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Post by Vice honcho room temperature on Dec 18, 2020 10:40:08 GMT -5
... as he was in the Invasion. Even more crazy Vince and Co just flushed it down the toilet.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 18, 2020 12:43:03 GMT -5
If RVD was a full time WWF guy in 1999-2000, he probably would have been pushed a lot more. After WCW was bought out, that is when Vince started his "I'm going to do whatever I want" mindset (after being more desperate/openminded in 1997-00), and that mindset has existed ever since. RVD might have been the first example of not pushing who the fans really wanted post-WCW.
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Bad Moon
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Post by Bad Moon on Dec 18, 2020 13:09:50 GMT -5
If RVD was a full time WWF guy in 1999-2000, he probably would have been pushed a lot more. After WCW was bought out, that is when Vince started his "I'm going to do whatever I want" mindset (after being more desperate/openminded in 1997-00), and that mindset has existed ever since. RVD might have been the first example of not pushing who the fans really wanted post-WCW. I've said it before, without RVD's success (brief as it was) in 2006 there wouldn't have been a Punk in 2011 or a Bryan in 2014. |
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Post by corndog on Dec 18, 2020 13:31:50 GMT -5
If RVD was a full time WWF guy in 1999-2000, he probably would have been pushed a lot more. After WCW was bought out, that is when Vince started his "I'm going to do whatever I want" mindset (after being more desperate/openminded in 1997-00), and that mindset has existed ever since. RVD might have been the first example of not pushing who the fans really wanted post-WCW. This is true, but what really made the RVD situation weird was Vince giving him wins over top guys, like Austin in his Hardcore Title defenses, but then getting squashed by HHH. The common theme around this time period was Vince feeding guys to HHH, despite being much more over. Jericho is another example of this, getting wins over Austin/Rock in one night to win the unified title, but then looking weak during his title reign and just being a casualty of HHH at Wrestlemania. I don't think HHH has more clean wins over anyone than Jericho. |
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Post by EvenBaldobombHasAJob on Dec 18, 2020 13:37:03 GMT -5
If RVD was a full time WWF guy in 1999-2000, he probably would have been pushed a lot more. After WCW was bought out, that is when Vince started his "I'm going to do whatever I want" mindset (after being more desperate/openminded in 1997-00), and that mindset has existed ever since. RVD might have been the first example of not pushing who the fans really wanted post-WCW. This is true, but what really made the RVD situation weird was Vince giving him wins over top guys, like Austin in his Hardcore Title defenses, but then getting squashed by HHH. The common theme around this time period was Vince feeding guys to HHH, despite being much more over. Jericho is another example of this, getting wins over Austin/Rock in one night to win the unified title, but then looking weak during his title reign and just being a casualty of HHH at Wrestlemania. I don't think HHH has more clean wins over anyone than Jericho. In Jericho's case it comes down at least as much to professional jealousy. Right when Triple H's big main event push starts this other guy shows up whose just flat out better than him and more over than he could ever hope to be (keeping in mind I say this as a fan of Triple H). He couldn't do anything about Steve or Rocky and he owed Mick too much to do anything to him, so he took it out on Chris Jericho instead (honestly would X-pad have ever given him the thumbs down as a worker when asked by Vince if he wasn't one of Hunters best friends?). He also made a point of making Kurt Angle look like a clown who wasn't in his league every chance he got but since Kurt's entire appeal was "total dork" to begin with, it didn't really work. |
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Squirrel Master
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Post by Squirrel Master on Dec 18, 2020 14:13:20 GMT -5
Mr. Monday Night
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Post by Deleted on Dec 18, 2020 14:25:44 GMT -5
He quickly made an enemy out of every top guy there at the time so its surprising he even got the push he did and wasn't completely buried.
When Angle was world champion in Sep/Oct 2001 his wife Karen (years before she was known to most wrestling fans) posted a rant on his official website about RVD being a dangerous worker and how Kurt had wrestled RVD 4 or 5 times and came home with a different injury each time. There was a ridiculous spell when he hardway busted open Austin, Angle, Jericho, Kane, both Hardys and probably more names I can't recall. The Observer had a new story every week at the time about him having heat for not protecting people in the ring. The Rock refused to take the Van Daminator or the Van Terminator when he worked with him. Not surprisingly, Undertaker chewed him out about it. Everyone remembers the frog splash spot at Survivor Series too when HHH could have died.
After a while the stories died down and I guess he learned how to work a safer WWF style but that first year or two was rough. He was making Nia Jax look like a safe worker.
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Cranjis McBasketball
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Knew what the hell that thing was supposed to be
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Post by Cranjis McBasketball on Dec 18, 2020 14:33:55 GMT -5
This is true, but what really made the RVD situation weird was Vince giving him wins over top guys, like Austin in his Hardcore Title defenses, but then getting squashed by HHH. The common theme around this time period was Vince feeding guys to HHH, despite being much more over. Jericho is another example of this, getting wins over Austin/Rock in one night to win the unified title, but then looking weak during his title reign and just being a casualty of HHH at Wrestlemania. I don't think HHH has more clean wins over anyone than Jericho. In Jericho's case it comes down at least as much to professional jealousy. Right when Triple H's big main event push starts this other guy shows up whose just flat out better than him and more over than he could ever hope to be (keeping in mind I say this as a fan of Triple H). He couldn't do anything about Steve or Rocky and he owed Mick too much to do anything to him, so he took it out on Chris Jericho instead (honestly would X-pad have ever given him the thumbs down as a worker when asked by Vince if he wasn't one of Hunters best friends?). He also made a point of making Kurt Angle look like a clown who wasn't in his league every chance he got but since Kurt's entire appeal was "total dork" to begin with, it didn't really work. X-PAC gave Jericho the thumbs up and basically saved his job. |
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Post by EvenBaldobombHasAJob on Dec 18, 2020 14:38:32 GMT -5
In Jericho's case it comes down at least as much to professional jealousy. Right when Triple H's big main event push starts this other guy shows up whose just flat out better than him and more over than he could ever hope to be (keeping in mind I say this as a fan of Triple H). He couldn't do anything about Steve or Rocky and he owed Mick too much to do anything to him, so he took it out on Chris Jericho instead (honestly would X-pad have ever given him the thumbs down as a worker when asked by Vince if he wasn't one of Hunters best friends?). He also made a point of making Kurt Angle look like a clown who wasn't in his league every chance he got but since Kurt's entire appeal was "total dork" to begin with, it didn't really work. X-PAC gave Jericho the thumbs up and basically saved his job. Really? Then who was it who told Vince he was too stiff and couldn't hang? I coulda swore it was X-Pac. I know somebody did. |
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Cranjis McBasketball
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Knew what the hell that thing was supposed to be
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Post by Cranjis McBasketball on Dec 18, 2020 14:43:31 GMT -5
X-PAC gave Jericho the thumbs up and basically saved his job. Really? Then who was it who told Vince he was too stiff and couldn't hang? I coulda swore it was X-Pac. I know somebody did. I feel like those names aren’t out there. The way Jericho tells the story Vince ran him down about how much he sucked and his contract wasnt worth the paper it was written on and then said “You’re wrestling X-Pac, if you can’t have a good match with him, you can’t have one with anyone”. So someone between his debut and a Raw match with X-Pac. |
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Post by James Fabiano on Dec 18, 2020 14:44:44 GMT -5
X-PAC gave Jericho the thumbs up and basically saved his job. Really? Then who was it who told Vince he was too stiff and couldn't hang? I coulda swore it was X-Pac. I know somebody did. I know it came about because he potatoed Chyna. |
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Post by EvenBaldobombHasAJob on Dec 18, 2020 14:46:09 GMT -5
Really? Then who was it who told Vince he was too stiff and couldn't hang? I coulda swore it was X-Pac. I know somebody did. I know it came about because he potatoed Chyna. That might explain why he spares her no sympathy when talking in his books about what a lousy worker she was. |
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Post by David-Arquette was in WCW 2000 on Dec 18, 2020 17:03:21 GMT -5
During the Invasion angle I was constantly wondering why he wasn't pushed. They definitely missed an opportunity.
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Dec 18, 2020 21:05:50 GMT -5
Vince actually kind of liked RVD but RVD general nature was never going to allow him to be or stay at the top
Taker admitted on the 2nd podcast with Austin, when they were talking Mania matches for Taker, he was mentioning people thought he would pick to work with RVD over Flair.
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thegame415
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Post by thegame415 on Dec 18, 2020 22:15:47 GMT -5
Um, I think he was pushed pretty good, actually.
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Dec 18, 2020 22:20:44 GMT -5
I know it came about because he potatoed Chyna. That might explain why he spares her no sympathy when talking in his books about what a lousy worker she was. When Jericho and HHH talked on his podcast a few years ago, HHH admitted that Jericho had heat early on and no one really wanted to go to bat for him Something with Chyna was mentioned |
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Dec 18, 2020 22:21:32 GMT -5
Um, I think he was pushed pretty good, actually. And ultimately, RVD proved Vince and Co. right about never giving him that big push because years later he squandered it when he did |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 18, 2020 22:35:57 GMT -5
They liked him and pushed him pretty good until he refused the Stephanie romance angle that Vince came up with for him.Being nonchalant about hurting guys,refusing angles your boss comes up with and threatening backstage personnel quickly got him back to the midcard.
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Post by koreycaskets on Dec 19, 2020 1:20:46 GMT -5
I think he was overly fairly good in those few 97 brief appearances as well.
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Lupin the Third
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Post by Lupin the Third on Dec 19, 2020 1:41:31 GMT -5
I actually liked his first Invasion theme. The one that evolved into One of A Kind.
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