 2019 21:32:46 GMT -5
The only good thing about the heel run was the attire(he looks great in black pants) and the sirens in his theme, imo.
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Post by freeze Austin on May 26, 2019 21:40:43 GMT -5
This is proof more than anything that's happened before that Vince is slipping. It's rare that he ever gets outplayed by a talent during negotiations, and even rarer that he gives someone that's not been viewed as an all-time great a quality send-off.
Moxley is one of the few to live to tell the tale. Respect to him on a ballsy move.
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fw91
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Post by fw91 on May 26, 2019 21:57:48 GMT -5
Listen, I don’t know what goes on in a talent’s head. If he wanted to leave because he wasn’t happy, then I’m sure he had his reasons. But except for the tail end of it all, I think it’s a bit revisionist to call Ambrose’s WWE run as shit. He did a lot more than many others.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 26, 2019 22:08:03 GMT -5
Listen, I don’t know what goes on in a talent’s head. If he wanted to leave because he wasn’t happy, then I’m sure he had his reasons. But except for the tail end of it all, I think it’s a bit revisionist to call Ambrose’s WWE run as shit. He did a lot more than many others.This is something that a lot of people keep saying but you're using what you define as important compared to what the superstar defines as important. Ambrose didn't have the creative freedom he wanted and he wasted all those years without that freedom. He had the money, he had the screentime, he had the title but those don't define him. As he said in an interview, he doesn't need that stuff, he needs creativity and AEW is giving him that creativity.
To you it wasn't shit but to the creative, when someone doesn't have their creative identity? Yeah it's shit.
It's no different than a music artist signed to a major label compared to an indie artist.
And we gotta stop using the "it's revisionist history" comment when we talk about this stuff because at the end of the day Ambrose's idea of what he likes is different from those who think titles, money and screentime matter most. That's not the same for every person. That doesn't define who you are.
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Facetious
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Post by Facetious on May 26, 2019 22:18:52 GMT -5
Listen, I don’t know what goes on in a talent’s head. If he wanted to leave because he wasn’t happy, then I’m sure he had his reasons. But except for the tail end of it all, I think it’s a bit revisionist to call Ambrose’s WWE run as shit. He did a lot more than many others. I mean, other than the initial Shield, WWE title reign, and the reunion with Seth, nothing else was good. He didn't have the worst time, but there was plenty of missteps in his time there.
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Post by freeze Austin on May 26, 2019 22:24:36 GMT -5
Listen, I don’t know what goes on in a talent’s head. If he wanted to leave because he wasn’t happy, then I’m sure he had his reasons. But except for the tail end of it all, I think it’s a bit revisionist to call Ambrose’s WWE run as shit. He did a lot more than many others. His run wasn't shit but I put him in with CM Punk and Daniel Bryan as guys in the last ten who truly could've been bigger stars than they were in the mainstream if the company was actually concerned about making stars instead of making the brand the star, except his run wasn't as good. Unlike those guys, though, he's still young enough to where he can be able to do something like that in AEW.
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Post by Mister Pigwell on May 26, 2019 22:52:15 GMT -5
I wonder... what do you guys think the final straw for Ambrose was? I’d guess how they handled the heel turn. But that time they used Roman’s real life cancer to get heat wouldn’t surprise me. Dunno the dude so I dunno his limits, but for me the Roman shit woulda been it. Mind you the downhill momentum started with the Brock match for me.
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Post by Oh Cry Me a Screwball on May 26, 2019 23:04:51 GMT -5
I wonder... what do you guys think the final straw for Ambrose was? I’d guess how they handled the heel turn. But that time they used Roman’s real life cancer to get heat wouldn’t surprise me. Dunno the dude so I dunno his limits, but for me the Roman shit woulda been it. Mind you the downhill momentum started with the Brock match for me. Sometimes, I wonder how Dean must have felt to have a great 2016, being the final man eliminated by HHH in the Rumble, being opposite Brock Lesnar at a Wrestlemania to begin with (even if the match sucked, this is an EXCLUSIVE club to be in), winning the MITB and WWE title in the same night, being the top draft pick for Smackdown Live, and then propping the show up for months on end, elevating AJ Styles to the main event when his run was coming to an end. But what does he have to show for it at the biggest show of the year in 2017? Getting his IC title defense with Baron Corbin suddenly occurring on the Kickoff show, and then having to do the Street Fight they should have had on the following Smackdown to a fraction of the fanfare it should have received. That kind of drop in status from Mania to Mania is damn near unprecedented, especially for a guy that was a #1 draft pick just months ago.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 26, 2019 23:11:36 GMT -5
Dunno the dude so I dunno his limits, but for me the Roman shit woulda been it. Mind you the downhill momentum started with the Brock match for me. Sometimes, I wonder how Dean must have felt to have a great 2016, being the final man eliminated by HHH in the Rumble, being opposite Brock Lesnar at a Wrestlemania to begin with (even if the match sucked, this is an EXCLUSIVE club to be in), winning the MITB and WWE title in the same night, being the top draft pick for Smackdown Live, and then propping the show up for months on end, elevating AJ Styles to the main event when his run was coming to an end. But what does he have to show for it at the biggest show of the year in 2017? Getting his IC title defense with Baron Corbin suddenly occurring on the Kickoff show, and then having to do the Street Fight they should have had on the following Smackdown to a fraction of the fanfare it should have received. That kind of drop in status from Mania to Mania is damn near unprecedented, especially for a guy that was a #1 draft pick just months ago. I think the Lesnar thing is the first real thing that probably caused Ambrose to be down on being in the company. Sure, he didn't have creative freedom before but he was able to wade through the water, mix it up with his buddies, just generally be good. That Lesnar stuff happened and we saw him noticeably being upset about his job, calling out a coworker and generally being disinterested. No Shield behind him and a guy like Lesnar just straight up shows down all of his ideas regardless of everything Ambrose had worked for prior to that point. This guy was grinding for years and yet one guy could say "nah, f*** that" and end it all. That's an Ippo Dempsey Roll.
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Dub H
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Post by Dub H on May 26, 2019 23:15:17 GMT -5
It depends from your point of view.If Zack Ryder ,Shelton Benjamin,Luke Harper had the run Ambrose had,would it be shit?No.
But you have to put into perspective. You have to comapre how over Ambrose was , how many times he got stupidly booked. And then you compare with his Shield`s Brothers Career.
He is the only one to not win the rumble,the only one to be unable to beat Brock Lesnar.Since the split he was always booked as inferior do Reigns and Rollins when he was clearly the most charismatic and ready of then.
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Post by A Platypus Rave on May 26, 2019 23:57:52 GMT -5
Since the split he was always booked as inferior do Reigns and Rollins when he was clearly the most charismatic and ready of then. And over. He's pretty much always been more over than the other two.
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Dub H
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Post by Dub H on May 27, 2019 0:03:42 GMT -5
Since the split he was always booked as inferior do Reigns and Rollins when he was clearly the most charismatic and ready of then. And over. He's pretty much always been more over than the other two. I didnt include it because i didnt want people to start" but acthually at X shown..." at me but yes since day one the crowd wanted Ambrose more than anyone else in the Shield
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Post by Deleted on May 27, 2019 0:04:42 GMT -5
And let's keep this going man...
Moxley/Omega Moxley in NJPW. Moxley cutting killer promos.
This guy is LIVING HIS BEST LIFE!!! HE AIN'T GOING BACK AND FORTH WITH YOU BITCHES!!!
That's what damn near everyone who doesn't have kids in WWE would probably love right now. That's amazing. He legit pulled the best deal possible and we don't even know how many 0s on his contract yet.
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Post by Rudy Gobert Fadeaway on May 27, 2019 0:09:14 GMT -5
I like how so many folks thought he was gonna settle down and take time off when he left WWE and then he pretty much immediately just goes "no I kinda want world domination actually"
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Post by EoE: Well There's Your Problem on May 27, 2019 0:11:37 GMT -5
The butterfly effect of scripting butt injections and riffing on your best mate’s cancer into a promo is already astounding. Ripples that could turn into tidal waves down the line.
I mean, yeah, we can talk about the Lesnar match going sour or the Austin interview or some of the comedy stuff or being the left behind Shield guy, but there was never any indication he was unhappy until that heel run late last year. That’s what did things in.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 27, 2019 0:26:11 GMT -5
The butterfly effect of scripting butt injections and riffing on your best mate’s cancer into a promo is already astounding. Ripples that could turn into tidal waves down the line. I mean, yeah, we can talk about the Lesnar match going sour or the Austin interview or some of the comedy stuff or being the left behind Shield guy, but there was never any indication he was unhappy until that heel run late last year. That’s what did things in. The entirety of AEW's existence is the result of a series of butterfly effects caused by ridiculously stupid decisions made by Vince McMahon. One day someone will chart them all because it's pretty wild to think about.
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Post by EoE: Well There's Your Problem on May 27, 2019 0:29:35 GMT -5
The butterfly effect of scripting butt injections and riffing on your best mate’s cancer into a promo is already astounding. Ripples that could turn into tidal waves down the line. I mean, yeah, we can talk about the Lesnar match going sour or the Austin interview or some of the comedy stuff or being the left behind Shield guy, but there was never any indication he was unhappy until that heel run late last year. That’s what did things in. The entirety of AEW's existence is the result of a series of butterfly effects caused by ridiculously stupid decisions made by Vince McMahon. One day someone will chart them all because it's pretty wild to think about. Well, right now it’s “BUTT INJECTIONS, DAMMIT” and “KEEP PLAYING THIS ‘60s BATMAN VILLAIN GIMMICK” as the roots of the matter.
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