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Post by The Summer of Muskrat XVII on May 29, 2020 15:00:39 GMT -5
Yeah, I've said for ages that doing a darker toned Man of Steel isn't an issue as long as you end that movie with Superman becoming this beacon of hope in that dark desperate world. By the time he stops (not kills) Zod, he should 100% be embracing the whole "Truth, Justice and The American Way" mantra. Hell, I'd probably drop all subtlety and actually have him in a lighter coloured costume and possible using different lighting on him for the end Even killing Zod wouldn't bother me if it had a proper narrative build and character consequence, but the problem was that Man of Steel played off its audience knowing the "Superman doesn't kill" rule, but didn't take any time to establish it in the movie, itself; if it had done that, then Clark having to make a quick decision and doing something he instantly regrets could've been powerful and a moment to define his character with (e.g. THIS is why he refuses to kill now), but it just failed to do so. But yeah, Man of Steel ends with him looking like he's about to become the Clark/Supes we all know; I don't mind him deviating from that in certain ways as long as it's done well, but again, the next movie just undid everything. Still so weird to look back on it, really baffling writing decisions all over. It’s almost as if BvS was written by 3 hacks who don’t understand character development. One of whom has a f***ing Oscar for screenwriting!!!
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Post by A Platypus Rave on May 29, 2020 15:21:19 GMT -5
Yeah, I've said for ages that doing a darker toned Man of Steel isn't an issue as long as you end that movie with Superman becoming this beacon of hope in that dark desperate world. By the time he stops (not kills) Zod, he should 100% be embracing the whole "Truth, Justice and The American Way" mantra. Hell, I'd probably drop all subtlety and actually have him in a lighter coloured costume and possible using different lighting on him for the end Even killing Zod wouldn't bother me if it had a proper narrative build and character consequence, but the problem was that Man of Steel played off its audience knowing the "Superman doesn't kill" rule, but didn't take any time to establish it in the movie, itself; if it had done that, then Clark having to make a quick decision and doing something he instantly regrets could've been powerful and a moment to define his character with (e.g. THIS is why he refuses to kill now), but it just failed to do so. But yeah, Man of Steel ends with him looking like he's about to become the Clark/Supes we all know; I don't mind him deviating from that in certain ways as long as it's done well, but again, the next movie just undid everything. Still so weird to look back on it, really baffling writing decisions all over. yeah as I said I was fine with killing Zod in theory... but the execution is horribly flawed... (pun not intended) there are about 100 other ways Superman could have stopped Zod in that specific circumstance... and secondly... this is Superman's being coming out... he is not a known thing... so the world is not wow Superman had to kill someone it's... ok holy shit that superpowerful guy in blue tights f***ing kills people I better stay on his good side. I've also stated Zod as a whole is a terrible choice for a first movie where we are supposed to be introduced to Supes... since... having the "this is what it would be like if Superman wanted to conquer" Doesn't work in a world where Superman doesn't really exist... then there's how Zod military genius strategist actively does things against his own self interest.... how Snyder undercuts his own story of nature vs. nurture in like the first 10 minutes... and just about everything with Jonathon Kent >_>
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Post by "Gizzark" Mike Wronglevenay on May 29, 2020 16:08:10 GMT -5
Cavill is a pretty well cast Superman who never gets given anything good to do, so... I look forward to thinking that about his movies some more, as will inevitably will happen.
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Post by Mighty Attack Tribble on May 29, 2020 16:24:38 GMT -5
It’s almost as if BvS was written by 3 hacks who don’t understand character development. One of whom has a f***ing Oscar for screenwriting!!! To be fair, Terrio's Oscar win came from a movie where the story already existed and had the benefit of Ben Affleck punching it up from start to finish. Literally everything he's written from scratch has been flaming hot garbage.
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Post by prettynami on May 29, 2020 17:35:53 GMT -5
Cool. But I still wish they would do another Man From U.N.C.L.E. with him.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2020 18:54:35 GMT -5
(why are he and Batman in conflict when they don’t have noticeably different personalities or outlooks?) Batman hates Superman for being an unstoppable rampaging monster that killed thousands of people and Superman hates Batman because the plot requires it.
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Post by Limity (BLM) on May 29, 2020 19:56:29 GMT -5
(why are he and Batman in conflict when they don’t have noticeably different personalities or outlooks?) Batman hates Superman for being an unstoppable rampaging monster that killed thousands of people and Superman hates Batman because the plot requires it. Throughout the movie it was made clear why Superman disliked Batman. The specific reasons for their fight at the end were contrived, and could have been easily settled if Superman had finished his explanation of Lex's manipulation.
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Bub (BLM)
Patti Mayonnaise
advocates duck on rodent violence
Fed. Up.
Posts: 37,742
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Post by Bub (BLM) on May 29, 2020 20:35:19 GMT -5
(why are he and Batman in conflict when they don’t have noticeably different personalities or outlooks?) Batman hates Superman for being an unstoppable rampaging monster that killed thousands of people and Superman hates Batman because the plot requires it. There's a reason for everything, but Zack Snyder forgot that he needed to actually film them. For example, did you know Lex Luthor was a weird nutcase because he'd been driven insane by Darkseid? Apparently that's the case, hence him doing the "PING PING PING" at the end of the film. But rather than have one scene where a couple of characters discuss his sudden erratic behavior, we were just left to believe he was a shit character reinvention.
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chrom
Backup Wench
Master of the rare undecuple post
Posts: 85,093
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Post by chrom on May 29, 2020 22:27:14 GMT -5
(why are he and Batman in conflict when they don’t have noticeably different personalities or outlooks?) Batman hates Superman for being an unstoppable rampaging monster that killed thousands of people and Superman hates Batman because the plot requires it. Batman with his xenophobia and hatred in that tumor of a movie came off more like Luthor.
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Post by A Platypus Rave on May 30, 2020 3:29:36 GMT -5
Batman hates Superman for being an unstoppable rampaging monster that killed thousands of people and Superman hates Batman because the plot requires it. There's a reason for everything, but Zack Snyder forgot that he needed to actually film them. For example, did you know Lex Luthor was a weird nutcase because he'd been driven insane by Darkseid? Apparently that's the case, hence him doing the "PING PING PING" at the end of the film. But rather than have one scene where a couple of characters discuss his sudden erratic behavior, we were just left to believe he was a shit character reinvention. we have like a 100 page thread on all teh shit Zack has talked about that wasn't actually in his damned 4 hour movie...
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