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Post by toodarkmark on Dec 18, 2019 19:37:01 GMT -5
I like how people don't think Kross and Scarlett won't end up as a cuck/crazy ex/oversexy lady angle on Smackdown.
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Mozenrath
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Post by Mozenrath on Dec 18, 2019 19:57:32 GMT -5
I like how people don't think Kross and Scarlett won't end up as a cuck/crazy ex/oversexy lady angle on Smackdown. They might, but they can at least get fat paychecks for it.
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Post by Slingshot Suplay on Dec 18, 2019 20:10:56 GMT -5
Wwe will probably dust off the ol' wheel of aggression for him.
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Post by CMPunkyBrewster on Dec 18, 2019 21:35:12 GMT -5
So, correct me if I'm wrong (sincerely, I may have missed something), but isn't the gist of this whole thing: He signed a contract, decided he was unhappy with it because other companies might give him mote, asked for a new one, they made him an offer he rejected (despite them not having to offer him anything at all because he already had a deal), he refused to work with them, so they held him to the terms of his original contract?
Now, unless there is something I missed...I don't see how Impact is to blame here, and I certainly don't see how he was a "hostage".
I've never really dealt with contracts in wrestling outside of verbal agreements, but I have dealt with them plenty in music. I can tell you firsthand that if you agree to terms, sign the paper, and then turn around afterwards and try to demand more while also refusing to uphold your end of the signed deal, you'll get the shit sued out of you for breach, and you will lose. Rightfully so, I might add. YOU signed of your own freewill. You don't get to move the goalposts because you think you could get a better deal elsewhere.
I'm glad the guy got what he wanted in the end and I hope he finds what he's looking for, but this whole ordeal is in him and he's lucky they let him go without legal repercussions.
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Post by kingoftheindies on Dec 18, 2019 21:47:37 GMT -5
So, correct me if I'm wrong (sincerely, I may have missed something), but isn't the gist of this whole thing: He signed a contract, decided he was unhappy with it because other companies might give him mote, asked for a new one, they made him an offer he rejected (despite them not having to offer him anything at all because he already had a deal), he refused to work with them, so they held him to the terms of his original contract? Now, unless there is something I missed...I don't see how Impact is to blame here, and I certainly don't see how he was a "hostage". I've never really dealt with contracts in wrestling outside of verbal agreements, but I have dealt with them plenty in music. I can tell you firsthand that if you agree to terms, sign the paper, and then turn around afterwards and try to demand more while also refusing to uphold your end of the signed deal, you'll get the shit sued out of you for breach, and you will lose. Rightfully so, I might add. YOU signed of your own freewill. You don't get to move the goalposts because you think you could get a better deal elsewhere. I'm glad the guy got what he wanted in the end and I hope he finds what he's looking for, but this whole ordeal is in him and he's lucky they let him go without legal repercussions. The issue most have had is that many feel Impact should have said either work or you are gone but instead said not only will we not release you and not use you, but we will try and use our partnerships to limit your opportunities while you wait out... and reportedly also said they would make him sit out another year. Now personally, I feel all sides handled it poorly and I feel that Kross had an opportunity I the wings and tried to force his way out. Only thing I have to base that on is circumstantial evidence admittedly
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Post by CMPunkyBrewster on Dec 18, 2019 21:59:27 GMT -5
So, correct me if I'm wrong (sincerely, I may have missed something), but isn't the gist of this whole thing: He signed a contract, decided he was unhappy with it because other companies might give him mote, asked for a new one, they made him an offer he rejected (despite them not having to offer him anything at all because he already had a deal), he refused to work with them, so they held him to the terms of his original contract? Now, unless there is something I missed...I don't see how Impact is to blame here, and I certainly don't see how he was a "hostage". I've never really dealt with contracts in wrestling outside of verbal agreements, but I have dealt with them plenty in music. I can tell you firsthand that if you agree to terms, sign the paper, and then turn around afterwards and try to demand more while also refusing to uphold your end of the signed deal, you'll get the shit sued out of you for breach, and you will lose. Rightfully so, I might add. YOU signed of your own freewill. You don't get to move the goalposts because you think you could get a better deal elsewhere. I'm glad the guy got what he wanted in the end and I hope he finds what he's looking for, but this whole ordeal is in him and he's lucky they let him go without legal repercussions. The issue most have had is that many feel Impact should have said either work or you are gone but instead said not only will we not release you and not use you, but we will try and use our partnerships to limit your opportunities while you wait out... and reportedly also said they would make him sit out another year. Now personally, I feel all sides handled it poorly and I feel that Kross had an opportunity I the wings and tried to force his way out. Only thing I have to base that on is circumstantial evidence admittedly The issue is that if you put forth the "work or you're gone" argument, it sets the precedent that all you have to do is refuse to work and you'll get what you want. Avoiding that is literally one of the main reasons contracts exist to begin with. And to be blunt, sometimes you have to make an example of someone who has put you in that position to avoid others doing the same. If they had just let him sit out his contract but still work with other companies, they would have been utter fools and opened the door for any other talent to walk all over them whenever they wanted. Honestly, the info in your response made me even more certain that Impact was actually in the right here.
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Post by brettappedout (BLM) on Dec 18, 2019 22:32:01 GMT -5
Maybe bring him in as Balor's heavy?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 19, 2019 6:41:44 GMT -5
Rename him GROSS.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 19, 2019 7:14:25 GMT -5
Kross was the initial one in the wrong, but Impact kept him months after they had already made their point and they were actively trying to pressure other places not to book him either, all while refusing to do so themselves.
Had they just had him continue putting in work for the agreed rate that'd be one thing, or even if they'd just had him benched for a month or two to cool off his momentum and then let him go, but they basically spent seven months trying to keep the guy from having any income at all out of spite, all while hanging the option over his head to potentially force him to stick around another year past that. They were the good guys right up until they weren't.
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Post by The Dark Order Inferno on Dec 19, 2019 9:08:06 GMT -5
Impact needed to put their foot down or face being in a situation where this happens continually whenever a guy wants more money or feels they've had enough if a push to have a chance at getting a WWE contract. The problem is they kept the foot down long after that point was made, they should have made a settlement where both sides could part ways relatively happy. Put over X,Y or whomever and be on your way... But no, and they came off as the villains for standing their ground.
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Post by This Player Hating Mothman on Dec 19, 2019 9:17:33 GMT -5
The issue most have had is that many feel Impact should have said either work or you are gone but instead said not only will we not release you and not use you, but we will try and use our partnerships to limit your opportunities while you wait out... and reportedly also said they would make him sit out another year. Now personally, I feel all sides handled it poorly and I feel that Kross had an opportunity I the wings and tried to force his way out. Only thing I have to base that on is circumstantial evidence admittedly The issue is that if you put forth the "work or you're gone" argument, it sets the precedent that all you have to do is refuse to work and you'll get what you want. Avoiding that is literally one of the main reasons contracts exist to begin with. And to be blunt, sometimes you have to make an example of someone who has put you in that position to avoid others doing the same. If they had just let him sit out his contract but still work with other companies, they would have been utter fools and opened the door for any other talent to walk all over them whenever they wanted. Honestly, the info in your response made me even more certain that Impact was actually in the right here. But he didn't refuse. He was willing to work out his contract when the talks failed, and they refused to let him do that. Instead, they sent him home, leaned on AAA to take him off a card, released his wife at the same time when she wanted out, ran this weird proxy smear campaign through PWI talking up how they offered him the "six figure deal" he wanted but he was too greedy to take it (it turned out to be a cumulative six figures over three years which is not how that works), and reportedly from inside the locker room everyone just wanted them to cut him loose already because everyone thought this had gone on too long. There's a lot to this situation beyond a typical contract argument.
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Post by r. on Dec 19, 2019 11:09:45 GMT -5
I like how people don't think Kross and Scarlett won't end up as a cuck/crazy ex/oversexy lady angle on Smackdown. He'll debut as Killer Kuck. Cole will use his screaming 'It's BOSS time' line and change it to IT'S CUCK TIME!'
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Post by evilone on Dec 19, 2019 12:19:53 GMT -5
So did he refuse to work while still being signed? Or there is something else.
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Post by Celgress on Dec 19, 2019 13:31:00 GMT -5
It's about damn time.
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Post by El Cokehead del Knife Fight on Dec 19, 2019 18:37:35 GMT -5
So did he refuse to work while still being signed? Or there is something else. Impact punished him by not booking him after he publicly requested his release but he was reportedly willing to work through it until they worked something out. Most wrestling companies that offer long-term contracts will at least offer a downside guarantee (which isn't very much) if a worker isn't used and then they make the money from either being paid for each show they work or with merchandise. They stopped even using him which mean he wasn't making the vast majority of the money that he was making and then didn't advertise his merch and shuffled it to the discount bin so he couldn't make any money that way either. It's why everyone is critical of how Impact handled it; they were in the right initially and if they just dragged him from tv for a month or two then that'd be still reasonably fine but they kept on going for 7 months and stopped him from working a AAA show that was set up with their promoters license. The kicker was when they bragged about giving him a 6 figure contract which was actually something like 180k over three years which isn't that much considering that wrestlers generally cover their own travel costs and have higher premiums on medical insurance.
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Post by Steveweiser on Dec 20, 2019 5:41:22 GMT -5
Have a feeling that Kross is going to be the last free agent of this hot period, as there's rumours coming out of AEW that Tony Khan has buyer's remorse for some of the talent he's signed to contracts, and that it could be more likely that WWE or ROH will be after him. WWE more likely given that Scarlett Bordeaux is there.
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Post by kingoftheindies on Dec 20, 2019 12:06:00 GMT -5
Have a feeling that Kross is going to be the last free agent of this hot period, as there's rumours coming out of AEW that Tony Khan has buyer's remorse for some of the talent he's signed to contracts, and that it could be more likely that WWE or ROH will be after him. WWE more likely given that Scarlett Bordeaux is there. Hadn't heard this but I think it's pretty obvious what guys and gals Tony may be regretting. Ya just have to look at their usage
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Post by Hypnosis on Dec 20, 2019 16:46:09 GMT -5
Have a feeling that Kross is going to be the last free agent of this hot period, as there's rumours coming out of AEW that Tony Khan has buyer's remorse for some of the talent he's signed to contracts, and that it could be more likely that WWE or ROH will be after him. WWE more likely given that Scarlett Bordeaux is there. Looks like MLW:
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Post by Deleted on Dec 20, 2019 18:08:42 GMT -5
I like how people don't think Kross and Scarlett won't end up as a cuck/crazy ex/oversexy lady angle on Smackdown. Yeah, NXT is full of those storylines!
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Post by Dub H on Dec 20, 2019 18:18:56 GMT -5
I like how people don't think Kross and Scarlett won't end up as a cuck/crazy ex/oversexy lady angle on Smackdown. Depends how hot/ugly Vince thinks Kross is
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