Ben Wyatt
Crow T. Robot
Are You Gonna Go My Way?
I don't get it. At all. It's kind of a small horse, I mean what am I missing? Am I crazy?
Posts: 41,529
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Post by Ben Wyatt on Jan 25, 2022 18:53:44 GMT -5
Ortiz juicer and gets in first ballot cause he is likeabke They can kick rocks He appeared on one dubious list from 2003 in which the substance was never identified. He tested clean the rest of his career, where he carried the Red Sox to 3 titles.
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Post by häšhtå.gdālėÿ on Jan 25, 2022 19:35:06 GMT -5
Fxxx the BBWAA. Further proving my point that had Binds kissed babies he’d have been in 10 years ago. Electing a dude with a positive strike on the year Bonds finishes. Go fxxx yourselves.
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Post by Cyno on Jan 25, 2022 19:38:35 GMT -5
Ortiz juicer and gets in first ballot cause he is likeabke They can kick rocks He appeared on one dubious list from 2003 in which the substance was never identified. He tested clean the rest of his career, where he carried the Red Sox to 3 titles. Bonds and Clemens never tested positive either. Either you vote the PED guys in who deserve it, or you die on that hill. It's the height of hypocrisy from the people who voted for Ortiz and not Bonds or Clemens and exposes the BBWAA vote as a glorified popularity contest. And the only person to make excuses about the alleged dubious nature of that list (which was conveniently ignored for everyone else on there BUT Ortiz) was Rob Manfred, who I wouldn't trust if he told me the sky was blue.
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Post by Toilet Paper Roll on Jan 25, 2022 19:51:48 GMT -5
Unless they’re willing to omit the statistics that these guys earned through their careers as if they never happened then you put them in.
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Ben Wyatt
Crow T. Robot
Are You Gonna Go My Way?
I don't get it. At all. It's kind of a small horse, I mean what am I missing? Am I crazy?
Posts: 41,529
|
Post by Ben Wyatt on Jan 25, 2022 19:55:58 GMT -5
He appeared on one dubious list from 2003 in which the substance was never identified. He tested clean the rest of his career, where he carried the Red Sox to 3 titles. Bonds and Clemens never tested positive either. Either you vote the PED guys in who deserve it, or you die on that hill. It's the height of hypocrisy from the people who voted for Ortiz and not Bonds or Clemens and exposes the BBWAA vote as a glorified popularity contest. And the only person to make excuses about the alleged dubious nature of that list (which was conveniently ignored for everyone else on there BUT Ortiz) was Rob Manfred, who I wouldn't trust if he told me the sky was blue. Oh I agree 1000%. Clemens, Bonds,A-Rod, Manny....put ALL of em im
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Jan 25, 2022 20:00:41 GMT -5
He appeared on one dubious list from 2003 in which the substance was never identified. He tested clean the rest of his career, where he carried the Red Sox to 3 titles. Bonds and Clemens never tested positive either. Either you vote the PED guys in who deserve it, or you die on that hill. It's the height of hypocrisy from the people who voted for Ortiz and not Bonds or Clemens and exposes the BBWAA vote as a glorified popularity contest. And the only person to make excuses about the alleged dubious nature of that list (which was conveniently ignored for everyone else on there BUT Ortiz) was Rob Manfred, who I wouldn't trust if he told me the sky was blue. My thing is you can't pick and choose who gets in from a dirty era You know and don't know who the hell was on shit. Accept it and move on. The era speaks for itself and you can't just erase it like MLB likes to do about everything
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Post by Cyno on Jan 25, 2022 20:12:05 GMT -5
Bonds and Clemens never tested positive either. Either you vote the PED guys in who deserve it, or you die on that hill. It's the height of hypocrisy from the people who voted for Ortiz and not Bonds or Clemens and exposes the BBWAA vote as a glorified popularity contest. And the only person to make excuses about the alleged dubious nature of that list (which was conveniently ignored for everyone else on there BUT Ortiz) was Rob Manfred, who I wouldn't trust if he told me the sky was blue. My thing is you can't pick and choose who gets in from a dirty era You know and don't know who the hell was on shit. Accept it and move on. The era speaks for itself and you can't just erase it like MLB likes to do about everything Exactly. So many dudes from that era were on the juice that you just can't pretend they didn't exist. Acknowledge that it was a dirty era, but f***, even A-Rod was suspended on anecdotal evidence from that dealer guy snitching on him. IIRC, he never failed a test either.
I'd vote for all of them. A-Rod, Clemens, Bonds, Ramirez. Hell, the only guy I would've originally been iffy on is Ortiz because he was just a DH. But Edgar Martinez got in as a DH, so that ship's sailed. The offensive numbers speak for themselves.
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Post by Clash, Never a Meter Maid on Jan 25, 2022 20:13:37 GMT -5
Damn, Rolen can’t get some more love? Look at that OPS+, look at those defensive runs saved. The one guy on the main ballot vote going in this year’s gotta be the dude who caused me all that rage in ‘04 and ‘13? Bleh.
Honestly, I’m still baffled Steve Garvey isn’t in yet. Same with Dave Parker, Keith Hernandez, Curt Flood, Jorge Posada, I could go on.
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Post by Cyno on Jan 25, 2022 20:17:34 GMT -5
Posada you can argue that as good as he was as a hitting catcher, he wasn't a particularly good backstop. And his offense, while good, was not amazing enough to make up for that like with Mike Piazza.
He's a borderline guy but even as a big Yankee fan I'd lean more towards "no."
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Jan 25, 2022 20:41:32 GMT -5
Posada you can argue that as good as he was as a hitting catcher, he wasn't a particularly good backstop. And his offense, while good, was not amazing enough to make up for that like with Mike Piazza. He's a borderline guy but even as a big Yankee fan I'd lean more towards "no." Doesn't help that you can argue he is 4th or 5th on the all time great Catcher Yankees list eithe
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Post by RI Richmark on Jan 25, 2022 20:53:07 GMT -5
Fxxx the BBWAA. Further proving my point that had Binds kissed babies he’d have been in 10 years ago. Electing a dude with a positive strike on the year Bonds finishes. Go fxxx yourselves. Thing is if Bonds or Clemens had 15 years (which was the rule when they first appeared on the ballot) instead of 10 they probably would have made it in. Their numbers were going up every year. I got the feeling the old writers had the rules changed knowing their younger colleagues would vote them in.
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Push R Truth
Patti Mayonnaise
Unique and Special Snowflake, and a pants-less heathen.
Perpetually Constipated
Posts: 39,310
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Post by Push R Truth on Jan 25, 2022 20:58:57 GMT -5
I just assume that for like 100 years straight nearly every player was some amphetamines. A bunch right now are on Adderall (prescribed). And like none of these turd voters gives a shit. That shit is a serious PED. Now on to Steroids, they didn't just pop out of nowhere in the late 80's. They've likely been used but tons of current Hall of Famers especially in the 70's/80's. But screw that shit let's just pick on Bonds and tell him to suck it because it makes our wrinkly old journalistic ballsacks feel better or some bullshit because he was a poopyface or something. It's the Hall of Fame, not the Hall of Nice Guys.
What a farce.
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Post by Cyno on Jan 25, 2022 21:20:28 GMT -5
Gaylord Perry is in and he was a blatant cheater with spitballing and other doctoring of the ball lol.
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Jan 25, 2022 21:22:14 GMT -5
I just assume that for like 100 years straight nearly every player was some amphetamines. A bunch right now are on Adderall (prescribed). And like none of these turd voters gives a shit. That shit is a serious PED. Now on to Steroids, they didn't just pop out of nowhere in the late 80's. They've likely been used but tons of current Hall of Famers especially in the 70's/80's. But screw that shit let's just pick on Bonds and tell him to suck it because it makes our wrinkly old journalistic ballsacks feel better or some bullshit because he was a poopyface or something. It's the Hall of Fame, not the Hall of Nice Guys. What a farce. Ain't nothing you can't tell me that dudes in the 20's wasn't fueled the f*** up eating testosterone filled hot dogs and burgers along with the greenies in later generations to keep them "awake"
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ghost
Don Corleone
Posts: 1,795
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Post by ghost on Jan 25, 2022 21:28:21 GMT -5
Bonds is a very interesting case when it comes to the court of public opinion. Forget about the alleged PED's or his treatment of the media, this is a man with an (alleged) domestic violence history on top of that, with at least two different women. It sounds like he was just a rotten person in general during his playing years. Yet, not only is the baseball world celebrating him today, but so are NBA players and others in the media/entertainment looking around Twitter. Don't get me wrong, he should be in the HOF, and so should Clemens, ARod, Manny, Clemens, Schilling, and Sosa. I just find it fascinating that in 2022, where saying something that a handful of people find offensive can turn the public against you, Bonds seems to have unimpeachable support.
With that said, Ortiz deserves to be in. Yeah being a DH hurts him, but offensively he was more than justified, and the clutch/playoff numbers speak for themselves.
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Post by RI Richmark on Jan 25, 2022 21:38:07 GMT -5
Before I start I do want to say that it's just plain wrong that Barry Bonds and Roger Clemens are not in the Hall. They are among the greatest hitters and pitchers respectively of any generation.
But I am overjoyed that David Ortiz is going to the Hall. The man brought so much joy into my life. Tanks in a large part to him Red Sox fans got to witness the moment they always dreamed of. Then he brought them two more. Sox fans have gone from cursed to blessed tanks to him.
I'm going to spend the rest of the night watching highlights but this will surely be my favorite:
THIS IS OUR F***ING HALL OF FAMER!!!
Thank You, Papi.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Jan 25, 2022 21:48:05 GMT -5
Fxxx the BBWAA. Further proving my point that had Binds kissed babies he’d have been in 10 years ago. Electing a dude with a positive strike on the year Bonds finishes. Go fxxx yourselves. He's getting in via the Old Timers next year.
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Post by sfvega on Jan 25, 2022 22:14:52 GMT -5
Bonds is a very interesting case when it comes to the court of public opinion. Forget about the alleged PED's or his treatment of the media, this is a man with an (alleged) domestic violence history on top of that, with at least two different women. It sounds like he was just a rotten person in general during his playing years. Yet, not only is the baseball world celebrating him today, but so are NBA players and others in the media/entertainment looking around Twitter. Don't get me wrong, he should be in the HOF, and so should Clemens, ARod, Manny, Clemens, Schilling, and Sosa. I just find it fascinating that in 2022, where saying something that a handful of people find offensive can turn the public against you, Bonds seems to have unimpeachable support. With that said, Ortiz deserves to be in. Yeah being a DH hurts him, but offensively he was more than justified, and the clutch/playoff numbers speak for themselves. What are you talking about? Bonds got shit on for about 15 years after his retirement. I, and many others, still detest the guy. But this isn't about whether or not he's a morally good person, it's merely that he played the game at a higher level than many HOFers while steroid use clearly isn't a deal-breaker for the voters.
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ghost
Don Corleone
Posts: 1,795
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Post by ghost on Jan 25, 2022 22:35:56 GMT -5
Bonds is a very interesting case when it comes to the court of public opinion. Forget about the alleged PED's or his treatment of the media, this is a man with an (alleged) domestic violence history on top of that, with at least two different women. It sounds like he was just a rotten person in general during his playing years. Yet, not only is the baseball world celebrating him today, but so are NBA players and others in the media/entertainment looking around Twitter. Don't get me wrong, he should be in the HOF, and so should Clemens, ARod, Manny, Clemens, Schilling, and Sosa. I just find it fascinating that in 2022, where saying something that a handful of people find offensive can turn the public against you, Bonds seems to have unimpeachable support. With that said, Ortiz deserves to be in. Yeah being a DH hurts him, but offensively he was more than justified, and the clutch/playoff numbers speak for themselves. What are you talking about? Bonds got shit on for about 15 years after his retirement. I, and many others, still detest the guy. But this isn't about whether or not he's a morally good person, it's merely that he played the game at a higher level than many HOFers while steroid use clearly isn't a deal-breaker for the voters. Bonds got shit on for PED’s and how he treated the media, not DV allegations. Which rightly or wrongly, is something that voters can factor in due to the morality clause or whatever that’s called. Whether you think a character clause should exist in the first place is another story. I just find it baffling that people are running to support Bonds despite something in his past (accused of more than once) that would get someone exiled today in the court of public opinion. Bonds being a prick is not news. I think people may not be aware of how much of one he actually was, and that’s going to hurt him in cases like this where personal bias is involved. That’s just reality. Also, when I said unimpeachable support, I’m talking about social media’s reaction today, not the last 15 years. No one has said a negative thing about him.
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Post by "Evil Brood" Jackson Vanik on Jan 26, 2022 0:09:40 GMT -5
Not only is the vote a disgrace, they purposefully reduced the number of years you remain on the ballot after both Bonds and Clemens started appearing on it in a blatant effort to keep them out. And it worked. They would've gotten in with five more years.
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