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Post by Hobby Drifter on Nov 22, 2019 19:08:58 GMT -5
If a business will be killed by introducing unions, that business has no right to continue.
That’s admitting that the entire industry exists because of the exploitation of its workers. That way of operating needs to get in the sea.
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Steveweiser
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Post by Steveweiser on Nov 22, 2019 19:26:30 GMT -5
I'm sure David Starr would have plenty to say on this matter. While not strictly a wrestling union per se, Equity UK have already implemented great things in their relationship with Pro Wrestling EVE, with workers getting benefits there through representation.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 22, 2019 19:32:03 GMT -5
A wrestling union really needs to be run by non wrestlers I think. Union's have had corruption problems in the past so putting "the boys" in charge would ensure the idea gets strangled at birth.
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XIII
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Post by XIII on Nov 22, 2019 19:34:16 GMT -5
Rhino says that a union will kill the business a bunch of times, but never gives much in the way of reasons why, other than it will cost more money, which is hilarious to say without even having any idea of what said union would entail.
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Post by corndog on Nov 22, 2019 22:10:55 GMT -5
Rhino says that a union will kill the business a bunch of times, but never gives much in the way of reasons why, other than it will cost more money, which is hilarious to say without even having any idea of what said union would entail. He is probably assuming that all wrestling companies would have to provide health insurance, which would be incredibly expensive. But I think the independents would work much differently than say WWE. If anything, at the very least, there should be unions in the larger companies like WWE, New Japan, AEW and anyone that signs talent to exclusive contracts. Of all the companies, CMLL has a union and I am not sure about AAA.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 22, 2019 22:14:47 GMT -5
If so then the business needs to die.
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Post by Natural Born Farmer on Nov 22, 2019 22:16:07 GMT -5
If indie wrestlers unionized and demanded a certain standard of pay and professionalism, there would probably be fewer indie shows as fewer promoters could afford to pay the wrestlers’ fees. I’m fine with that.
Screen Actors Guild and their minimum pay scale didn’t exactly kill independent film making.
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Post by HMARK Center on Nov 22, 2019 22:38:23 GMT -5
Rhino says that a union will kill the business a bunch of times, but never gives much in the way of reasons why, other than it will cost more money, which is hilarious to say without even having any idea of what said union would entail. He is probably assuming that all wrestling companies would have to provide health insurance, which would be incredibly expensive. But I think the independents would work much differently than say WWE. If anything, at the very least, there should be unions in the larger companies like WWE, New Japan, AEW and anyone that signs talent to exclusive contracts. Of all the companies, CMLL has a union and I am not sure about AAA. Interesting to imagine how that'd go with NJPW: Japan is not a union-heavy country, but on the wrestling side there's more of a tradition of loyalty between wrestlers and certain promotions, e.g. how people who become dojo trainers often get their housing paid for and stuff like that. Can't assume their US branch would operate the same way, so it'd be a situation where there'd likely be very different approaches between the roster in Japan and the roster in the States.
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Post by 111111 on Nov 23, 2019 9:03:30 GMT -5
I think David Starr is a better wrestler to listen to on the subject of unions tbh
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Post by Bob Schlapowitz on Nov 23, 2019 12:07:10 GMT -5
If a business will be killed by introducing unions, that business has no right to continue. That’s admitting that the entire industry exists because of the exploitation of its workers. That way of operating needs to get in the sea. Every single word this man just said is 100% spot on. A business that will be "killed" by treating its employees fairly deserves to get killed.
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Post by ogreknee on Nov 23, 2019 12:17:50 GMT -5
Rhino IS a Republican and ran on the platform, so logically, that explains why he's anti-union, as the GOP historically has had the majority of its members be in favor of "right to work" policies. I know I skirt the rules, but I thought I'd explain the logical reasoning behind his stance. I would argue what I think about that stance, but then I would certainly break the rules. I think wrestlers in wwe need to be repped by wme and uta since wwe is classified as an entertainment company and the wrestlers are called actors Getting repped by a major talent agency would do a whole lot for these guy's pocket books Jericho, Nash, hall, goldberg were all guys who jumped into that and it paid off big time as far as negotiation of contracts
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Post by Hit Girl on Nov 23, 2019 15:49:04 GMT -5
Every industry has said that unions would kill the industry.
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Post by Session Moth is over on Nov 23, 2019 17:45:43 GMT -5
Of course Rhyno is anti-union, given his political affiliations. Came here to say this. No surprise at all.
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Mozenrath
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Post by Mozenrath on Nov 23, 2019 18:27:32 GMT -5
There was image in my country those last weeks( basically it was a compilation of every time people said "giving workers X rights will kill the industries!" and how it never did. This is a super important post in regards to this. Rhino's not saying anything here that wasn't said about a billion other industries before they unionized. If I was Big Bird I'd say that the word of the day was fearmongering. Right, and it doesn't even necessarily mean he himself is doing it intentionally. Dude was pretty green still when Heyman pushed him to the moon, but owed him a ton of money by the time ECW died. He's probably been fed every excuse under the sun for years. But you're right. None of this HAS to be like this, it's like this because the industry can get away with it.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 23, 2019 20:51:36 GMT -5
Is there a reason why wrestlers can’t/don’t join the SAG? You’d think they’d become eligible as soon as Vince let the cat out of the bag in 1989.
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Post by IgnahtaSempria on Nov 23, 2019 21:07:04 GMT -5
Is there a reason why wrestlers can’t/don’t join the SAG? You’d think they’d become eligible as soon as Vince let the cat out of the bag in 1989. The SAG doesn't consider wrestlers to be "actors". There ARE wrestlers who have SAG memberships, like Becky Lynch, but they all have acting and stunt person credits on their resumes.
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Cranjis McBasketball
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Post by Cranjis McBasketball on Nov 24, 2019 6:26:40 GMT -5
Is there a reason why wrestlers can’t/don’t join the SAG? You’d think they’d become eligible as soon as Vince let the cat out of the bag in 1989. A few have. I think Funk did Roadhouse just to get a SAG card. Heenan did some movie to get one. He had to pay $1,500 in dues and was paid $1000 for his movie role. He said “That’s why they call me the Brain”.
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Post by The Dark Order Inferno on Nov 24, 2019 8:25:39 GMT -5
I wonder if Rhino believes the current situation in ROH and that of Killer Kross would be happening if a union was a thing.
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Post by 111111 on Nov 24, 2019 15:22:44 GMT -5
Is there a reason why wrestlers can’t/don’t join the SAG? You’d think they’d become eligible as soon as Vince let the cat out of the bag in 1989. A few have. I think Funk did Roadhouse just to get a SAG card. Heenan did some movie to get one. He had to pay $1,500 in dues and was paid $1000 for his movie role. He said “That’s why they call me the Brain”. Is $500 good for health insurance? I’m not American.
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Post by Hit Girl on Nov 24, 2019 17:13:03 GMT -5
"On a union for miners: “It wouldn’t work, it would kill the industry. When you look at unions for things like dock workers it works because ship journeys are planned so far in advance and stevedores get the shipping schedules and have to unload those containers or not. But mining is so fast paced and changes that it just wouldn’t work. I come from Detroit which is a union town, so I get having unions in certain industries, but it wouldn’t work in mining. It would kill the independent scene and a lot of start-up excavators. Lots of states in America have commissions and stuff that creates more hoops for them to jump through like sick days, workman's compensation, pensions, and safety regulations, and we all know that most ore processing companies don’t make a lot of money as it is, so to have these extra hurdles would kill a lot of companies. It would kill the mines that I run [Rhino promotes Veterans of Black Lung] which cost me at least a grand as it is. A union would not be good for miners, it would kill the industry, and don't even get me started on all this nonsense about clean air and drinking water.”
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