pinja
Unicron
Posts: 3,002
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Post by pinja on Feb 4, 2022 15:00:43 GMT -5
I don't like MCU and DC movies, period. But I never stumbled into a discussion about those, so whatever stranglehold they have on the blockbuster industry, it seemingly doesn't translate to the broader picture of pop culture. That's good for me, I guess, but I pity a generation that doesn't experience the same all-encompassing cultural phenomenon that was something like Titanic. Somehow superhero movies today are both more successful and less successful than blockbusters of the past.
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Post by HMARK Center on Feb 4, 2022 15:57:21 GMT -5
I dunno that original IP stuff wouldn't get made at all, it's just gonna be way more likely to be a show and on streaming now. Part of it is absolutely capitalism&part is just how people watch stuff has changed. It's possible, but the odds are pretty high the budgets wouldn't be great for them (comparatively speaking) and there's still a world of difference between a movie getting a wide release with strong studio backing and advertising versus a film essentially getting dropped on a streaming service and potentially getting gobbled up by the algorithm. There's actually a report out that the next Pixar movie, Turning Red, will be dropped directly onto Disney+; it'll mark the third straight Pixar movie not getting a theatrical release. Obviously some of that comes from recent films having to contend with pandemic times (Onward was released basically the day everything shut down in the US in March 2020). Meantime Spider-man and Encanto have gotten wide release and made major bank and cultural waves, but Luca, Soul, and now Turning Red will all go straight to streaming, and reports are that people within Pixar are pretty devastated about it...hell, and this is happening while films from other animated companies are getting wide release, e.g. Illumination schlock like Sing 2. There's aspects of streaming I enjoy (real hot take comin' through on that one, eh?), but so much of what's going down these days brings me back to how I felt when Netflix first started killing off video rental stores; the odds of stumbling onto a hidden gem of a film just feel so much smaller these days than way back when, when you could go into your local rental place and see a "Staff's Recommendations" rack or something or just stumble on a weird looking VHS/DVD cover that makes you shrug and decide to give it a shot. The odds of something like, say, Back to the Future getting green lit, made well, released with hype, executed well, and then gaining a strong audience and real cultural foothold just feel so infinitesimally small...an exaggeration, I realize, but some of the exception films that have actually managed to get some attention while not being big tentpoles of late really do feel like just that, exceptions.
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Post by eJm on Feb 4, 2022 15:58:20 GMT -5
That's good for me, I guess, but I pity a generation that doesn't experience the same all-encompassing cultural phenomenon that was something like Titanic. Eh, I’m sort of fine with that I think. Gives more industries time to flourish in different ways, anime likely wouldn’t have boomed the way it did if there was one big juggernaut of a blockbuster taking up screen and media time. In a weird way, I feel like it makes us more unique as people. Demon Slayer can be a big success in cinemas and besides the fact it’s an anime film based on a TV series, I have no context of the franchise or anything else about it because I have my own thing that’s doing well. Stuff we can share and talk about instead of “Did you see that big thing?” “Yeah…”
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Post by eJm on Feb 4, 2022 16:10:19 GMT -5
There's aspects of streaming I enjoy (real hot take comin' through on that one, eh?), but so much of what's going down these days brings me back to how I felt when Netflix first started killing off video rental stores; the odds of stumbling onto a hidden gem of a film just feel so much smaller these days than way back when, when you could go into your local rental place and see a "Staff's Recommendations" rack or something or just stumble on a weird looking VHS/DVD cover that makes you shrug and decide to give it a shot. The odds of something like, say, Back to the Future getting green lit, made well, released with hype, executed well, and then gaining a strong audience and real cultural foothold just feel so infinitesimally small...an exaggeration, I realize, but some of the exception films that have actually managed to get some attention while not being big tentpoles of late really do feel like just that, exceptions. To add to this, the stuff that does slide under the radar is stuff that doesn’t really get promoted much even though the quality of it can be really good. Like, one of my favourite cartoons of the last, say, 5 years is Twelve Forever, about a young girl who is able to travel to a dimension where she’s seen as a hero and has to counter that with growing up and the changes that comes. Netflix did not promote the show much and thus, nobody watched it and thus, it got axed on a cliffhanger. It’s not the only show this has happened to (so much so it’s become a meme) but it’s one of those things that you have to have the right energy behind it from those up top and you’ll have to find a niche to stumble into. Hilda had that and others did but…well, the playing field isn’t fair for a lot of stuff. Did I mention Twelve Forever has a character called Butt Witch played by Matt Berry? Do you see why I’m still bitter about that now?
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Post by A Platypus Rave on Feb 4, 2022 16:17:16 GMT -5
You could argue End Game is on that same level as Titanic... it was everywhere on it's release. and you can state it's not just because you didn't see it but like not everyone saw Titanic either?
But as I've been saying that there are so many avenues for so many different types of entertainment it's hard to count anything as mainstream.
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Post by eJm on Feb 4, 2022 16:39:07 GMT -5
You could argue End Game is on that same level as Titanic... it was everywhere on it's release. and you can state it's not just because you didn't see it but like not everyone saw Titanic either? But as I've been saying that there are so many avenues for so many different types of entertainment it's hard to count anything as mainstream. I will say the last time I remember something being everywhere was Pokémon since I remember stuff promoting stuff related to it was even in magazines like Good Housekeeping because they knew they had kids who would be interested. That likely wouldn’t happen because that wouldn’t be how you target people for stuff in that market. But like you said, there are very few things that are wide encompassing and whether that’s a good or bad thing, that’s up to you.
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Post by Kevin Hamilton on Feb 4, 2022 17:06:15 GMT -5
I firmly believe Endgame was probably the last GLOBAL movie theater experience. Movie theaters are going to become more and more niche as tvs continue to get cheaper, movies stream instantly etc. That was already in the process of happening technology wise. Covid just helped it speed along.
I know Spider-man just made a shitload of money, but I'm talking this kind of global impact something like an Endgame or a Titanic had.
I can understand the frustration on finding a hidden gem like in the old VHS days and agree with that. But our frustration hasn't/won't stop the way things are progressing.
Within a generation, maybe two, people are going to be experiencing entertainment completely differently than even in the early 2000s
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Post by Terry McConkey on Feb 4, 2022 17:12:40 GMT -5
I miss seeing the type of movies I like, which just don't make money for anyone. Mostly stoner flicks like Pineapple Express, which would never be made again thanks to James Franco's creepiness. I love stoner movies. I assume everyone assumes I’m a stoner but once a year would be frequent for me. The last "stoner" movie I saw in theatres was Clerks 2 and it's been too damn long. I saw Pineapple Express on DVD first so it doesn't count.I stick with streaming services if something new is coming out that's exclusive to such and such.
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Post by Terry McConkey on Feb 4, 2022 17:15:37 GMT -5
I went and saw Ghostbusters. I’ll probably go see Bob Burgers. After that, I suspect the next movie will be Jurassic World and then….I’ll probably never go to the movies again because I don’t think there’s a single one I have any interest in seeing. I can’t f***ing wait until this superhero fad finally dies. I enjoy them speak for yourself. I like high art cinema and CBM. Theres room for both and there's no need for gatekeeping on both sides So, having an opinion on anything is now considered gatekeeping?
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Post by A Platypus Rave on Feb 4, 2022 17:34:11 GMT -5
I firmly believe Endgame was probably the last GLOBAL movie theater experience. Movie theaters are going to become more and more niche as tvs continue to get cheaper, movies stream instantly etc. That was already in the process of happening technology wise. Covid just helped it speed along. I know Spider-man just made a shitload of money, but I'm talking this kind of global impact something like an Endgame or a Titanic had. I can understand the frustration on finding a hidden gem like in the old VHS days and agree with that. But our frustration hasn't/won't stop the way things are progressing. Within a generation, maybe two, people are going to be experiencing entertainment completely differently than even in the early 2000s Yeah, I've said it before I have a relative in the production side of entertainment... and they've been scrambling for years to figure out how to keep the old model of doing things a float... many of them finally realized that you can't the genie is out of the bottle and the old way of doing things is going to die out pretty quickly. (of course there are some that are stuck on the nah everything will go back to the way it was so why do anything.)
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agent817
Fry's dog Seymour
Doesn't Know Whose Ring It Is
Posts: 21,243
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Post by agent817 on Feb 4, 2022 17:41:42 GMT -5
I firmly believe Endgame was probably the last GLOBAL movie theater experience. Movie theaters are going to become more and more niche as tvs continue to get cheaper, movies stream instantly etc. That was already in the process of happening technology wise. Covid just helped it speed along. I know Spider-man just made a shitload of money, but I'm talking this kind of global impact something like an Endgame or a Titanic had. I can understand the frustration on finding a hidden gem like in the old VHS days and agree with that. But our frustration hasn't/won't stop the way things are progressing. Within a generation, maybe two, people are going to be experiencing entertainment completely differently than even in the early 2000s We are so far removed from the early-2000s that I am certain that people back then wouldn't have grasped the idea of streaming video, especially since dial-up was still common during that time. Hell, Netflix during the late-2000s still had the mail-order delivery service. I am one of those people who still prefers the theatrical experience. I haven't fully crossed over to the idea of streaming things from home, despite having done so. It wasn't my first choice, but I have done it. It says a lot that I went to watch movies that were streaming on Netflix and HBO Max in theaters, including Netflix movies such as Army of the Dead, Red Notice, and Don't Look Up. I guess I haven't crossed over, despite some people telling me that it's better to watch at home.
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Post by A Platypus Rave on Feb 4, 2022 17:45:31 GMT -5
I'm not sure if it's "better" but in my experiences watching movies at home...
it's a hell of a lot cheaper, the food is better, the seating can be more comfortable (depends on the theater really), and you can't top the convenience of being able to pause it if you have to run to take a piss >_>
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Post by eJm on Feb 4, 2022 17:49:45 GMT -5
I'm not sure if it's "better" but in my experiences watching movies at home... it's a hell of a lot cheaper, the food is better, the seating can be more comfortable (depends on the theater really), and you can't top the convenience of being able to pause it if you have to run to take a piss >_> What would be a nice counteraction to movies being longer is to have intermissions. I saw the 4K version of Laurence of Arabia many years ago as a member of the press (mostly because I had never seen it before so might as well use it as an excuse) and even though we weren’t allowed the intermission time the patrons would get at the festival (they had about 30 minutes and we had barely 10 because f*** us film reviewers), it was sort of nice to have it, you know.
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Post by HMARK Center on Feb 4, 2022 17:50:48 GMT -5
I enjoy them speak for yourself. I like high art cinema and CBM. Theres room for both and there's no need for gatekeeping on both sides So, having an opinion on anything is now considered gatekeeping? The problem isn't disliking comic book movies or their effect on the overall movie landscape, it's when people come off as blaming the state of affairs on their neighbors/fellow moviegoers instead of where the blame really lies: on a marketplace run wild where entertainment conglomerates have merged and monopolized to such an extreme that Disney is now beyond trying to compete with other movie studios and is instead attempt to stand toe-to-toe with friggin' telecom companies like AT&T itself. "Gatekeeping" is when there are people who come off as blaming regular folks for the situation we're in; we all do bear some responsibility in all of this, as markets do bend at least on some level towards what consumers will spend money on, but the issues at hand that have created the current "pre-established franchise or bust" mentality are so large and so structural in nature that it isn't worth getting annoyed at people for, say, liking No Way Home and spending money to go see it. It'd be like blaming people for only opting for Coke or Pepsi; there are other brands out there that could break up the monotony, but how far out of the way is it even reasonable to expect people to go to seek out the alternatives? If someone genuinely enjoys what's available to them, I can't resent them for that; I save my annoyance or anger for the economic structures and incentives that have brought us to a place where it's seen as overall a good thing for, say, Disney to acquire the movie rights to the X-Men or something, and those structures are far beyond what almost any of us as individuals can control.
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lucas_lee
Hank Scorpio
Heel turn is finished, now stripping away my personality
Posts: 6,722
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Post by lucas_lee on Feb 4, 2022 17:57:13 GMT -5
I enjoy them speak for yourself. I like high art cinema and CBM. Theres room for both and there's no need for gatekeeping on both sides So, having an opinion on anything is now considered gatekeeping? No its gatekeeping when folks shame people that like CBM and keep telling the fans of the MCU they're contributing to the downfall of cinema. Its why they received a lot of backlash from MCU fans. I dont have a problem with an opinion but praying and wanting something that people enjoy to die because you don't like is messed up. Like I hate WWE but they're not booking for me, I'm not gonna pray it dies and ruin the folks who actually like it
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Post by King Boo on Feb 4, 2022 17:57:37 GMT -5
To add another perspective that maybe hasn't been talked about (I admit to skimming and not reading every letter): If I'm going to go and spend money on a ticket, I want to be at least somewhat sure I'm not going to walk away feeling like I wasted $15. My money isn't unlimited, much like most everyone else, you know? And frankly, as of late, the only movies out there that I feel pretty certain I'll walk away happy with whatever time and money I spent on them are MCU ones. They're a fun, colorful world I can get lost in for 2+ hours. It's a safe bet.
So yeah, when money's a factor, I'm going to go with what I know I'll enjoy. I'd guess a lot of people are like that.
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agent817
Fry's dog Seymour
Doesn't Know Whose Ring It Is
Posts: 21,243
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Post by agent817 on Feb 4, 2022 18:02:31 GMT -5
I'm not sure if it's "better" but in my experiences watching movies at home... it's a hell of a lot cheaper, the food is better, the seating can be more comfortable (depends on the theater really), and you can't top the convenience of being able to pause it if you have to run to take a piss >_> I get that, but then you have people who want theaters to die and such. Some people take things a little too far, in my opinion. Granted, I always go to the bathroom before watching a movie in theaters, and I hardly buy concessions, anyway. The last movie I saw in theaters that had an intermission was The Hateful Eight, but it was the roadshow version with the overture and such. It was a fun experience.
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Post by A Platypus Rave on Feb 4, 2022 18:04:49 GMT -5
To add another perspective that maybe hasn't been talked about (I admit to skimming and not reading every letter): If I'm going to go and spend money on a ticket, I want to be at least somewhat sure I'm not going to walk away feeling like I wasted $15. My money isn't unlimited, much like most everyone else, you know? And frankly, as of late, the only movies out there that I feel pretty certain I'll walk away happy with whatever time and money I spent on them are MCU ones. They're a fun, colorful world I can get lost in for 2+ hours. It's a safe bet. So yeah, when money's a factor, I'm going to go with what I know I'll enjoy. I'd guess a lot of people are like that. Yeah, as I mentioned in my thing on watching from home... Movie tickets are f***ing expensive, depending on what theater I go to they can be anywhere from 15 to like 25 bucks each... if I'm going to the theater with my brother and father (who I see a lot of films with) it's an easy 60 bucks for tickets... assuming we don't buy snacks anywhere... or don't then go get food afterwards... but usually we do so it's almost guaranteed that we're going to spend $100+ (and add more to that if my Mom wants to join us at any point.)
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agent817
Fry's dog Seymour
Doesn't Know Whose Ring It Is
Posts: 21,243
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Post by agent817 on Feb 4, 2022 18:08:32 GMT -5
To add another perspective that maybe hasn't been talked about (I admit to skimming and not reading every letter): If I'm going to go and spend money on a ticket, I want to be at least somewhat sure I'm not going to walk away feeling like I wasted $15. My money isn't unlimited, much like most everyone else, you know? And frankly, as of late, the only movies out there that I feel pretty certain I'll walk away happy with whatever time and money I spent on them are MCU ones. They're a fun, colorful world I can get lost in for 2+ hours. It's a safe bet. So yeah, when money's a factor, I'm going to go with what I know I'll enjoy. I'd guess a lot of people are like that. Yeah, as I mentioned in my thing on watching from home... Movie tickets are f***ing expensive, depending on what theater I go to they can be anywhere from 15 to like 25 bucks each... if I'm going to the theater with my brother and father (who I see a lot of films with) it's an easy 60 bucks for tickets... assuming we don't buy snacks anywhere... or don't then go get food afterwards... but usually we do so it's almost guaranteed that we're going to spend $100+ (and add more to that if my Mom wants to join us at any point.) One thing that I forgot to add in my previous post is that I also mostly go alone and during the day.
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Post by Cyno on Feb 4, 2022 18:20:27 GMT -5
So, having an opinion on anything is now considered gatekeeping? No its gatekeeping when folks shame people that like CBM and keep telling the fans of the MCU they're contributing to the downfall of cinema. Its why they received a lot of backlash from MCU fans. I dont have a problem with an opinion but praying and wanting something that people enjoy to die because you don't like is messed up. Like I hate WWE but they're not booking for me, I'm not gonna pray it dies and ruin the folks who actually like it
Yeah, even if the haters get their wish and comic book movies die a horrible death, the movie industry will just move on to the next trend. It's not going to suddenly result in a new golden age of budget-diverse film making. It's going to be more of the same with different window dressing.
This is also why Roland Emmerich is so full of shit about this. He doesn't give a damn about comic book movies crowding out the market. He's just jealous that he was part of the previous "Disaster Movie" blockbuster trend that got phased out and hasn't been invited to be a part of this one.
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