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Post by Muskrat on Jul 15, 2019 9:20:07 GMT -5
The first ever title match HAS to close the show. They’re pushing wins and losses mattering, and titles mattering, then you have to close your show saying “This title is the most important thing in our company”.
The belt should be the main event 99% of the time, and it should be a big f***ing deal if there’s a match so important that it takes priority over the belt. Crowning your first champ is not that time.
Look at the UFC, since Zuffa bought them in 2001 I believe there has only been 1 time where a non title fight main eventer over a title fight. It doesn’t have to be that rare in AEW, but it should be rare. Especially with only 4 major PPV’s a year
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Jul 15, 2019 15:19:28 GMT -5
The first ever title match HAS to close the show. They’re pushing wins and losses mattering, and titles mattering, then you have to close your show saying “This title is the most important thing in our company”. The belt should be the main event 99% of the time, and it should be a big f***ing deal if there’s a match so important that it takes priority over the belt. Crowning your first champ is not that time. Look at the UFC, since Zuffa bought them in 2001 I believe there has only been 1 time where a non title fight main eventer over a title fight. It doesn’t have to be that rare in AEW, but it should be rare. Especially with only 4 major PPV’s a year Precisely. As I said before, in a kayfabe sense why would Jericho be happy to be not in the main event and let Omega vs Mox get that spot when Mox has "done nothing" so far in AEW and Jericho beat Omega fair and square for the right to earn a shot at the AEW title Just doesn't make a ton of sense imo to say well because Page is faltering the title shouldn't main event. He's only one player in this game and besides that it is your first ever title match for your show and it just sets a bad vibe to not have your title main event when it is your most important title and something everyone wants
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Post by Cyno on Jul 15, 2019 16:39:19 GMT -5
Main event of All Out HAS to be the AEW Championship match. Omega vs Moxley has no real stakes attached to it outside of personal beef. And if they did attach stakes to it, it'd probably be Number One Contender. I doubt All Out is going to be an eight hour long show like Wrestlemania where the crowd is going to be gassed by the time of the main event. And if Moxley vs Omega was the Number One Contender spot, it'd look really bad to have it with the main event spot on the card over the inaugural match for the title. It'd immediately hurt the championship's kayfabe prestige. Moving it down the card because of an overreaction to a poorly booked match a couple of nights ago would be really stupid.
This is also based off the assumption that Page is winning the title and that might not be the outcome. In fact, I think it's all the more likely that Jericho is going to be that dude.
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markymark
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Posts: 17,903
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Post by markymark on Jul 15, 2019 17:38:02 GMT -5
The first thing they need to do is get rid of the knee injury(if its kayfabe), because it reminds me when Becky had the "knee" injury in early 2019.
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Post by Starshine on Jul 15, 2019 18:41:13 GMT -5
Honestly, I think closing with the title match would be a mistake since they'd risk closing the show out on a cold match. There's a bunch of ways to have the match earlier on in the night without it devaluing (as much as you can devalue a prop) the new belt. Plus you have two other bigger matches that would, without question, be stronger show closers in Moxley/Omega and Bucks/LB.
Had their push of Page been successful, I'd probably feel differently. But they've faltered there, and where things stand now, he probably shouldn't take the belt if they want to seriously push their first champion as a center piece of their show. The show should close with the strongest match, belt or not, it doesn't matter. Perception is everything, and if they close the show with a cold first time title match, that does more perceptual damage than anything else they could book.
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Post by "Gizzark" Mike Wronglevenay on Jul 15, 2019 19:06:29 GMT -5
All that Sabian match did in my household was demonstrate to us yet another guy who we would rather be in that title match than Page.
Sabian made me a fan of his from his promo on, and after kissing that fan he is one of my favourite things in the company.
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Shark
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Post by Shark on Jul 15, 2019 19:34:18 GMT -5
Honestly I don't even think the plan is to have Page be THE guy. Just to have the rub of being the first champion.Kenny don't need it for sure.It still aint working but I dont think it is a "this guy is going to be long term the best" That's the direction they are going which is why he's in the spot he's in but they have done him an injustice of not giving him something to sink his teeth into and make him come out looking good each time He's being treated like a guy who we have supposed to have watched his journey and have a rooting interest but the opposite effect is happening and he's slipping As I said starting the thread they were in between a rock and a hard place with his push could fall short and be hurt whether he wins the title or not They've done him no real favors in the shows between Double or Nothing and All Out. He's in a 4 way that has no real stakes and he's not booked in a way to be the highlighted guy in the match. On Saturday he's booked against a not very well established guy in a match that overstays its welcome. Even if he's just going to be fed to Jericho, Page doesn't feel like a guy who really belongs in that spot. I don't even know that we can have faith that the match is going to be good. I've been unimpressed with Page so far and Jericho is at a point where he needs to be with another great worker to get through a match.
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Post by Cyno on Jul 15, 2019 19:47:50 GMT -5
Page IS a good worker, though. And I think he and Jericho can have a solid match, especially since Jericho is a lot better wrestler at his age than he has any right to be. The match with Kip Sabian was a failure of booking, not of Adam Page as a talent. I've seen the guy enough times in ROH and New Japan to know he can go and can be part of a solid midcard scene, eventually making the jump to true main event level. But now is too soon so he should lose this one. Jericho should be the first champ and eventually lose it to the likes of a Kenny Omega or Jon Moxley.
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Jul 15, 2019 20:26:27 GMT -5
That's the direction they are going which is why he's in the spot he's in but they have done him an injustice of not giving him something to sink his teeth into and make him come out looking good each time He's being treated like a guy who we have supposed to have watched his journey and have a rooting interest but the opposite effect is happening and he's slipping As I said starting the thread they were in between a rock and a hard place with his push could fall short and be hurt whether he wins the title or not They've done him no real favors in the shows between Double or Nothing and All Out. He's in a 4 way that has no real stakes and he's not booked in a way to be the highlighted guy in the match. On Saturday he's booked against a not very well established guy in a match that overstays its welcome. Even if he's just going to be fed to Jericho, Page doesn't feel like a guy who really belongs in that spot. I don't even know that we can have faith that the match is going to be good. I've been unimpressed with Page so far and Jericho is at a point where he needs to be with another great worker to get through a match. I would disagree. Page can work and Jericho in big spots always come through. They should be fine
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Dub H
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Post by Dub H on Jul 15, 2019 21:25:09 GMT -5
Page IS a good worker, though. And I think he and Jericho can have a solid match, especially since Jericho is a lot better wrestler at his age than he has any right to be. The match with Kip Sabian was a failure of booking, not of Adam Page as a talent. I've seen the guy enough times in ROH and New Japan to know he can go and can be part of a solid midcard scene, eventually making the jump to true main event level. But now is too soon so he should lose this one. Jericho should be the first champ and eventually lose it to the likes of a Kenny Omega or Jon Moxley. He is good. But not first AEW Champion good.
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Post by cabbageboy on Jul 15, 2019 22:29:48 GMT -5
Page should be their first IC or US level champ, not world champ. That would be a good spot for him right now, feuding with MJF over a secondary belt. He's badly miscast as a main event guy and it hurts, especially when he's not on any level up there with guys like Omega.
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Post by benstudd on Jul 19, 2019 5:08:51 GMT -5
He is a great wrestler and he has that early Bobby Roode spunk about him like a diamond in the rough. But he is not ready and even if he is actually a favorite of mine, the moment I heard what AEW was doing with him i thought it was a huge mistake. (sort of like another mistake Jericho beating Omega). He's the type of guy at this stage of his career that should have a solid run with secondary belt. Baby steps, folks. Let the people warm up to him first. And let the Champ of your starting company be the biggest stars. Cause that flag bearer cannot be a secondary guy.
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Post by 111111 on Jul 19, 2019 8:36:58 GMT -5
Honestly, I think closing with the title match would be a mistake since they'd risk closing the show out on a cold match. . I doubt they’ll close the show on a match, with tv coming up the next month I’d imagine they’ll run an angle of some sort after it
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Post by A Platypus Rave on Jul 19, 2019 10:02:33 GMT -5
They could do something like close the show on a Tag Title Match as a proof that the Tag Belts are as important as the Singles Title.
But I'd imagine they'd want crowning of their first champion to be the centerpiece.
That said.. I don't really like either option to being the first champion.
I love Jericho but... having the first champion of your brand new wrestling company that's going to be different be a multi-time world champion and closer to retiring than not Veteran seems sorta backwards.
Also as stated Adam Page does not seem ready... I haven't seen a lot of his matches but in the ones that I have he's basically been outshone by his opponents by a lot.
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Jul 19, 2019 16:42:34 GMT -5
They could do something like close the show on a Tag Title Match as a proof that the Tag Belts are as important as the Singles Title. But I'd imagine they'd want crowning of their first champion to be the centerpiece. That said.. I don't really like either option to being the first champion. I love Jericho but... having the first champion of your brand new wrestling company that's going to be different be a multi-time world champion and closer to retiring than not Veteran seems sorta backwards.
Also as stated Adam Page does not seem ready... I haven't seen a lot of his matches but in the ones that I have he's basically been outshone by his opponents by a lot.And that is their catch 22 and my original point of the thread
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Post by benstudd on Jul 19, 2019 22:41:22 GMT -5
Maybe I'm reading too much into it but it seems to be a case where the main guys in position of power are afraid to make themselves Champ in fear of being accused of giving themselves the rub in not want to repeat what Jarrett did. But really the biggest stars in their prime that they have are Omega and Cody and Mox. There's no escaping it. One of these three have to be Champ at the beginning. Maybe not Moxley cause it would be better for him to chase it first. That leaves Cody and Omega.
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Jul 19, 2019 22:54:09 GMT -5
Maybe I'm reading too much into it but it seems to be a case where the main guys in position of power are afraid to make themselves Champ in fear of being accused of giving themselves the rub in not want to repeat what Jarrett did. But really the biggest stars in their prime that they have are Omega and Cody and Mox. There's no escaping it. One of these three have to be Champ at the beginning. Maybe not Moxley cause it would be better for him to chase it first. That leaves Cody and Omega. I wouldn't say so I think the original plan before the situation with PAC was Omega was going to be champ but they flipped the script. Their is no doubt they want to put Adam Page on their tier and they have made that 100% clear but it may have been too soon or at least if it wasn't they didn't put him in a position to look like a world beater
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Sept 1, 2019 4:26:29 GMT -5
One of his better showings and a reset that will bode well for him long term
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Post by Cieto on Sept 1, 2019 5:17:03 GMT -5
One of his better showings and a reset that will bode well for him long term I agree, quite liked the match overall also. I think page could do with a new finisher though.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2019 5:19:29 GMT -5
Kind of fascinating, because I thought tonight was the first time in AEW he really showed anything at all and while maybe a bit rough I do think he demonstrated the tools to do something with him down the line, and the consensus on here seems to be much the same.... but in a bunch of other places around the Internet I'm seeing a ton of people saying the match was a total chore to sit through that proved Page doesn't and never will have it. Very strange.
Granted I saw a few of those people who are basically saying that NXT UK put on a better show and therefore AEW is an embarrassment that'll be dead within a year so y'know.
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