Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 2, 2021 13:25:05 GMT -5
The main takeaway I'm getting from hearing Tommy End talk about this is that this guy's going to do some crazy shit with his character when left to his own devices. The man used mood lighting and tarot cards in his gear for matches against the f***ing Singh Brothers. If this man finds a new home he is going to go wild. Which doesn't surprise me, given how he was on the indies, but I think he's had a lot of time to creatively feel things out and develop, and if he can find a singular anchor point, he might really f***ing take it to the moon. I have my qualms about it right now but man I would LOVE Aleister making a stop over in Azteca Underground if that does end up beoming an actual show just because of how deep and creative this man takes his character. The thought of him playing off of Dario is a gawd damn dream.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 2, 2021 13:25:08 GMT -5
If they ever let Bray go. I want him to lead Dark Order....... Bray's in a tricky position I think. They pretty much treat him as a complete afterthought and I'm sure he's one of their less-used big money guys like Braun is, but he sells merch hand over fist and that might make them deem him worth keeping around despite clearly not actually wanting to position him as a big deal.
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chazraps
Wade Wilson
Better have my money when I come-a collect!
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Post by chazraps on Jun 2, 2021 13:25:24 GMT -5
Remember after Brodie Lee passed, and Braun took a fan's tribute painting of Bray, Strowman, Rowan and Cody waving to Brodie in Heaven, and then proceeded to not just remove Cody from the pic but remove the fan's signature from the painting? Not cropped, but outright blurred over? And then didn't credit the artist in any way? Was that kind of a glimpse into Braun? Pretty sure Braun didn't crop the picture, but took the already cropped one and reposted it. Nope, it was him. And it wasn't that the artist's name was cropped, it was removed. And Cody, who was in the middle of the image, was removed as well.
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Post by A Platypus Rave is Correct on Jun 2, 2021 13:25:48 GMT -5
This stuff from Tommy also confirms what we knew - the actual creative team isn't totally the issue. Vince has to get out of the way. Like literally everyone leaving the company has said that, even people that didn't have any reason to hold back like Moxley who basically trashed Vince in his entire shoot pointed out Creative had plenty of awesome sounding ideas that Vince refused to do... or agreed to one week and cut the next.
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Post by kingoftheindies on Jun 2, 2021 13:25:52 GMT -5
I wouldnt be shocked if Black is happy with the release. Not that he wanted to lose his job but as Tommy End he immediately gets a lot of his value back. Hell dig up Michael Dante and he can even have a run somewhere as the Sumerian Death Squad again.
Ruby will likely go to Impact to rebuild her image. Heidi Lovelace was quite a talent but both in NXT and on the main roster she got done dirty
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Bo Rida
Fry's dog Seymour
Pulled one over on everyone. Got away with it, this time.
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Post by Bo Rida on Jun 2, 2021 13:26:07 GMT -5
Wow crazy. Not so long ago they were offering huge contracts to the likes of The Good Bros and now they're getting rid of Braun after investing so much into him.
Admittedly I think he's reached his ceiling in WWE but that hasn't kept them keeping others around long past their peak. He's still got enough to offer for now.
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Post by A Platypus Rave is Correct on Jun 2, 2021 13:27:24 GMT -5
Black said he has a good relationship with Vince and Vince always praised his honesty and creativity. He’s saying not to knock the creative team as they are very good and he’s praising Bruce Prichard a lot. I don't think anyone blames their creative team for their problems. It's clearly Vince that is the issue, he's been the problem for years and years. I've seen people on this board still take shots at creative for having nothing for people or the "uncreative" line... when again we have had multiple people say time and time again it's not creative... it's Vince.
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Post by HisRoyalGreeness on Jun 2, 2021 13:27:37 GMT -5
In Black’s case wouldn’t it be a Budgen cut?
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Mecca
Wade Wilson
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Post by Mecca on Jun 2, 2021 13:27:47 GMT -5
This stuff from Tommy also confirms what we knew - the actual creative team isn't totally the issue. Vince has to get out of the way. Like literally everyone leaving the company has said that, even people that didn't have any reason to hold back like Moxley who basically trashed Vince in his entire shoot pointed out Creative had plenty of awesome sounding ideas that Vince refused to do... or agreed to one week and cut the next. Vince is really old and senile and has no concept of the times we live in now, everyone knows this but he's in charge.
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Post by Finish Uncle Muffin’s Story on Jun 2, 2021 13:28:15 GMT -5
Black/Ricochet was such a good thrown together team, too. I think this era will be remembered as one where WWE squandered some of the best wrestlers on the planet. Man.
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Post by kingoftheindies on Jun 2, 2021 13:28:43 GMT -5
Black said he has a good relationship with Vince and Vince always praised his honesty and creativity. He’s saying not to knock the creative team as they are very good and he’s praising Bruce Prichard a lot. A lot of them don't seem to understand they'll say one thing to your face while doing something different, Mox got it. Well even Brodie said Vince was always nice and honest with him but you have to make sure you have his undivided attention. Others have said as well that even doing a promo in front of Vince if he doesn't like an inflection you use is enough for him to change his mind. Now the fact that you have so many yes men around him doesn't help though even as agents.
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spagett
Hank Scorpio
Great Job!
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Post by spagett on Jun 2, 2021 13:28:59 GMT -5
I don't think anyone blames their creative team for their problems. It's clearly Vince that is the issue, he's been the problem for years and years. I've seen people on this board still take shots at creative for having nothing for people or the "uncreative" line... when again we have had multiple people say time and time again it's not creative... it's Vince. I absolutely used to trash the creative team for a long time but it's just so obvious now it really isn't their fault. I was really mistaken They have absolutely no chance of writing anything good when they have a crazy old guy as boss who changes his mind every week.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 2, 2021 13:30:08 GMT -5
I will be mystified if WWE actually does release Bray. That would be the ultimate indictment of the company's inability to get out of its own way and allow stars to organically develop. The Fiend was over to a level that few things in wrestling have been in the last five years or so, and they just completely squandered that to a point where we're discussing his release as a realistic possibility just over a year later.
That said, he's someone who would absolutely go to AEW and would probably thrive there with the creative reins taken off. His family has such a long history with the Rhodes, he's someone I would legitimately be excited to see in AEW.
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pinja
Unicron
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Post by pinja on Jun 2, 2021 13:30:10 GMT -5
Pretty sure Braun didn't crop the picture, but took the already cropped one and reposted it. Nope, it was him. And it wasn't that the artist's name was cropped, it was removed. And Cody, who was in the middle of the image, was removed as well. I know the pictures, I don't know if it was him retouching the original, I remember someone pointing out it was posted before Strowman did so, but the remark went pretty much under. Besides that, I don't doubt Strowman is an unpleasent guy after his shared thoughts about being unemployed as an indie wrestler.
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Mecca
Wade Wilson
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Post by Mecca on Jun 2, 2021 13:30:18 GMT -5
Wow crazy. Not so long ago they were offering huge contracts to the likes of The Good Bros and now they're getting rid of Braun after investing so much into him. Admittedly I think he's reached his ceiling in WWE but that hasn't kept them keeping others around long past their peak. He's still got enough to offer for now. Well whether it is to sell or not let's be honest here. Why were they giving out those deals? No matter who is on tv the ratings stay about the same, on a strictly business plane they were wasting a lot of money for the same return. If no matter who I put out there I get the same audience, the same ticket buys etc etc why should I spend more than I have to? I feel like a big reason a sell would happen is 2.5 mill seems to be their fan ceiling, they basically sold the network because they capped on subscribers and it never moved. They created a company that is always profitable but also has a finite ceiling. It's like a solid double now instead of taking a chance at homeruns but also striking out.
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Post by A Platypus Rave is Correct on Jun 2, 2021 13:30:30 GMT -5
Like literally everyone leaving the company has said that, even people that didn't have any reason to hold back like Moxley who basically trashed Vince in his entire shoot pointed out Creative had plenty of awesome sounding ideas that Vince refused to do... or agreed to one week and cut the next. Vince is really old and senile and has no concept of the times we live in now, everyone knows this but he's in charge. I'm not sure if it's senility or just straight stubbornness, he's always been stubborn but stuff like that gets worse when you get older. But Yes, a lot of the WWE's problems could be fixed if Vince agreed to ether step aside and just be like the figurehead or step down entirely... (I say could because that does depend on who they put in position to have final say) Neither of which are things Vince will ever do.
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Post by WoodStoner1 on Jun 2, 2021 13:30:33 GMT -5
I don't think anyone blames their creative team for their problems. It's clearly Vince that is the issue, he's been the problem for years and years. I've seen people on this board still take shots at creative for having nothing for people or the "uncreative" line... when again we have had multiple people say time and time again it's not creative... it's Vince. So if they are selling, that'll be a good thing, right? Then again...let's remember when a company/franchise with a fanbase disillusioned by its creator's decisions was sold to a major (THE major?) corporation. Started out promising (albeit playing it safe). Then came The Last Jedi, and we are definitely stuck with valleys and occasional peaks (Mandalorian). A fresh take is a good thing, depends on the take and how long they can maintain it.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 2, 2021 13:31:19 GMT -5
I guess I'll be rewatching Black vs. Andrade from Takeover: New Orleans at some point this week. *sigh*
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Mecca
Wade Wilson
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Post by Mecca on Jun 2, 2021 13:31:49 GMT -5
I will be mystified if WWE actually does release Bray. That would be the ultimate indictment of the company's inability to get out of its own way and allow stars to organically develop. The Fiend was over to a level that few things in wrestling have been in the last five years or so, and they just completely squandered that to a point where we're discussing his release as a realistic possibility just over a year later. That said, he's someone who would absolutely go to AEW and would probably thrive there with the creative reins taken off. His family has such a long history with the Rhodes, he's someone I would legitimately be excited to see in AEW. I wouldn't, no one moves the needle so no one is untouchable.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 2, 2021 13:32:11 GMT -5
It is not just Vince though yea he is the end all problem but you also have to deal with all the f***ing yes men in his ear.
I remember the story I forget who it was that was doing pretty well on air and even was good in Vince's eyes but as soon as they left the room Kevin Dunn buried them to Vince basically bullshitting untrue things about them to Vince and then the push suddenly vanished.
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