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Post by Deleted on Sept 10, 2021 12:57:45 GMT -5
Yeah...as a black man it's the biggest reason why I'm not fully in on AEW. I wanna see more black superstars in leading spots. I said this was an issue when AEW started and years later while there's been little progress, it's little and it's pretty clear they're not progressing fast enough. Same to a similar degree with other races although I'm happy when people like the Lucha Bros get their shine as rightfully deserved. At the end of the day though, we just need a lot more minority representation.
It's also, interestingly enough, the main reason why I keep up with WWE. You've got Lashley and MVP, Bianca, New Day, Hit Row, Sasha when she does her thing, upcoming guys in NXT, we can't forget Street Profits, I'm seeing way more diversity there. Before anyone comes with a "well a lot of these stars were known before" then lemme tell you that it took Bianca a few months to be a main eventer. AEW has been studying the landscape for a while and the fact it's taken them years just seems weird. Maybe they weren't studying hard enough, maybe they didn't care hard enough but it's surely a big mark. When Cody and Brandi made those diversity comments surely they saw that they needed more in the company. Point is, they dropped the ball.
I'll keep it a buck: I'm never gonna be fully 100% in on AEW until this representation issue is settled. As someone who was the only black kid in my 4th grade class, watching all of this is cool and all but I don't see anyone who a younger me can go "man he's like me and he's doing it big." We got Hobbs, we got Lee M. who was just signed but that's far different than turning on WWE and seeing Lashley ruling, Hit Row, New Day being funny, Big E doing his thing, Bianca, it's just a different world. It brings me back to when I went to a live event in 2012 and I saw 2 black kids (had to be like 5-6) yelling and screaming at Ezekiel Jackson. All they saw was who he looked like, someone they knew, and they fell in love with wrestling. It matters.
As for what they need to do, what AEW needs to do is look at all of their minorities there and think "alright, we've talked about diversity so much in that first year and yet we haven't done enough, it's time to do it" and start booking things accordingly. It's just such a huge divide between white talent and people of color that it's jarring at times. Like when I saw that segment at the end with The Elite and Bryan coming out I was thinking "yeah this is cool and all but man", I don't know. They've got people who believe in diversity such as Cody, Brandi and even Tony himself so we will see what they can do. Kenny Omega believse in diversity as well so yeah, they've got people in the back there. I'm just not sure what they're doing to push this.
That's just my opinion on it. If people don't get it then tbh I don't expect em to. To this day a lot of people didn't see nor understand the whole racism stuff in Kofi's WM storyline so I'm not surprised.
One positive is that this has been a huge topic over the past week on social media. Whether it's fans, wrestlers, former writers, those in hip-hop, more people are noticing this, pushing this and more are chiming in so the more it happens, the bigger and sooner change will come. I just hope it comes soon because until then it's just never going to be something I'm fully in on because I don't feel we're being represented enough right now.
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kidkamikaze10
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Post by kidkamikaze10 on Sept 10, 2021 12:57:47 GMT -5
C'mon man, don't play it like that. I'll happily say that there's not a black wrestler currently on the level of the people you've stated, and that has absolutely nothing to do with their colour. Equally, I think there are black wrestlers currently in and around AEW that could be in the near future if they take a similar course that the above have taken over the next year or two. As an aside, do you really think if someone like Big E had been released instead of say, Malakai, that AEW wouldn't have immediately rolled out the red carpet for him? Then you aren't looking hard enough. Like, Ricky Starks is right there. When Impact and ROH are doing better, then yeah, AEW needs to step up. As for the question? I think they would because they know they lack of black main eventers (hence why Mark Henry is on a ton of posters when he barely does anything on screen). Same with Lashley (and he'd be with Lambert). |
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kidkamikaze10
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Post by kidkamikaze10 on Sept 10, 2021 12:59:48 GMT -5
Yeah...as a black man it's the biggest reason why I'm not fully in on AEW. I wanna see more black superstars. I said this was an issue when AEW started and years later while there's been progress, it's pretty clear they're not progressing fast enough. Same to a similar degree with other races but at least for them I'm seeing a lil bit of progress, just not much from my side. At the end of the day though, we just need a lot more minority representation. It's also, interestingly enough, the main reason why I keep up with WWE. You've got Lashley and MVP, Bianca, New Day, Hit Row, Sasha when she does her thing, upcoming guys in NXT, we can't forget Street Profits, I'm seeing way more diversity there. Before anyone comes with a "well a lot of these stars were known before" then lemme tell you that it took Bianca a few months to be a main eventer. AEW has been studying the landscape for a while and the fact it's taken them years just seems weird. Maybe they weren't studying hard enough, maybe they didn't care hard enough but it's surely a big mark. I'll keep it a buck: I'm never gonna be fully 100% in on AEW until this representation issue is settled. As someone who was the only black kid in my 4th grade class, watching all of this is cool and all but I don't see anyone who a younger me can go "man he's like me and he's doing it big." We got Hobbs, we got Lee M. who was just signed but that's far different than turning on WWE and seeing Lashley ruling, Hit Row, New Day being funny, Big E doing his thing, Bianca, it's just a different world. What AEW needs to do is look at all of their minorities there and think "alright, we've talked about diversity so much in that first year and yet we haven't done enough, it's time to do it" and start booking things accordingly. It's just such a huge divide between white talent and people of color that it's jarring at times. Like when I saw that segment at the end with The Elite and Bryan coming out I was thinking "yeah this is cool and all but man", I don't know. They've got people who believe in diversity such as Cody, Brandi and even Tony himself so we will see what they can do. That's just my opinion on it. If people don't get it then tbh I don't expect em to. To this day a lot of people didn't see nor understand the whole racism stuff in Kofi's WM storyline so I'm not surprise. One positive is that this has been a huge topic over the past week on social media. Whether it's fans, wrestlers, former writers, those in hip-hop, more people are noticing this, seeing this and more are chiming in so the more it happens, the bigger and sooner change will come. I just hope it comes soon. You aren't the only one feeling this way, as you said. It's a roadblock, one WWE partially caused by taking up all of that black talent away during the hiring rush. |
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Post by Ronny Rayguns Is All Elite on Sept 10, 2021 13:01:15 GMT -5
I mean, this is the same AEW that has had the likes of QT Marshall, 2.0, and Daniel Garcia at the top of the card not too long ago. Among other young talent. If we don't question them, why question the black wrestlers? I don't think any of the above could be considered 'at the top of the card'. QT had a fairly prominent feud with Cody, but even that was more to build up the match with Ogogo and since then he's lost basically every high profile match he's been in. Same for 2.0 and Garcia (who while we're at it, is a 'person of colour' not to mention a wrestling prodigy), while they've been put in prominent positions recently, they've not exactly been on a winning streak, nor have they had the show built around them. 2.0 are the rare, HIGH PROFILE Goobers. They showed up after getting cut by WWE and were quickly involved in segments with Sting, Darby, Mox, Kingston, and Punk, and for the most part were made to look like CLOWNS time after time. They're secure in their role of showing their ass and making other people look good. On paper this period will probably be the high point of their career, but it's not exactly something to aspire to if you're an up and coming wrestler. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 10, 2021 13:02:00 GMT -5
I'll admit it's an assumption on my part that the Hispanic looking guy with the Hispanic name is at least in part Hispanic haha. Happy to take it back if it turns out otherwise though Oh no your more than likely right just by the process of elimination in his family tree but it was an addition on your part that made me curious. That article I linked above (https://prowrestlingpost.com/the-jarkaster-journey-red-death-daniel-garcia/) from 2018 states that his favorite wrestler growing up was Hulk Hogan as "Mr. America" and that he played ALOT of hockey but nothing relating to his actual heritage. Hockey isn't usually attributed to poc either but isn't unheard of obviously. |
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Post by Feargus McReddit on Sept 10, 2021 13:07:56 GMT -5
I have no real “dog” in this fight because, well, if we’re talking about representation, I’m fine (unless we get an out asexual Autistic wrestler and I don’t trust the business to do that well AT ALL) but I think because the company is still young, it’s good that people are still asking for that.
And yeah, credit where it’s due, they’re making the pickups that could craft their future, Moriarty felt like someone was going to get him sooner rather than later so he’s a great addition, but you sort of want to see that at least being set up soon to make people have a sense of where the future is going. Dante Martin getting a push is a good start and when Darius comes back, they’ll make a hell of a feud for Lucha Bros. I sort of hope that Omega losing the belt is the catalyst for the Hobbs push that’s needed because, really, that’s the belt that makes sense for him to aim for.
The talent is out there too, as well. ROH is likely going to sign Trish Adora to a full time contract and there’s people like Darius Lockheart and Suge still out there who can do stuff so it’s not like WWE and MLW (Calvin Tankman was one of the first big acquisitions after AEW started, after all) signed everyone and that was it.
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Post by The Captain on Sept 10, 2021 13:09:12 GMT -5
Being Hispanic or Latinx doesn't necessarily mean you're a person of color, either. Hell, Cody is Latino through his mom and dude's white as anyone.
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Post by Viking Hall on Sept 10, 2021 13:12:23 GMT -5
C'mon man, don't play it like that. I'll happily say that there's not a black wrestler currently on the level of the people you've stated, and that has absolutely nothing to do with their colour. Equally, I think there are black wrestlers currently in and around AEW that could be in the near future if they take a similar course that the above have taken over the next year or two. As an aside, do you really think if someone like Big E had been released instead of say, Malakai, that AEW wouldn't have immediately rolled out the red carpet for him? Then you aren't looking hard enough. Like, Ricky Starks is right there. When Impact and ROH are doing better, then yeah, AEW needs to step up. As for the question? I think they would because they know they lack of black main eventers (hence why Mark Henry is on a ton of posters when he barely does anything on screen). Same with Lashley (and he'd be with Lambert). Okay. Although I agree that Starks is someone that I definitely see having a great future, but equally is someone that's been consistently elevated since his arrival. Great win/loss record, has had a stable pretty much built around him, technically a title holder and gets regular TV time. Which is exactly what people are asking for. I have no doubt that by this time next year (barring injuries etc) that he'll be higher up the card than he is now. |
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Post by carp (SPC, Itoh Respect Army) on Sept 10, 2021 13:13:11 GMT -5
I honestly don't understand how any singles wrestler can possibly be elevated at ALL with this roster. Every level is so clogged, who could move up? They've gotten like over a dozen guys and women elevated up the card in the 2 years they've been on tv? Not really. Who do you mean? Anyway, the main event scene has never mean nearly as clogged up as it is now. |
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Post by rnrk supports BLM on Sept 10, 2021 13:19:47 GMT -5
The "gosh, AEW just doesn't have any PoC talent who could fit in the main events right now" defense always gets brought up in these threads, and it really isn't the winning argument folks think it is, three years into the company. I can watch WWE, Impact, RoH, MLW, all companies of wildly different sizes and monetary resources backing up what talent they can bring in, yet strangely, none of them have this problem. This is a uniquely AEW problem. Why is that?
Brian Pullman Jr was enhancement talent when he started, has steadily been featured and built up, and just got positioned as a rival to top guy MJF this week. What similar young PoC talent has gotten any sort of opportunity on that level? Hell, some of the rare promising young PoC talent they've got has been moved in the opposite direction; Private Party went from a major tag team to Matt Hardy's flunkies. Will Hobbs was set up teaming with Moxley early on, and hasn't come close to that level since. Even the Lucha Bros, good on them finally getting the tag titles, but we're talking about guys who were main eventing All In-- the event where they had to actually worry about who was popular without a money mark sugar daddy-- who were arguably as big stars as the Bucks when this company started, and who've never once been presented as anywhere close to that level on AEW since then.
And this is the promotion that made the time for Shawn Spears to score a winning pin on this week's Dynamite, and a singles match for QT Marshall at their big PPV. Don't act like there's no spots.
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clifford
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Post by clifford on Sept 10, 2021 13:20:54 GMT -5
They've gotten like over a dozen guys and women elevated up the card in the 2 years they've been on tv? Not really. Who do you mean? Anyway, the main event scene has never mean nearly as clogged up as it is now. Darby Jungle Boy Luchasaurus OC Britt John Silver (Dark Order as a whole really) Eddie Kingston Kris Statlander Will Hobbs Jade Cargill Ricky Starks Dante Martin Sammy Guevara Wardlow MJF Are all imo more over, taken more seriously, and higher on the card than when they started with AEW. |
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06vwgti
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Post by 06vwgti on Sept 10, 2021 13:24:32 GMT -5
Yeah...as a black man it's the biggest reason why I'm not fully in on AEW. I wanna see more black superstars in leading spots. I said this was an issue when AEW started and years later while there's been little progress, it's little and it's pretty clear they're not progressing fast enough. Same to a similar degree with other races although I'm happy when people like the Lucha Bros get their shine as rightfully deserved. At the end of the day though, we just need a lot more minority representation. The last part is correct, but I just don't want it at the expense at other underrepresented groups which is what my concern is when people discuss diversity,. Always feels like it comes down to discussing only in black and white terms while ignoring the others. As someone that is neither black or white, is something I noticed when discussing race matters when you don't fit either narrative people want and those at both ends go completely silent when its mentioned or move goalposts. And with AEW, at least I feel everyone is actually treated less of an actual stereotype which in my opinion is why I continue to have any doubts of WWE handling most Asian wrestlers correctly (and I like how Ali and Nakamura have been handled). They've done better, but still. |
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Post by Texas Tornado on Sept 10, 2021 13:30:24 GMT -5
As a black fan, the only thing that really rubbed me the wrong way with AEW was them seemingly having an endless supply of black folks to be jobbers during the pandemic shows. I know that it was a product of the Nightmare Factory being available, but it was a weird look considering how their main event scene is all white. I'm not TOO bothered by the main event demographics now since I can see someone like Jade Cargill becoming a star very soon, but it is still a problem. Riho and Shida were pretty good draws that have gone missing from the show by and large.
I will say that it disappointed me that AEW couldn't get Swerve when he was available. I know that NXT was in a different place at the time and had more to offer him, but man, that dude is a star and a half and I know he would've done a lot for AEW if they signed him (both in front of and behind the camera).
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Post by The Captain on Sept 10, 2021 13:41:31 GMT -5
Suge D seems happy to do his own thing in the indies while doing spots in larger promotions every so often. He's going to be on the "I Can't Imagine This Not Being A Disaster" Jericho Cruise later this year, too.
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Post by Ronny Rayguns Is All Elite on Sept 10, 2021 13:46:10 GMT -5
Brian Pullman Jr was enhancement talent when he started, has steadily been featured and built up, and just got positioned as a rival to top guy MJF this week. What similar young PoC talent has gotten any sort of opportunity on that level? Hell, some of the rare promising young PoC talent they've got has been moved in the opposite dire Brian Pillman Jr has heavily benefited from being Brian Pillman's son and the recent DSOTR episode which bought him a LOT of attention and good will from the fans for how he came across in spite of everything that happened. This feud with MJF is built around details from that show. If it wasn't for that I doubt he'd be where he is right now. Once he was actually signed, Hobbs got a nice rub pretty quickly from being aligned with Mox and Allin against Team Taz before turning heel. I vaguely remember there was a main event 6 man match shaping up before having to be canceled due to Darby(?) getting injured. I don't know if the plan from the beginning was to have Hobbs join Team Taz or if they had to call an audible, although I think he has a higher ceiling as a heel anyway. |
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Post by "American Cream" Dusty Loads on Sept 10, 2021 13:48:00 GMT -5
Being Hispanic or Latinx doesn't necessarily mean you're a person of color, either. Hell, Cody is Latino through his mom and dude's white as anyone. Yeah, my father’s Puerto Rican and his father was a POC, as are most of my cousins and even though I consider myself Latin as f***, I’m still white as hell lol. Back on topic: I haven’t kept up with wrestling at all since the pandemic started, only just popped back in with Punk being back and yeah, I was a little shocked to see WWE of all places having a much more diverse card than AEW. Hopefully they get their shit together, Big Swole in particular should be one of their main attractions. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 10, 2021 13:49:50 GMT -5
Yeah...as a black man it's the biggest reason why I'm not fully in on AEW. I wanna see more black superstars in leading spots. I said this was an issue when AEW started and years later while there's been little progress, it's little and it's pretty clear they're not progressing fast enough. Same to a similar degree with other races although I'm happy when people like the Lucha Bros get their shine as rightfully deserved. At the end of the day though, we just need a lot more minority representation. The last part is correct, but I just don't want it at the expense at other underrepresented groups which is what my concern is when people discuss diversity,. Always feels like it comes down to discussing only in black and white terms while ignoring the others. As someone that is neither black or white, is something I noticed when discussing race matters when you don't fit either narrative people want and those at both ends go completely silent when its mentioned or move goalposts. And with AEW, at least I feel everyone is actually treated less of an actual stereotype which in my opinion is why I continue to have any doubts of WWE handling most Asian wrestlers correctly (and I like how Ali and Nakamura have been handled). They've done better, but still. Right. Everybody needs to be represented correctly in all races. I'm black so I'm speaking from my perspective mostly but with that said I do think that whether you're Hispanic, black, hell you can be purple whatever, you can be from Mars. At the end of the day you're someone who represents a group of people. It's bigger than black wrestlers and white wrestlers, I'm just speaking from my POV because I can't speak on anyone else's. AEW, even if there might be less stereotypes (to a degree) from a black perspective when I see Hit Row, New Day, Lashley, Bianca, Street Profits, Sasha, they're not stereotypes, they're legit people who I've seen all my life and that's a far greater thing that I love to see compared to the Cryme Tyme days. Once we see more black wrestlers in great positions with a multitude of characters in AEW I'll love it but that just isn't now. As for WWE and Asian wrestlers, they're still behind the times when it comes to how they're mostly portrayed. Even subtle things like Asuka speaking Japanese and other wrestlers looking "confused and disgusted" is incredibly nasty. It took years before they finally did black wrestlers correctly so needless to say it'll take years before others are done amazingly well too. |
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Post by honsou on Sept 10, 2021 13:57:40 GMT -5
I think long term getting Hobbs in the main event needs to be a priority. He has a great look and him throwing people around is supremely entertaining, he's also the guy who people will buy as a main eventer the quickest.
I would say that their next major signing from WWE should be someone like the New Day or ricochet when they come up but one thing I've found that's interesting is that we are consistently seeing POC free agents either stay with WWE or choose WWE from the beginning. As bad as WWE has been they have been willing to give main event pushes to POC wrestlers, which is going to give them a leg up on AEW when signing talented wrestlers.
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Post by Ronny Rayguns Is All Elite on Sept 10, 2021 13:59:57 GMT -5
Darby John Silver (Dark Order as a whole really) Eddie Kingston Kris Statlander Will Hobbs Jade CargillRicky Starks Dante Martin Sammy Guevara Wardlow MJF Are all imo more over, taken more seriously, and higher on the card than when they started with AEW. This thread seems to be mainly focused on the male half of the roster, but I really do think they've done a LOT to build up Jade Cargill, use her correctly and hide her weaknesses as a relatively inexperienced wrestler She made her debut in a segment where she pretty much bitched out Cody Rhodes. Had a feud with Cody leading to her debut match teaming up with Shaq that ended up being WAY better than it had any right to be and ended up getting mainstream attention because of Shaq's involvement. To a lesser extent, Red Velvet who was also in this match has had some high profile matches this year Since then she's gotten promo time pretty consistently, and mostly been used in squash matches/battle royals where she can look impressive. |
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Post by Killah Ray on Sept 10, 2021 14:01:20 GMT -5
I have no clue when Chris Bey's contract ends with Impact, but when it does he should have both the E and AEW banging down his door....
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